ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: SnakeeH on November 03, 2020, 03:17:08 AM
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Hello everyone,
I have a FXS 6.5 from 2017. Since September, each charge is less effective than the previous one and I'm now faced to a 85% maximal charge... when using an external quick charger, the charge can be fulfilled. Therefore, this is not a battery issue. The mechanics that looked into it seems to point out that the problem is the onboard charger. This is a well known issue for S vehicles, even after 2 years, but it is not the case for the FXS... it would cost me 1 300 $ :'(
Has anyone experienced something similar?
Is it possible to repair the defective charger?
Thanks!
H
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That would be a defective charger, yes.
-Crissa
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I must ask: $1300? and offer this suggestion: A new charger can be bought for $750 and it is easy to replace. I've been buying zero parts from Jay at Zeromotorcycles of Orange County, which is the only dealership owned by Zero, free shipping on orders over $100. (in the US)
Ride On,
Red Clay
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Yeah.
https://www.af1racing.com/ONBOARD-CHARGER-720W-ZM45-08252
-Crissa
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Or you can keep using the off-board charger, if you don't mind bringing it along.
If you get one be sure it's the smaller one for the X bikes and not the 1.3 charger for the S bikes.
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Typical problem, same as here (https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=10480.0).
Unfortunately, the charger is fully potted in epoxy, so it isn't practical to repair. I'd say buy the $750 new charger and be done with it.
The charger is Green Watt 720W 116V (https://greenwattpower.com/product/720-evc-li-ion-charger-series/).
Maybe call a Green Watt rep (https://greenwattpower.com/contact) directly?
Green Watt is now a division of POWERLAND.
Do these require special programming before they can be used on an FX?
They appear to cost $250 (https://www.batterypoweronline.com/markets/charging/720w-on-board-electric-vehicle-lithium-ion-battery-charger/#:~:text=The%20standard%20EVC%2D116%2D720,of%205.8%20to%206.2A%20) in bulk.
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Or you can keep using the off-board charger, if you don't mind bringing it along.
If you get one be sure it's the smaller one for the X bikes and not the 1.3 charger for the S bikes.
Thank you for your help. How can I make the difference between them both? I just retrieved a supercharger that does not seem to work for my bike.
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That says it's for lead-acid batteries not lithium. Moreover, it only goes up to 72V, which is the level of an FX battery that is empty. It needs to go up to 116V, which is the level of an FX battery that is full (and not higher, so as to destroy the battery).
If you plug any old thing into the bike without understanding what's going on, fixing the bike could cost $5750 instead of $750.
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Yeah that's the 72 volt one. The one you need will say 96 volts and have the poop brown connector.
The Zero Delta Q charger costs $600 US and charges at 1kW. The FXS has a 750W on-board charger.
The hardest part of changing out a charger yourself is snaking the cables back around the way they were but it's just some plugs and mounting screws to change it out.
So your choice, a tidy on-board charger for $750 plus you install it or a heavier but more robust (and a little faster) Delta Q for $600 but you'll be unable to charge in the wild unless you haul it around with you.
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That says it's for lead-acid batteries not lithium. Moreover, it only goes up to 72V, which is the level of an FX battery that is empty. It needs to go up to 116V, which is the level of an FX battery that is full (and not higher, so as to destroy the battery).
If you plug any old thing into the bike without understanding what's going on, fixing the bike could cost $5750 instead of $750.
Thank you for this precision. I was not familiar with this charger, I did not see it was dedicated to acid batteries. I was sold to me as "a Zero charger"... I just ordered an onboard charger from AF1 Racing. Any chance someone could know how to repair the defective charger?
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That was not the charger I linked to.
o-o
-Crissa
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That says it's for lead-acid batteries not lithium. Moreover, it only goes up to 72V, which is the level of an FX battery that is empty. It needs to go up to 116V, which is the level of an FX battery that is full (and not higher, so as to destroy the battery).
If you plug any old thing into the bike without understanding what's going on, fixing the bike could cost $5750 instead of $750.
Thank you for this precision. I was not familiar with this charger, I did not see it was dedicated to acid batteries. I was sold to me as "a Zero charger"... I just ordered an onboard charger from AF1 Racing. Any chance someone could know how to repair the defective charger?
My 2018 Zero S OBC failed with a small burn hole in the top of the case. So I took it apart and I am convinced that the chargers can not be repaired as you will destroy the charger trying to get to the electronic components. Attached are photos of the charger that I tried to dismantle to see what had failed.
