ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: TheRan on January 20, 2020, 01:17:44 AM
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Looking at getting one of these chargers (if I can actually find somewhere to buy them from) and have a few questions. First off, the only place I've found so far that sells them is AF1 but they says they a North American version, is there actually any difference? I'm in the UK so I'd be putting 240v into it but as far as I can tell they're variable voltage units.
Secondly, I'll probably rarely be using it at home and would instead take it with me on longer trips so I need to figure out how I'd carry it. Anyone know if it'll fit in the lower storage compartment of a 7.2kw/h half battery model? I managed to find dimensions on the Delta site and while it should physically fit inside the compartment I don't know if it'll go through the stupidly shaped hatch opening. The dimensions also include the mounting brackets and I don't know how much they stick out (are they removable?) so I can't even make a mock up from cardboard to see if I can stuff it in.
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Question #1..... 60Hz vs 50Hz?
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I use one and DonTom has about 20 of them. :)
I doubt it would fit in your lower storage section. The cable with the Andersen connection is rather thick and not foldable. It's also pretty heavy.
Don and myself go with a theory that it saves stress on the onboard charger, and it cuts your time in half (with 1) so that's nice.
They are a great backup if your onboard charger goes out as well. The Quiq charger can charge by itself.
For longer trips the charge tank is the way to go for your bike. It'd only take about an hour for about 90% charge with a 7.2 battery.
If you still want a Quiq charger it does need to have been programed for the Zero BMS interaction. Your local dealer should be able to get you one. They run $600 U.S. so a bit more in Britain.
Oh one more thing.
You will need a separate circuit for the Quiq charger and the onboard charger, if your using a wall socket. They will pull too many amps and throw your breaker.
Well at least in the U.S. with 20 amp breakers at 120V.
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Question #1..... 60Hz vs 50Hz?
Forgot to say, they're also multi-frequency. 85 to 265 VAC and 45 to 65Hz.
I use one and DonTom has about 20 of them. :)
I doubt it would fit in your lower storage section. The cable with the Andersen connection is rather thick and not foldable. It's also pretty heavy.
Don and myself go with a theory that it saves stress on the onboard charger, and it cuts your time in half (with 1) so that's nice.
They are a great backup if your onboard charger goes out as well. The Quiq charger can charge by itself.
For longer trips the charge tank is the way to go for your bike. It'd only take about an hour for about 90% charge with a 7.2 battery.
If you still want a Quiq charger it does need to have been programed for the Zero BMS interaction. Your local dealer should be able to get you one. They run $600 U.S. so a bit more in Britain.
Oh one more thing.
You will need a separate circuit for the Quiq charger and the onboard charger, if your using a wall socket. They will pull too many amps and throw your breaker.
Well at least in the U.S. with 20 amp breakers at 120V.
A charge tank would be great, but it's more money, more weight (that can't be removed, I wouldn't need it very often), and the tank storage is really handy.
The current draw wouldn't be an issue, the limit is 13A at 240v which is a bit over 3kW and using the Quiq with the onboard would only be about 2.3kW.
I don't think the cable would be the limiting factor, the way it would go in the compartment (if it fits through the hole) the thinner input cable would go facing down and then the output cable would be facing up and should have plenty of room to be coiled up.
As you've got one would you mind taking some measurements for me? I need the height, width, and depth of the main body of the charger as well as how far the mounting brackets stick out (if they're not removable), noting which dimension measurement they add to.
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UL vs CE?
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Doubtful, they're a US based company and make most of their sales there, plus they don't make the distinction with anything else on the site
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I’m curious as to what’s left?
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ok so it weighs 10 pounds.
It's 4 inches high
8.5 inches at the top and the bottom bracket is 11 inches.
Across the cooling fins is 10 inches.
The cord with the Andersen plug is a bit over 5 feet long.
The input cord is rather short and ends with a shrouded male C13 plug like the one on the bike's frame for the onboard charger.
That part could take a UK to C13 plug so your goo there.
Good luck, I've never seen the 7.2 storage compartment.
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Thanks so much, now I can make a mock up. From looking at some photos it looks like the mounting brackets are part of a single plate that covers the underside of the charger and not removable, is that right? I suppose if it would fit through the hole without them I could always just cut them off.
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I saw the screws holding the base but I don't know if it covers internal components or is just a base.
Removing it really wouldn't matter though since it just extends to the same level of the cord attach points.
Again the Andersen cord is maybe 10 gauge cord very thick and stiff.
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Yeah it wouldn't reduce the overall size, but they do run the entire width of the charger where as the cord is at one point and off to the side a bit. I'm thinking that if it does fit through the hole it probably won't be sliding straight in, more going in at an angle and then pivoting once it's part way in.
