ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: MostlyBonkers on March 14, 2016, 03:57:54 PM
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Can you believe it? I'm guessing it must have snapped because it's not there anymore. I think you need to take the wheel off to change them.
I'm writing this whilst stood behind the barrier southbound on the A1. I guess I'll be late for work then! New job too, so not a great first impression. Dammit!
Hopefully Streetbike can get me a replacement on next-day. In the meantime I'm getting the RAC to get me and the bike home.
If I get chance, I'll see if I can find the belt.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160314/38daed3773d5bfcd725ae9742c0778a0.jpg)
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160314/ed8cf698b8931cb9ffd8abd30ebecdfc.jpg)
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A copper just pulled over to check how I was. Offered to give me a lift to the local service station, which was kind. RAC on their way, so better staying with the bike.
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Guy on a scooter just stopped by too. Very kind of him, but judging by the horns bellowing, he put himself at risk.
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Has anyone tried fitting one themself?
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If you are really good with tools you can do it yourself but it is tricky. You have to remove the swingarm, and make sure not to bend the belt or it will form cracks in the strands and it can snap. It's very rare to hear about this. I wonder if this bike was used and had service from someone before you got it.
If you have rebuilt an internal combustion engine from top to bottom a few times, I'd say you could attempt to do this at home. Otherwise I'd let the dealer do it, just to make sure it doesn't snap again. Because this shouldn't happen. Something was wrong here.
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Thanks Terry, much appreciated.
I'll get it done by someone who at least has half a clue what they're doing.
I've dropped a line to Zero to see if they're willing to replace the belt gratis, under the circumstances.
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The biggest problem with belts is getting a pebble under them, which is why the Zero dirtbikes have chains. That'll snap a belt in a heartbeat. That's pretty much the major failure mode if the belt's in good shape and properly tensioned.
Most of the older bikes with belts gradually develop fancy little rock guards with each new model year.
That sucks though, far worse than a flat tire, as you're definitely not fixing that by the side of the road. I'll still take a belt over a chain any day though!
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Well that's a bummer for sure. Did you manage to retrieve the belt?
If you are really good with tools you can do it yourself but it is tricky. You have to remove the swingarm, and make sure not to bend the belt or it will form cracks in the strands and it can snap. It's very rare to hear about this. I wonder if this bike was used and had service from someone before you got it.
If you have rebuilt an internal combustion engine from top to bottom a few times, I'd say you could attempt to do this at home. Otherwise I'd let the dealer do it, just to make sure it doesn't snap again. Because this shouldn't happen. Something was wrong here.
My guess that the alignment was a bit off, I do some work with drive belts and misalignment is one of the most common sources of premature snapping.
On the one hand I think it is a shame that the replacement procedure is that complicated, on the other hand we're talking about forces that are higher than on your average multi belt.
Guy on a scooter just stopped by too. Very kind of him, but judging by the horns bellowing, he put himself at risk.
That's the two wheeler pact right?
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The biggest problem with belts is getting a pebble under them, which is why the Zero dirtbikes have chains. That'll snap a belt in a heartbeat. That's pretty much the major failure mode if the belt's in good shape and properly tensioned.
Most of the older bikes with belts gradually develop fancy little rock guards with each new model year.
That sucks though, far worse than a flat tire, as you're definitely not fixing that by the side of the road. I'll still take a belt over a chain any day though!
True, the other way is if the back tire leaves the ground and then you don't let off the throttle. The back tire will spin up fast and then when it hits the ground it comes to an instant slower speed. The motor inertia can not slow down the RPM's instantly like that and so something has to give. Typically when a DS tries to jump off a tall curb while accelerating and when you hit the street below it could break.
But yes, Crash is right, it is possible you picked up a rock or pebble. We just don't hear about this happening very much on this forum with I think has perhaps a thousand Zero riders or more, most who only post when something goes wrong however, lol.
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I forgot to mention I've had the bike since new.
I'll have a look for the belt when I get the bike up and running again. The trouble is that there isn't a good place to stop even if I do see it.
I'm just glad the wheel didn't lock up as I had the throttle pinned and must have been doing at least 50-60mph. I'm also glad it failed on the slip road before I joined the carriageway and got in the fast lane.
It was a weird feeling when it went, like someone pulling the bike with an elastic band. I don't think I heard it snap, but the loss of propulsion gave it away.
It's nice that bikers stop. I've stopped for others myself. I wish that guy on the scooter was more careful though. No doubt the cars behind him weren't paying attention as he slowed.
I thought the belts were super strong and would cope with all manner of abuse. At little optimistic of me perhaps!
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It was a weird feeling when it went, like someone pulling the bike with an elastic band. I don't think I heard it snap, but the loss of propulsion gave it away.
It is very good to know that the belt failure wasn't jerky or catastrophic, and we're glad you're okay. I've seen one belt failure happen on a group ride (a liter Buell), and it wasn't too bad, either, but definitely caused the rider alarm and ended their ride that day.
I thought the belts were super strong and would cope with all manner of abuse. At little optimistic of me perhaps!
It's really difficult to know or compare what "all manner of abuse" means over the internet. We seem to be able to count on one or two hands how many belts have worn out for Zero owners, and Terry likely has the plurality of them.
It's likely impossible to triage a broken belt, unlike a loose chain, but belt tension and alignment are subtle to diagnose. For example, most of us with a Zero have not seen other Zeros in detail so we don't compare belt wear, tension, or feel!