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I have noticed an uptick in facebook posts and posts on here about not being able to charge to 100%, particularly on the later model FX and FXSs (charger issue). Mine 18 FX is having the same issue too, it was 98% and slowly worked its way down to 92% currently. I use an offboard charger which gets me to 100%, so not a huge deal to me but a bit annoying. Eventually I'm betting it will just give out.
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Thank you all for your help.
I will try to see if I can dismantle the charger.
I wrote to Zero Motorcycle, but no answer yet.
I wrote to GreenWatt-Powerland, they do not sell to individuals and they do not communicate the warranty of their charger, "you have to see with ZM".
GW or Powerland resellers, once they understand that you are an individual, you no longer any respond.
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Hello everyone,
It's good I received my new on-board charger.
It is indeed easy to replace.
I opened the old charger by unscrewing the screws and removing the metal cover but the system is covered with insulation.
How do we remove it, the goal being to try to repair the old charger
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The charger is only replaceable, not repairable. The potting resin protects it from water and vibration, but also against repairs.
-Crissa
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Hello,
I am back because it's impossible to be connected with somebody from Zero SAV.
Nobody answer to my email, even though I tried France, Europe and USA, based on the contact forms from Zero website... 0 answer...
Would you by any chance have a contact that would care to answer me, please?
Thanks!
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They would expect you to buy parts through a dealer, like AF1. They have been working with limited staff because of COVID.
-Crissa
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Exactly what I did, I bought the new part from AF1 Racing.
Even though, this is a well known problem, which is fully taken care of for the FXS motorcycles. This is why I want to get in touch with Zero staff, so we can discuss about it. Therefore, the Covid excuse is hard to consider knowing that I need someone answering me from his computer... Any chance someone would have a contact that would answer? Thanks again
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They would also expect you to submit warranty requests through a dealer, too.
They don't generally answer email.
-Crissa
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I must ask: $1300? and offer this suggestion: A new charger can be bought for $750 and it is easy to replace. I've been buying zero parts from Jay at Zeromotorcycles of Orange County, which is the only dealership owned by Zero, free shipping on orders over $100. (in the US)
Ride On,
Red Clay
I was under the impression it that the dealership was privately owned, not by Zero. Zero did approve of its layout.
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Yeah that's the 72 volt one. The one you need will say 96 volts and have the poop brown connector.
The Zero Delta Q charger costs $600 US and charges at 1kW. The FXS has a 750W on-board charger.
The hardest part of changing out a charger yourself is snaking the cables back around the way they were but it's just some plugs and mounting screws to change it out.
So your choice, a tidy on-board charger for $750 plus you install it or a heavier but more robust (and a little faster) Delta Q for $600 but you'll be unable to charge in the wild unless you haul it around with you.
i wish the choice could be the EVS 116-3400 Greenwatts supposedly also makes. i have not seen anywhere for sale and only seen one picture of it. Any more info of this vaporware would be great!
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Yes this is a known issue related to a clearly defective part that should absolutely be paid for by Zero. The problem is that they usually try no to do it. Insist, try through social networks (often companies are quicker to answer there than through the normal channels) and keep us informed !
Exactly what I did, I bought the new part from AF1 Racing.
Even though, this is a well known problem, which is fully taken care of for the FXS motorcycles. This is why I want to get in touch with Zero staff, so we can discuss about it. Therefore, the Covid excuse is hard to consider knowing that I need someone answering me from his computer... Any chance someone would have a contact that would answer? Thanks again
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I am now having this issue on my '18 FXS. The entire situation has been absolutely maddening. My bike has less than 2500 miles on it. The nearest dealer is further away than the range allows. I reached out to Zero who arranged for the dealer to pick up my bike. This was almost four weeks ago. A week later, the dealer called me and told me that due to this being a common issue, and the very low mileage of the bike, they asked Zero if they would replace the OBC under a goodwill warrantee claim.
Zero refused.
Since that time, I have heard not a single word from the dealer or Zero. I have been trying to get in touch with someone at Zero for weeks now so I can explain the situation and make my case for why I believe this should be covered. Every time I call, I am told that "Vinny" is in a meeting and can't talk. Then I am told to email, which I do and that he will call me back. To date, after nearly three weeks of almost daily phone calls or emails, they refuse to call me back or respond to my messages. This is just an abysmal level of customer service for a company selling $10,0000 - $20,000 products. I can't recall having ever been treated so poorly by a company, especially one that I have been so vocally supportive of.
