ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Energica => Topic started by: smithy on November 26, 2023, 01:45:15 PM
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Hi All,
I'm after a bit of advice...:
I have the "keyless system" on my Experia and have been having an increasingly difficult time with "Key not in range" issues on my Expeira....even with the passive key zip tied to the sensor ring...it still happened several times each ride. My dealer said it might be a faulty keyless module.
My dealer came to the party and sent me a new keyless module, keys, wiring and sensor ring...the whole kit. I replaced them all this morning...took about two hours or so, not too bad a job, the "anti-tamper" bolts were a pain but I managed to get them out eventually. The new kit came with two new anti-tamper bolts.
There's only two electrical plugs to remove and refit, the main one from the module itself and the one from the sensor ring....quite easy to do.
Anywho, after refitting most of the bits and before fitting the external bodywork I thought I'd try it out...I pushed the button and the bike came to life as normal...cool I thought. So I refitted all the remaining bodywork and when I went to take the bike out of my shed...the bike started as normal and all the menus etc work fine... but it will not arm to allow it to be ridden.!! If the keys were not coded to the module it wouldn't start, so there's something strange going on....does the keyless system need to be coded to the ECU to allow it to arm..??
I then plugged in the old module to see if it would work with the old keys, but it's the same, will not arm. There are no fault codes showing either. All fuses are fine.
At a loss here as the bike is now unrideable and is my daily work commter. My dealer is a 300km trip away for basic diagnostics.... and there's no way to get the bike there other than in the back of a van.
Smithy.
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Have you gone into the menu and re registered your keys to the FOB just to make sure.
There is a procedure in your instructions on how to add a new key to the fob try that with the new ones.
Also is there a manual code? I think factory default is 0000 (highly recommend changing that).
You will NEED to unlock it with factory code, to be able to get the new ones to register properly. I had an issue similar when I first got mybike and tried to put new codes in, it 'appears' to unlock properly but was not really unlocked, and nothing would really work, you'd press buttons etc and nothing really happened. THis was because I DID NOT log in properly on the thing! and yah it can be semi un intuitive that you did NOT log in properly. In retrospect this is a good thing because if someone was trying to steal the bike, they too, would think they were in and it is not working etc.
Pain in the dick, yah but try loggin in again and watch the screen carefully, you should see ALL the icons light up if you are correctly logged in.
Aaron
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Have you gone into the menu and re registered your keys to the FOB just to make sure.
There is a procedure in your instructions on how to add a new key to the fob try that with the new ones.
Also is there a manual code? I think factory default is 0000 (highly recommend changing that).
You will NEED to unlock it with factory code, to be able to get the new ones to register properly. I had an issue similar when I first got mybike and tried to put new codes in, it 'appears' to unlock properly but was not really unlocked, and nothing would really work, you'd press buttons etc and nothing really happened. THis was because I DID NOT log in properly on the thing! and yah it can be semi un intuitive that you did NOT log in properly. In retrospect this is a good thing because if someone was trying to steal the bike, they too, would think they were in and it is not working etc.
Pain in the dick, yah but try loggin in again and watch the screen carefully, you should see ALL the icons light up if you are correctly logged in.
Aaron
Hi Aaron,
Thanks for the reply. The keys and FOB are indeed registered to the module...the bike won't start without this being done...I even did it again using the master key just to make sure...and all is good there and the system told me it was successful. The bike comes alive when I press the button and all menus etc are accessible and all lights/indicators/horn work...it just doesn't arm to allow it to be ridden.
I did the pin code when I first got the bike.....checked it again and it does indeed work as it should...again, it just doesn't arm. My dealer thinks the new module may need "syncing" to the ECU...but I'm none the wiser as I don't have the Energica software to be able to check if this is indeed the case.
I wonder what other people in similar situations do when they are nowhere near a dealer....transporting the bike around the countryside to do what is essenstially a simple diagnostic check/rectification is prohibitive and potentially leaves people without what could be their only means of transportation.
Smithy.
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The dealer should know this, not 'think' this. This is probably part of the theft prevention, otherwise I can steal your bike, put a 400 dollar ecu in and it's ready to go, but needing to synch, it needs to go thru a dealer who can run the vin and see it's stolen etc.