To give you an idea of what I'm dealing with here's a photo of the storage compartment
(https://electrek.co/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2016/11/2017_zero-s_outdoors-02_1680x1200_press.jpg?quality=82&strip=all&w=1000)
It should be about 10 inches wide (Delta gives the width of the charger as 9.7 inches so that'll be the tightest fit), about 17 inches high so an extra 8.5 inches to coil the cable up, and then about 7 inches front to back.
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I have to say I have my doubts about it fitting.
You could use a top case or even a good top bag or backpack.
Do be sure and take it out when you use it. It gets pretty warm.
Good luck.
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I use one and DonTom has about 20 of them. :)
Nope, only seven Delta Q's and two 2.5 KW Elcons.
-Don- Auburn, CA
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BTW, the Delta Q chargers fit perfectly in the Zero saddle bags, one each.
Carrying them by any other means, IMO, would be a hassle.
-Don- Auburn, CA
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If it doesn't fit in the compartment I'll probably go with panniers instead, a top box would make it a pain to mount the bike with my short legs. Just a shame they're so damn expensive.
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If it doesn't fit in the compartment I'll probably go with panniers instead, a top box would make it a pain to mount the bike with my short legs.
The Zero top box cannot handle the weight of a single DeltaQ. The side cases have more weight capacity and one charger in each is right at the limit.
-Don- Auburn, Ca
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I’m curious as to what’s left?
Ok, the difference between your 240v AC power & North America’s is your single Hot leg is 240v to Ground/ Neutral.
Our’s (N. America) is 120v so we use two Hot‘s together to obtain 240v & Neutral is not involved.
Likely how the units wired (or not) Hot, Ground, & Neutral is what’s at play.
Perhaps not UL vs CE but certainly a difference in standards.
Wonder if one could modify to make compliant?
Also perhaps there is a distributor in the EU that can provide a compliant unit?
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Also perhaps there is a distributor in the EU that can provide a compliant unit?
I have no idea what the issue is, because the Delta Q. Chargers can handle anywhere from 100 to 250 VAC 50/60 hz 12-6 amps (12 amps draw on 120 VAC, 6 amps draw on 240 VAC). 1,440 watts input either way. Closer to a KW (1,000 watts) DC output. A little less than the OBC.
I almost always use 240 VAC on my bike and Quick chargers as then I can use a single cord to charge the bike with two quick chargers, as that is only 18 amps at 240 VAC. I have also used this setup on the road very often to charge above 3 KW. But now I have the Elcons so I can charge my Zeros at above 6 KW on the road or 8KW here at home by running two Delta chargers and two Elcons at the same time. Too much to carry on the bike.
I get the juice out of my Tesla Wall Station that is good for up to 11,800 watts.
-Don- Auburn, CA
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Also perhaps there is a distributor in the EU that can provide a compliant unit?
I have no idea what the issue is, because the Delta Q. Chargers can handle anywhere from 100 to 250 VAC 50/60 hz 12-6 amps (12 amps draw on 120 VAC, 6 amps draw on 240 VAC). ....
Electrically it will handle anything (power) you feed it but it won’t be “Compliant” unless it meets the standards (codes) of the land.
NEMA vs IEC??
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Electrically it will handle anything (power) you feed it but it won’t be “Compliant” unless it meets the standards (codes) of the land. NEMA vs IEC??
Zero quick chargers are designed for the world market. I think you will find the only difference with the European version of the Delta Quick Charger will be the AC plug. The rest should be exactly the same as here in the USA.
-Don- Auburn, CA
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I don't believe to the electronics that it cares between hot-neutral and hot-inverse phase hot. Both are standards in the US. The voltage is the difference between the phases anyhow.
But I have wondered about it, since I have two sources of 240 in my house and they're wired differently from each other.
-Crissa
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It might be as simple as wire color.
In the US, Neutral is white & in the UK it’s blue.
Likely to be UK compliment a 240v North American charger would have to be configured so one of the Hot leads would become a Neutral (including wire color change) and applicable fuse & plug added.
Might be easier (& cheeper) to source a compliment unit locally.
Also in the U.K., Hot is brown & in the US, typically black (but not limited too).
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It might be as simple as wire color.
In the US, Neutral is white & in the UK it’s blue.
Likely to be UK compliment a 240v North American charger would have to be configured so one of the Hot leads would become a Neutral (including wire color change) and applicable fuse & plug added.
Might be easier (& cheeper) to source a compliment unit locally.
Also in the U.K., Hot is brown & in the US, typically black (but not limited too).
Here in the USA, "neutral" (white) is the centertap of the transformer near the house. That's why it is called "neutral". The two blacks are hot, 240 VAC between them, 120 VAC to either neutral. Since you mentioned there is a neutral in Europe, I was wondering if that was also a centertap and you have 480 VAC available to the houses.
-Don- Auburn, CA