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Messages - tonylai

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If those measurements are correct then the back wheel may indeed be moving at a faster linear velocity. It might be losing grip and your traction control (if you had it) would need to kick in and reduce power to the rear wheel. The other option could be that the front wheel is in the air.  8)


Are those results with the wheels off the ground? As Fred said, if they're on the ground the calculated speed should be the same unless one of the wheels is losing traction. You don't really need to monitor the speed of both wheels anyway unless you're doing traction control, just pick one and use that for the speedometer like every other motorcycle does.


The electric motorcycle is indeed off the ground, but I've tried the road test, and the velocity is so fast that I can only turn the throttle for like 2 sec and the highest speed of both hub motor (if my A/D calculate is right) is about 335 RPM (22 km/hr).
So I can say that my motorcycle's velocity is 22km/hr?

2
Tech Help / Two wheel drive electric motorcycle speed calculation problem
« on: October 14, 2021, 08:22:51 PM »
I've built a electric motorcycle with two hub motors (no gear ratio) which are directly drive by two independent but same controllers and same throttle.
If throttle is turned, two wheels will be drive at the same time with same throttle signal but a little different speed due to the difference of the radius.
The front RPM and rear RPM are approximate but I don't know how to calculate the vehicle's speed by these two RPM since they are both driving.

Assume the front RPM is 246, radius is 0.24 meter, which the wheel's speed is equals to 22.25km/hr.
The rear RPM is 250, radius is 0.25 meter, which the wheel's speed is equals to 23.56km/hr.
Can the velocity of the electric motorcycle be 22.905km/hr?
If not, how can it be calculated?

Thanks for your reply!

3
Tech Help / Problems on throttle and motors
« on: July 21, 2021, 06:06:02 PM »
I'm using one throttle to active two controllers which control two hub motors that are support by two independent batteries but common ground.
There both has a switch between battery and controller.
The wiring is like: (sorry for the ugly drawing)

My problem is when I turn on the switch of Battery 2, which powers the Controller 2, the Motor 2 just start to speed up without spinning the throttle.
The problem won't happened if I turn on the switch of Battery 1.
Can anyone tell me why?

4
Tech Help / One throttle wiring two controllers on two batteries
« on: July 17, 2021, 07:51:07 PM »
As the title mentions, I'm using one throttle wiring two independent controllers with two batteries, and the batteries are not common ground.
I've seen some videos that use one throttle wiring two independent controllers but with one battery.
So the wiring of the throttle goes 5V GND SIGNAL to controller1 and SIGNAL to controller2.

But how about two batteries?
How should the throttle wired?

                                     (5V,GND,SIGNAL)           (5V,GND,SIGNAL)
Battery1-------Controller1--------------------throttle--------------------Controller2-------Battery2

OR

                                     (5V,GND,SIGNAL)           (SIGNAL)
Battery1-------Controller1--------------------throttle--------------------Controller2-------Battery2

OR

                                     (5V,GND,SIGNAL)           (GND,SIGNAL)
Battery1-------Controller1--------------------throttle--------------------Controller2-------Battery2

Thanks for your reply!!

5
Tech Help / Re: Two wheel drive electric motorcycle problem
« on: June 16, 2021, 02:26:04 PM »
It really depends on how much power / torque you are talking about, and what kind of traction control system will be implemented.  If you aren't pushing the limits of traction in most conditions issuing equal torque commands to front and rear motors is probably going to work out just fine.  Where you get into trouble is when you are climbing a steep hill (which gives the rear wheel much better traction) and are turning a corner where you need the front wheel to set your course,  if you apply too much torque to the front wheel and it starts slipping just to maintain straight travel, you will have very little control to initiate a turn and could lose balance.  If you are just making a utilitarian vehicle where you want to get the best traction in all cases and maybe the front spins and looses traction sometimes, but isn't that big of deal because you are going slow enough that you just put your feet down to prevent a fall,  like the Ubco 2X2 , you can probably just give equal torque commands to the front and rear and hope for the best.

-ryan

Actually, I am doing the research of building the TCS on electric motorcycle by using the formula of slip ratio calculation based on wheels angular speed.
The research will focus on how to keep the electric motorcycle in the best slip ratio while slipping or turning.
Since we know if it is a 2WD electric motorcycle, turning can cause the front wheel slip and losing control, and that is not what I want.
In order to achieve the goal, the front wheel and rear wheel power (or torque) distribution will be important for me.
I've seen the Ubco 2x2, but I'm not sure whether it gives the some torque commands to the front and rear.

Thanks for your reply!!

6
Tech Help / Re: Two wheel drive electric motorcycle problem
« on: June 16, 2021, 02:18:22 PM »

Horsepower output depends on the motor. 50:50 is easily achieved by using identical motors front and rear.
Define "best performance". Acceleration, speed, max power, torque? On what surface; road, track, asphalt, dirt, rocks?
Why not use two different motors and have high torque at rear and high speed at front? Gives you good acceleration and good speed. Then you can have the rear motor act as dynamo and charge the batteries at high speed for limitless range. (Just kidding, you can't  ;D)
[/quote]

The electric motorcycle already have two hub motor when I get it, the controller is what I'm building for.
The reason  I didn't define the best performance is because I'm wondering is there any way to find the best balance or order between acceleration, speed, torque and power.
If not, maybe slip ratio can be the define of best performance?


Thanks for your reply!!

7
Tech Help / Re: Two wheel drive electric motorcycle problem
« on: June 16, 2021, 02:09:22 PM »
Generally seems to have been implemented elsewhere as 30% front, 70% rear.
Your real problem is that you will lose half of the major traction advantage of 2WD if the motors are not actually physically geared together. With your design it will be possible to spin up the front and lose it, which is otherwise impossible with 1WD, and self-correcting with mechanically geared 2WD. In other words ... an advantage that can suddenly become a disadvantage.
Cas :)

As far as I know, 30% front and 70% rear are usually used for 4WD's car, right?
But how does 30% and 70% comes from? Are there any research paper or it just comes from experiment results?
On some paper I've read, it was told that giving more power (torque) on the front while entering the curve can cause some positive effect, and on the other hand, giving more power (torque) on the front while leaving the curve will cause some negative effect. But this paper didn't say how to calculate the distribution of front and rear. :'(

Thanks for your reply!!!

8
Tech Help / Re: Two wheel drive electric motorcycle problem
« on: June 15, 2021, 01:33:21 PM »
You choose to put all that mass in the hubs and then ask about performance.  Then bring up % of power.  I would think % of ground speed would be key.

Actually, I build it for my research, and yes, I agree that ground speed would be the key to maximum the performance of my 2WD electric motorcycle, but should I give the same throttle signed to front wheel and rear wheel?
I mean, should I give the same output/dirving force to these wheels?
Or should I give 40% throttle signal output to front wheel and 60% to rear wheel?

thanks for your reply!!!

9
Tech Help / Two wheel drive electric motorcycle problem
« on: June 13, 2021, 03:26:12 PM »
I'm building a two wheel drive electric motorcycle with front hub motor and rear hub motor and no gear, which means there are no gear ratio.
But my question is:
When there are no gear ratio, can the front and rear's horsepower output be 50:50?
Is 50:50 the best performance? Or 40:60? 30:70?
Thanks for your reply!

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