If it's coming on but not arming, that don't sound right. You don't get the kickstand up alert or the press the start button?
do you get the 'go' light and it don't click and let motor run or the 'go'light is not coming on at all? If it's the go light it might be an issue with the kickstand switch or the kill / on / off switch. grasping at straws here.
Maybe it IS turning it on but the main relay is not energizing from another faulty component?
Hopefully one of the energica reps sees this monday and can chime in.
Aaron
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The dealer should know this, not 'think' this. This is probably part of the theft prevention, otherwise I can steal your bike, put a 400 dollar ecu in and it's ready to go, but needing to synch, it needs to go thru a dealer who can run the vin and see it's stolen etc.
If it's coming on but not arming, that don't sound right. You don't get the kickstand up alert or the press the start button?
do you get the 'go' light and it don't click and let motor run or the 'go'light is not coming on at all? If it's the go light it might be an issue with the kickstand switch or the kill / on / off switch. grasping at straws here.
Maybe it IS turning it on but the main relay is not energizing from another faulty component?
Hopefully one of the energica reps sees this monday and can chime in.
Aaron
Hi Aaron,
Dealer is sending a technician to my house this evening, (It's Monday here), to see if it can be sorted. You may well be correct with it being a "theft prevention" thing. I'll find out this evening I guess. I'm just curious as to why the module fitting instructions don't mention the need to "sync" anything after fitting the new module.
Kickstand warning is not coming on...even with the stand down and trying to arm, so it isn't even trying to arm. The "go" light is not coming on and I cannot hear the little relay click as is normal.
Cheers,
Smithy.
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smithy, The "Key not in range" issue began with a firmware update back in April, 2021. It is not a hardware issue. Since the keyless system on the Experia is likely the same as a Ribelle when the firmware for the Experia was created they likely used the same bad software code for the keyless system. I switched to a keyed system because I got tired of it and it didn't seem like Energica was ever going to fix it.
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smithy, The "Key not in range" issue began with a firmware update back in April, 2021. It is not a hardware issue. Since the keyless system on the Experia is likely the same as a Ribelle when the firmware for the Experia was created they likely used the same bad software code for the keyless system. I switched to a keyed system because I got tired of it and it didn't seem like Energica was ever going to fix it.
You may well be right Sir. The only difference I can see with the Experia keyless setup and the other bikes is the FOB sensor ring is behind the right side of the dash panel next to the TFT.... and not at the rear of the "tank".
My "key not in range" faults were becoming very annoying and I'd be getting several warnings on each ride, or on my way to work...~55km. I then zip tied the "passive key" to the sensor ring and it still gave me multiple key not in range warnings on each ride......can't get much closer than physically on the sensor ring itself. I could at least ride the bike though.
This is when my dealer contacted Energica about my issue and put in a warranty ticket for it....Energica then sent out a new module & key kit for me to fit.....this is when the fun started. I've now learned that there is a "Learn Key" feature within the "Energica Suite" diagnostic/firmware/software which will "learn" the new module and keys to the existing ECU to enable the bike to function.
As I understand it, when the old module was removed and the new module was fitted and first powered up, the key coding and module didn't match what the ECU had been expecting to see... as soon as the old keyless module was disconnected by myself....it then required the "learn key" function within the Energica software to be carried out to work again......And with none of us having access to the Energica software....I'm basically stuck with what is now basically a very expensive 260kg door stop.
Smithy.
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So maybe now is a good time to think about going back to a keyed system. I have no regrets at all and it works flawlessly. At least you didn't have to pay for the new keyless system you installed. My keyless system was flawless to, no error messages and always started up on the first push until I updated the firmware and then all of the troubles started. The "Key not in Range" messages began, multiple times per ride and it took 2-3 attempts on average to get it to start. I kept hoping the next firmware update would fix all of it but here we are, over two years since the problem began and no solution to the issue.
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Again, this is a dealer fuckup NOT an Energica one TBH.
The dealer should have come with a programmer, KNOWING they were dealing with the ECU thingie. They should have taken your bike back with them, fixed the thing and then delivered it to you, or arranged some sort of transport.
The ECU I believe also carries the info on the bikes mileage and stuff like that, which is stuff BY LAW the DEALER has to transfer over to the new unit to keep the miles ridden on the bike consistent with DOT requirements. Handing it to you and saying here ya go!! was a major screw up on the dealers part.
