ElectricMotorcycleForum.com

Limited to small file size so I please see the photo album for more photos https://photos.app.goo.gl/eg4nGj5nCzyR1wiP7
I did consider mounting one under the tank (I would have to modify the storage compartment but it fits). I included those photos for reference of size.

Quote from: Moto7575 on August 30, 2022, 02:50:21 PM

Thanks a lot ! Do you have a study supporting this and comparing many charge cycle options ? I would like to know what i save to see if it is woth doing it !

I mean... you can literally cite tables 2 and 4 from the original study you linked for confirmation. Just apply the data to a Zero pouch and extrapolate that into pack values. For example, in Table 4, take any of the cell voltage values and multiply them by 28, because Zero packs are in a 28S configuration.

4.2 x 28 = 117.6 <-- this is beyond Zero's allowed voltage. They soft cap their cells at 4.157vdc
4.15 x 28 = 116.2 <-- basically 98% on a Zero
...
...
3.9 x 28 = 109.2 <-- ~79% on a Zero
3.65 x 28 = 102.2 <-- 50% on a Zero
...
...
all the way down to
3.39 x 28 = 94.92 <-- empty Zero

I own a 2022 Zero S (picked up in Jun 2022 with 30 miles and now I have 2700 miles) and there is no automatic method to charge to only 80% like there appears to be on SR models and above. I have flow model helicopters for 16 years and am pretty familiar with Lipos they use. My model batteries live a hard life (4.5-5ah 6-12s setups) and last 3-5 years which is much higher than most in the hobby, very often they are asked to deliver 150+ amps during spikes and average 45-65amps over a 3-8 minute flight. I charge up to 4.15v per cell (95% in this case) and run them to about 3.77v per cell (30% in this case) between the speed controller info (amps/volts) we can calculate ah consumption then compare it to when we charge. This method has worked well for me for 10+ years now. I have been researching the internet to find more information on NMC batteries. I am happy to see that Zero cuts off @ 95% charge state. When this example above states "all the way down to 3.39 x 28 = 94.92 <-- empty Zero" What is 3.39v per cell? Is that 20%, 30%, 40% remaining of the battery? I haven't found any good voltage charts to show. I completely understand voltage isn't an exact method, but if you let the battery sit and stabilize it's a decent indicator.

My overall concern is when/if I run my battery down and I only get 30 miles can I purchase a new one from Zero? Do they offer anything like this, my research says no. Many thanks to all the folks that have taken the time to provide information here and via youtube videos, super helpful.

If I ride my Zero S "7.2" like a motorcycle for fun I get 40-45 miles (I'm 250lbs this is in 60-degree weather) If I really, really, really try to be as efficient as possible and not get run over doing 35mph roads doing the speed limit I can get 70-80 miles. Mixed (60mph max) and 35mph roads pretty equally split I can get 55 miles. I've reached out to Zero with these questions but don't get any answers. I bought my bike with 7 charge cycles and I currently have 92. I am in Missouri outside of St. Louis so chargers can be challenging to find along any route. I am a techy nerd so I am always tracking ride data and so far I see no indication of degration but perhaps I don't know where to look. I do have logs I pull monthly so I can track any differences.

Quote from: Pard on November 18, 2022, 03:02:05 AM

Every single modification implemented has been Zero factory parts or completely reasonable and reversible items such as swapping out brake master cylinders.  I can revert it all to bone stock in 2 hrs.

Nothing I have done would impact warranty at all.

In any case, that did not even come up in the conversation with the dealer.

The zero website says 40 miles at 70 mph.  Cannot be done.

60 miles at 55mph cannot be done.

I get 50 miles at an average speed of 40mph.

Very misleading (fraudulent) performance claims by Zero.


Fun bike, but misleading advertising by the company.  Materially misleading and a case for fraud.

As far as the dealer goes, absolutely unreasonable IMHO for them not to buy back my stock configured FXE at a 25% loss to me , towards a trade in for another brand new Zero S at full retail price.

I am taking all the losses here.

They can then go ahead and make profit on my initial FXE purchase, on the sale of the same FXE as a used bike, and then profit off a sale of a new S to me again.

Or, I can get the lemon law involved and see if they agree about the false advertising claims.

Do you really want to give money towards a 2nd bike to a dealer and a company that you have this experience with? I wouldn't....

So I've been lurking for some time and using the info here (Thanks). In June of 2022 I test-rode several Zero's as did my buddy (all his fault for taking me there). I ended up buying a 2022 S and he purchased the 2022 FXE

Dealer, oh yeah same drivetrain and charger in each......
Boy was he disappointed when he realized it took 9 hours for his vs 5 for mine.
We completely were blinded by shiny new motorcycles and didn't take our time to research (Our bad)
Since then We've both put 2600ish miles on each. I've spent a lot of time being the slowest of the slow pokes as well as enjoying it as one would expect to enjoy a motorcycle on twisted road/beautiful day.
example - https://go.rever.co/wQVctuVLDub
5:00 TOTAL TIME
23 AVG SPEED (MPH)
76.5 DISTANCE (MI)
3:08 MOVING TIME
49 TOP SPEED (MPH)
6967 ELEVATION (FT)

https://go.rever.co/xDEtROJ6Jub Twisty fun ride but still not earth-shattering
1:03 TOTAL TIME
42 AVG SPEED (MPH)
40.87 DISTANCE (MI)
0:57 MOVING TIME
71 TOP SPEED (MPH)
2931 ELEVATION (FT)

I will try to make the most out of this, I love the bike (Zero S) but I don't see ever purchasing another Zero or returning to the dealership I purchased it from. The range is a joke. The lack of information about the bike is miserable (battery info for example). The total lack of an affordable external charger over 1KW is unacceptable. While it's super useful to be able to plug into the wall the lack of a J-1772 connector to charge from is crazy for the money I paid for the motorcycle. For example the dealer it was purchased from doesn't have a normal exterior outlet but does have a level two charger in front of the car dealership. Now I have purchased the J-1772 adaptor but it leaves some serious holes in charging options (even if it's still slow, more outlet availability). I have reached out to Zero who told me to contact my dealership. I don't need a faster bike, but I would have bought a 14.4 kW Zero S over the 7.2 kW I have. I hope to use the Zero S for another 2 years or so, then hopefully there will be more options out there. 1st time ever I even considered a Harley, the Livewire Del Mar. I still think that might not have enough juice but it appears they actually meet their range expectations.

$12,000+ for a motorcycle and it can't even do more than 50 miles even being somewhat reserved? Never again Zero.
I just don't understand how you have a long-term business model running things like this. I can only imagine the challenges of bringing something like the Zero to market but getting people to sign on the dotted line while they are staring at something shiny only to turn around and tell everyone this thing doesn't live up to any of the hype can't last long.