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Messages - SgtMickle

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Regarding your accident, I’m  curious if the tires were cold?
I believe that contributed to one of my rear tire step out incidents. 

Good question. It was a warm day and I was riding around for some time that day before the slip, so the tires must've been pretty warm. However it was a *brand* new bike at the time, so the tires might not have been broken in yet.

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Rider error on my end, coming from inexperience on the bike and not-so-good judgement, was definitely a big part of why I crashed. I'm not trying to deny this, nor am I trying to shift blame from myself to the bike.

I am trying to make the point that what Zero did - having an electric bike this powerful without traction control, or any type of software assistance to deliver torque more safely on full throttle - is particularly dangerous. More so than people might think. I think that this is an important conversation to have, and important for people riding / considering electric bikes to be well aware of, as unfortunately I wasn't.

Sure I'm exaggerating when I call zeroes "death traps." But it does make sense to say that TC (or some degree of software assistance on the throttle) on high-torque electric bikes is especially important, and more so than gas bikes because of the nature of these vehicles. Rear-wheel slides from throttle is a common cause of crashes on electric as has been pointed out, and TC would no doubt save many riders of these bikes from crashes, injury, and death.

Like I said - I wasn't even cornering when I crashed, and the pavement was dry and seemingly free of debris. It simply happened because I asked for full throttle. It just doesn't seem to make sense to me to have a bike that can't handle the power of its own throttle.

3
Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ / Re: zero crash question
« on: December 28, 2020, 12:03:35 PM »
Zeroes are definitely prone to slideouts and highside crashes such as these, because of their lack of traction control combined with their extremely high and instantaneously available torque. See my latest post about that here. The only safe way to ride these things is in eco mode, which kills some of the fun by keeping the bike from giving you the full power when you crank the throttle.

4
I've seen a few posts from several years ago referencing this, but I wanted to bring it up again since it seems like a huge problem that more people should be talking about.

The Zero bikes are extremely powerful with very high torque (that's instantaneously available). With no traction control, they're prone to sliding out when given a lot of throttle, and even prone to highside crashes if the throttle is chopped mid-slide (see below for video examples). This differs from gas bikes with no TC, since a) the electric bikes generate much more torque than most such gas bikes, and b) the gas bikes build up torque gradually, rather than pumping it into the rear wheel instantaneously when the throttle is pinned like the zeroes do.

I fell victim to this recently - I was riding (seemingly perfectly straight!) on my 2021 SR, and when I pinned the throttle in sport mode, the bike just completely slid out from under me. I ended up in the hospital and the bike in the shop, and after it was repaired, I've kept it in eco mode (w/ reduced power) ever since. It seems like the bike can just lose traction from its own power, and it gives you absolutely nothing to protect against that.

Zero is selling death traps - to anyone considering, I'd strongly advise avoiding these bikes until they fix this. Go for an SR/S or SR/F, which do have TC, or choose another brand.

I'm very curious how many people this has already killed, since it seems to be a commonly reported occurrence among zeroers.

Here's some examples of this happening (you'll need to fix the spacing on the links):

Highside crash:
www . youtube.com/watch?v=fDtwUDnsHA0
www . youtube.com/watch?v=IhpA7Raj_Zc

"I only had it for three days... that is the first time I have ever crashed" (see 3:58):
www . youtube.com/watch?v=DPJyCjlYGXU

"I don't know what happened! ... It was just going in a straight line, and all of a sudden..." (see 17:16)
www . youtube.com/watch?v=QmSR0zuWubA&t=1036

Another:
www . youtube.com/watch?v=d1zcLltukUY

And then there was my own crash experience. Anyone else have something similar happen to them on a zero?

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