ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Richard230 on January 11, 2021, 11:24:59 PM
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Here is an interesting article that was in my newspaper yesterday regarding QuantumScape's new solid-state EV battery design. Unlike previous announcements regarding such batteries, this one looks like it will be going into production as it is apparently backed by Volkswagen. The QuantumScape's plan is to put their new battery into volume production and into VW EVs by 2025.
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Yeah that's what this was about.
https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=10699.0
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Crap! It looks like their battery claims might be too good to be true. When will this kind of startup investor screwing ever end? >:( https://www.globenewswire.com/news-release/2021/01/11/2156202/0/en/LAWSUIT-FILED-QuantumScape-Corp-Sued-for-Violations-of-the-Federal-Securities-Laws-Investors-Should-Contact-Block-Leviton-LLP.html
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That lawsuit sounds like a scam. I've seen those claims before, and while true of some other designs, they don't indicate anything for potential designs. That claim could have been made of the batteries they first tested for the Tesla Roadster.
-Crissa
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Here is an interesting article that was in my newspaper yesterday regarding QuantumScape's new solid-state EV battery design. Unlike previous announcements regarding such batteries, this one looks like it will be going into production as it is apparently backed by Volkswagen. The QuantumScape's plan is to put their new battery into volume production and into VW EVs by 2025.
See here. (https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/08/quantumscape-building-electric-car-battery-that-charges-to-80percent-in-15-minutes.html)
I would think Ohm's Law would get in the way of this statement below, if they mean something so small can run an EV:
""The solution QuantumScape has developed is a solid-state battery that’s about the size of a pack of cards."
-Don- Auburn, CA
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How big are the cells in a Tesla, again?
-Crissa
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How big are the cells in a Tesla, again?
-Crissa
A "battery" means many cells. Even though often a 1.5 volt cell is called a battery, it is NOT. A 9V battery is a true battery, not a 1.5 volt cell. A 9V battery has six small 1.5 volt cells in series inside it.
But you're probably right that they mean cell and not "battery".
Battery. n.
"A collection of related things intended for use together"
-Don- Auburn, CA
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Well, I hope the lawsuit brings out the truth of QuantumScape's technology. I would love to see a battery design breakthrough like this, but I certainly have been disappointed over the past 20 years when it comes to new battery technology that has been developed in a lab but never seems to make it into commercial production.
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A "battery" means many cells. Even though often a 1.5 volt cell is called a battery, it is NOT. A 9V battery is a true battery, not a 1.5 volt cell. A 9V battery has six small 1.5 volt cells in series inside it.
A series of 1 is still a series. Just like 0 is still a number and null can be an answer.
It has a cap on both ends, it doesn't matter if it's a series of one or many at that point.
-Crissa
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A series of 1 is still a series. Just like 0 is still a number and null can be an answer.
See your dictionary:
Series: n.
"Similar things placed in order or happening one after another"
No matter how you look at it, they should have used the word "cell" instead of "battery" just to avoid possible confusion--if that is what they meant.
-Don- Auburn, CA
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Learn some maths and logic from the last century, please, Don. Argumentum ad Dictionary is not how you bite back against set theory.
-Crissa
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For the purpose of a newspaper article, which is mean to be readable to the general public, the word battery is appropriate. The layperson does not distinguish between a battery and a cell, and indeed cell would be a new concept to many that would have to be defined in the article to be used. This wouldn't be a useful way to spend the articles word limit.
We don't expect newspaper articles to be written for the person distinguishing between if a 9v battery is a battery or a cell. The general public doesn't know, nor cares to know, the difference.
Likewise anyone knowledgeable about batteries and cells would assume the "pack of cards" reference is to the size of the cell, no one would actually be confused enough to think they built a full EV battery pack in this size.
See also the constant stream of articles that refer to tesla having thousands of batteries in them. Technically incorrect use of the word battery? Sure. Confusing? No.
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Newspapers are there to tell you the news in a succinct digestible way. It's primary purpose is to tell you the story of current events, further research is always needed for more precise knowledge. In this case battery was chosen either from ignorance from the writer (they're newspaper writers, not EV or battery enthusiasts!) or as a choice to simply be as succinct and digestible as possible.
I don't' disagree that the article's use is technically incorrect and educating the public with the word cell would be better, but the effect is negligible and contrary to what DomTom said, should confuse no one.
A bit ironic to be nitpicking on the correct use of battery/cell but at the same time be making up words to describe developing technology. But I do agree with the sentiment. New battery tech news is a dime a dozen, and personally I don't find much value in "Vapouries" being discussed until they are actually in production or at the very least, the factory to start production is under construction.
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That article came from the auto section of the newspaper, which is mostly written to review and promote new vehicles to the general public. Think of this section as the newspaper version of YouTube reviews. The best part of this two page auto section is the weekly Car Talk column, which I think might be the newspaper version of Click and Clack on PBS.
Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised to hear that QuantumScape provided most of the information in the article for the author and he just put it in his own words.
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OP this is the company backed by Bill Gates.
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OP this is the company backed by Bill Gates.
Yes! And which is why I don't see this as all doom and gloom. Let's see how things proceed..
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No point in speculating on stuff like this that's entirely behind closed doors. All we really have to go on is QuantumScape's claims. They could be true, or false, regardless of who's money is backing them, and regardless of their intentions even. It could be that their tech is impressive and works, but manufacturing ends up being too difficult and costly to be viable. We won't know until production starts. Until then it's just promises we hope will pan out.
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Transport Evolved's take on QS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukdGw_hs2rM
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Learn some maths and logic from the last century, please, Don. Argumentum ad Dictionary is not how you bite back against set theory.-Crissa
You think a "cell" and "battery" are exchangeable words? Simply use either?
How about if I said I have a cell made from many batteries? Does that make sense to you also?
-Don- Auburn, CA
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Hilariously, after listening to the Transport Evolved video that New2Elec linked to, they clarified that the cells are the size of a playing card, but the modules will be the size of the a deck of playing cards. (7:45 in the vid)
So if we're gonna put our foot down about a battery being a module of cells, the article is perfectly correct anyways.
Presumably you'd need quite a lot of modules for an EV pack, with 100 cells per module. Brace yourself for people tearing apart electric VW batteries in 10 years, and calling the modules cells.
Video noted that they still haven't figured out how to mass produce and test cells nor have they tested them in actual vehicles. 2025 sounds optimistic.
EDIT:
According to Merriam-Webster definition 4B (http://"https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/battery"):
a group of two or more cells (see CELL sense 5) connected together to furnish electric current
also : a single cell that furnishes electric current
But yeah lets act like arguing about it is productive.
It's not a big deal. In everyday english language, battery often refers to a collection of cells or a single cell being used as, well, a battery. That doesn't mean the words are interchangeable, nobody is claiming that they are.