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I had this happen to me on my 2013 S on my first ride. I didn't even have 50km on the bike yet and the belt broke on me. I did the repair myself in the garage. I have no experience fixing motorcycles, but the closest dealer was over 200km away, so I figured it was worth a shot. As long as you have a way of propping the bike up and the proper tools, it's really quite easy. I had no issues installing the new belt, and it is still going strong (2 years and >16,000km later)
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That hapenned to me too when i installed the 2013+ motor into my 2012 S. I had to make alot of fitting and did not paid attention to the verycritical paralleism angle to have between belt and the sproket!!. In fact that belt MUST BE below 0.25 degree angle otherwise it is so strong than a little angle will make it to take all torque only on onw side of the belt!!!
I walked 7km to home with the Zero.. noy really a good experience!
so YES pay attention to NEVER bend it... I also suspect that curious people about your Zero and during your absense might be curious and tempted to touch it and even bend it as they have a feeling it is very small for that bike size... that hapenned to me when i showed my zero to some people that dont know it is a fragile belt !!
It take about 2 hours to replace if you have moderate skill and all tools
Doc
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Thanks Brian, Spenny and Doctorbass.
Unless Zero are willing to replace it gratis, I'm in a bit of a pickle. It sounds to me like Streetbike are the best people to fit a new belt. I don't have the tools and other equipment necessary, although I'd like to give it a try. Probably not a good idea for me to do it though. I'll talk to the guys in the garage around the corner about it. They work on cars, but they're experienced mechanics. They might be willing and I'll explain how critical the alignment is.
Thanks for the extra info, it helps me a lot. I'll have to take more care with the next belt, especially when launching off curbs in town. In a very non-hooligan manner, I might add!
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Yes, while the dealer would be ideal, the car mechanics down the street should be able to do this easily. Zero will not endorse this as you must understand. They can only recommend taking it to the dealer. But order a belt, if you're going to buy one, go ahead and order a second as a backup, they aren't that expensive compared to going a week without your bike. Hopefully you'll never need it, but Zero recommends changing it every 15,000 miles I think just as preventative maintenance, although I have put 40,000 highway miles on one and it still worked fine, just was missing a few teeth over the entire belt so I replaced it. Good luck Bonkers!
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Good news, Zero have agreed to replace the belt under warranty, given the circumstances. I'll be in touch with Streetbike tomorrow to arrange pickup etc. It's a relief to know the new belt will be fitted by them and everything checked and verified.
Thanks again Terry and everyone else. Interesting that you got 40,000 out of a belt!
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I found the belt! Streetbike delivered my Zero back today and my first ride on it was to go and look for the belt. I found it on the opposite side of the slip road I was expecting it. If Zero want it back for analysis, I've offered to post it to them.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160331/5a0c19676694ab8bd82471872f2d02f1.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160331/79a297fa9607c954bc7c0b9ccebfe3c6.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160331/1e208a7c0267db2b8440c07f7d26f17a.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160331/9b671a6c37cd0a0457822fd08b7333e9.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160331/88b3d6abeae60f3d1f34821a16a8ce66.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160331/b29c5dd8b32ac1f426364876b3e64079.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160331/a53cc5ed3b4166a99526dc7db3d379cc.jpg)
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A picture with both ends as close as you can mate them from the bottom and top would be interesting to see as well.
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More pics. Zero want the belt so it's going back to Streetbike.
(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160401/c0f94c5bca9b6314f7e9894141f32ff7.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160401/824e4445fd5f054e875f2611b4e4575f.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160401/8130b56d957197f7bda80b4f68c2a443.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160401/b744f9bd99b4e40c0ebfda976b67e510.jpg)(http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160401/102913dd5f61b4752ea0392e40497027.jpg)
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You can see how it tore.. stressed one side until it snapped.. that stressed the next cable...and the next...
Its likely your rear wheel was crooked and not square with the motor. That makes the belt tension all on one side.
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Thanks Dude, I was thinking along those lines too. Kudos to the Doctor too, who talked about alignment and the tight tolerances.
I hope I get some feedback from Zero on this and if so I'll share it, but I'm convinced we know the answer already.
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It looks like a puncture in the belt from one of the last pictures where the two ends meet. Thread stress soon followed. This problem really has me thinking though. A guard would be nice and some what mandatory for off rad bikes like the FX and DS.
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I would like to start a thread or use one that is already up to see how the belts get broken but I am new to the whole forum thing.
I have only seen one good Description and it was a stick getting caught.
I would like to see pictures of broken belts when they happen. Show the stick in the belt or at least show the size of the stick. Something.
I would like this to be mostly pictures so that people like me who are considering buying a bike can see if a belt is right for them. The pictures will help show terrain weather conditions and the condition of the belt when it broke.
Can I use this thread to do that?
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I would like to start a thread or use one that is already up to see how the belts get broken but I am new to the whole forum thing.
I have only seen one good Description and it was a stick getting caught.
I would like to see pictures of broken belts when they happen. Show the stick in the belt or at least show the size of the stick. Something.
I would like this to be mostly pictures so that people like me who are considering buying a bike can see if a belt is right for them. The pictures will help show terrain weather conditions and the condition of the belt when it broke.
Can I use this thread to do that?
Please start a new thread so that we can find it. Changing a thread's focus makes it really hard to find anything.