Im sorry about not being able to ride, I know how frustrating that can be! Hopefully they get it sorted soon foryou
aaron
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Again, this is a dealer fuckup NOT an Energica one TBH.
The dealer should have come with a programmer, KNOWING they were dealing with the ECU thingie. They should have taken your bike back with them, fixed the thing and then delivered it to you, or arranged some sort of transport.
The ECU I believe also carries the info on the bikes mileage and stuff like that, which is stuff BY LAW the DEALER has to transfer over to the new unit to keep the miles ridden on the bike consistent with DOT requirements. Handing it to you and saying here ya go!! was a major screw up on the dealers part.
Im sorry about not being able to ride, I know how frustrating that can be! Hopefully they get it sorted soon foryou
aaron
My dealer is a 300km trip away so not an easy task for them to send a technician to my place. My dealer principal himself is coming to my place tomorrow to attempt to sort the issue, he has full software access whereas the other technician who came up on Monday did not.
I have two ther bikes to ride...so I'm not unable to ride...but it is frustrating to not have the Experia ready to run.
Smithy.
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Hi All,
An update:
My dealer principal came to my house this morning and plugged in his laptop with the "Energica Suite" software into my Experia, he did a full diagnostic/fault scan, it came up with a physical wiring fault, unrelated to the keyless issue, so we had a fumble around in the wiring coming from the right side handlebar, we didn't actually find anything obvious, so we pulled all the relevant wiring plugs and refitted them.
He then re-applied the .43 firmware update....once finished he then did the "keyless learn" function and my bike was then able to arm as normal...Seems it's now sorted. ;D
I'd like to thank my dealer principal Tobin Page from AEMC on the Gold Coast here in Australia... and their technician Grant Jordan for taking the time to personally come to my own house in an attempt to help & rectify my issue....I doubt many other dealers would do the same especially with it being a 300km trip....great service indeed.
Smithy.
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Great to hear they were able to sort out the issue and get your bike working again!
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X2
And kudos to your dealer for personally sorting things out despite the 300km distance.
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Another small update:
The silly "Key not in range" issue has not reappeared in the ~200km I have travelled since the new keyless module was fitted and .43 firmware update applied. I'm not sure if it was the new module & fob or the .43 firmware which has sorted it, or a combination of both.....but I'm happy nonetheless.
Smithy.
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Great to hear they were able to sort out the issue and get your bike working again!
The new FW update to improve charging and other issues. Is that for all Energicas, such as my 2020 SS9- as well as my 2023 Experia?
-Don- Reno, NV
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Another small update:
The silly "Key not in range" issue has not reappeared in the ~200km I have travelled since the new keyless module was fitted and .43 firmware update applied. I'm not sure if it was the new module & fob or the .43 firmware which has sorted it, or a combination of both.....but I'm happy nonetheless.
Smithy.
But do you still get the message when the FOB is REALLY out of range? Did you check for that? Perhaps they only deleted the message, so you NEVER see it regardless of anything.
-Don- Reno, NV
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Another small update:
The silly "Key not in range" issue has not reappeared in the ~200km I have travelled since the new keyless module was fitted and .43 firmware update applied. I'm not sure if it was the new module & fob or the .43 firmware which has sorted it, or a combination of both.....but I'm happy nonetheless.
Smithy.
But do you still get the message when the FOB is REALLY out of range? Did you check for that? Perhaps they only deleted the message, so you NEVER see it regardless of anything.
-Don- Reno, NV
LOL...yes, it does still work as intended...I tried to start the bike yesterday afternoon after work.... but had mistakenly left the FOB in my office and not in my jacket pocket as usual. The "KEY NOT IN RANGE" message was in full view....I had to walk back inside to fetch it, with all my riding gear on.. ::)
Smithy.
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LOL...yes, it does still work as intended...I tried to start the bike yesterday afternoon after work.... but had mistakenly left the FOB in my office and not in my jacket pocket as usual. The "KEY NOT IN RANGE" message was in full view....I had to walk back inside to fetch it, with all my riding gear on.. ::) Smithy.
I assume when you did get the message before the FW update it had nothing to do with the FOB being out of range. It was probably like my message that I can now disconnect the charger cable as I am driving on the freeway, and my other weird messages when on the freeway, such as "bike is off, tun on to continue."
-Don- Reno, NV