Lesson learned.
So the reason for the post: I'd like to know what my options are for procuring a replacement OBC. Are there options beyond the OEM part direct from Zero (which I believe is $750)?
If so, can anyone provide a link to the correct part from a third party vendor?
My plan is to replace the OBC myself and then sell the motorcycle, since this interaction (or lack thereof) has left such a bitter taste in my mouth.
Thanks!
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I have the same experience with their customer support and regret ever buying a motorcycle from them.
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Glad you got it fixed.
There have been Electric Engineers on here who have said these just can't be repaired once they have been potted with the resin.
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I won't try to repair the part. I will source a new one and install it.
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I am now having this issue on my '18 FXS. The entire situation has been absolutely maddening. My bike has less than 2500 miles on it. The nearest dealer is further away than the range allows. I reached out to Zero who arranged for the dealer to pick up my bike. This was almost four weeks ago. A week later, the dealer called me and told me that due to this being a common issue, and the very low mileage of the bike, they asked Zero if they would replace the OBC under a goodwill warrantee claim.
Zero refused.
Since that time, I have heard not a single word from the dealer or Zero. I have been trying to get in touch with someone at Zero for weeks now so I can explain the situation and make my case for why I believe this should be covered. Every time I call, I am told that "Vinny" is in a meeting and can't talk. Then I am told to email, which I do and that he will call me back. To date, after nearly three weeks of almost daily phone calls or emails, they refuse to call me back or respond to my messages. This is just an abysmal level of customer service for a company selling $10,0000 - $20,000 products. I can't recall having ever been treated so poorly by a company, especially one that I have been so vocally supportive of.
Lesson learned.
So the reason for the post: I'd like to know what my options are for procuring a replacement OBC. Are there options beyond the OEM part direct from Zero (which I believe is $750)?
If so, can anyone provide a link to the correct part from a third party vendor?
My plan is to replace the OBC myself and then sell the motorcycle, since this interaction (or lack thereof) has left such a bitter taste in my mouth.
Thanks!
Zero does have a 2 year warranty on the bike outside of the battery. So I can understand why they might not warranty the OBC when it is 3+ years old.
I have a new OBC for an FX/FXS that I can sell you. I bought it from AF1 when I thought my OBC was dying. Instead, with help from this forum, I figured out I had an issue with in intermittent contact on the fuse going to the OBC. You might want to check your fuse. See my issue and fix here:
https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=11400.0
I will discount the OBC from the original list 20% but you will have to pay shipping (which you would anyway if you bought it from AF1). PM me if interested.
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My plan is to replace the OBC myself and then sell the motorcycle, since this interaction (or lack thereof) has left such a bitter taste in my mouth.
Where is the bike located and how much are you asking?
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Where is the bike located and how much are you asking
Bike is in Chicago. It is immaculate, perfect. Includes the Givi mount and removable topcase, and a cover. Current mileage is 2437. Not sure of the price yet, but seeing as how Zero just raised the price on these to $11,300 plus tax, and the 2018 comes in the desirable all matte black color, I'll probably list it somewhere near $8500.
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Where is the bike located and how much are you asking
Bike is in Chicago. It is immaculate, perfect. Includes the Givi mount and removable topcase, and a cover. Current mileage is 2437. Not sure of the price yet, but seeing as how Zero just raised the price on these to $11,300 plus tax, and the 2018 comes in the desirable all matte black color, I'll probably list it somewhere near $8500.
I agree, that is a nice looking bike and the latest versions of that model haven't changed much from the 2018 MY. I think your only concern is to check over the condition of the battery pack and perhaps its history by inspecting its logs, to make sure that the battery pack is in good condition and did not spend any time fully discharged, which might have damaged it.
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I agree, that is a nice looking bike and the latest versions of that model haven't changed much from the 2018 MY. I think your only concern is to check over the condition of the battery pack and perhaps its history by inspecting its logs, to make sure that the battery pack is in good condition and did not spend any time fully discharged, which might have damaged it.
I have always followed the recommended charging and storage procedures, have never ran the battery all the way down, and have seen no decrease in battery performance or range during my ownership (outside of the issue with the OBC). Just had Zero run the logs and the engineer who reviewed them even said to me, "yeah, it's obvious you've taken care of it..."