ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: Tony_ on June 25, 2020, 12:53:03 PM
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I always make sure my SR / F is well covered under a roof or rain proof cover when parked, but the other day I had no other option than to park over night outside without any cover, and that night it rained.
The next day the yellow "Check Engine Light" started to show, without any additional error codes. It went away for a day then now it is back again. I do not notice any problems, but will take it in for service to check what is wrong, as suggested in the owners manual.
Is it possible the Zero got damaged by the rain? It was still raining when I drove it the next morning, but the yellow warning light only appeared later that day.
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There have been some that have been damaged by rain intrusion, but the errors will clear up when it dries out. It might be a warranty issue.
But also, many bikes left out in the rain - Zero or otherwise - would show problems given enough time or rain or just bad happenstance.
-Crissa
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I have to say that my dealer blames all the issues with my SR/F due to the fact that I ride in all weathers! see the thread on reliability of SR/Fs.
I now have the wiring totally rebuilt with more weatherproof connectors/seals - taken to Holland from UK to do this, and so far it seems fine ( but its summer...). Im not the only one, I think Hans123 and others had the same issue. Usually starts with error 41 isolation fault, followed by a string of other faults. Someone joked that it doesn't rain in California!
I would make sure you report all faults to your dealer and keep a log yourself. This turned out to be very useful for me when I was able to negotiate a discount on a charge tank.
let us know how it goes.
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Yes very much possible. Mine has been in for repair twice and I have done 10.500 km with it so far in all kind of weather conditions all year round. I started getting that check engine light (CEL) after rainy rides. Others have reported similar issues. See for example my topic https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?PHPSESSID=djvtbcm3qe19ftbkohail7kbh3&topic=9668.0
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Wel, it doesn't rain here in Santa Cruz fir six months but then we usually have three months of solid rain-always-foggy-wet. So it does happen. Just all at once.
While gas bikes can have isolation issues, electric bikes have so many more connectors. And much of the coatings are invisible and applied at the component factory (As opposed to the assembly factory) so it's an easy problem to have for any electronic device.
-Crissa
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Mine is in for warranty repair right now because of water intrusion.
I've ridden in the rain a few times and not had problems. But a few weeks ago I washed it (per the manual with a garden hose) and must have had some water intrusion. Bike would run intermittently. Had errors, and if I shut it off it needed at least 30 minutes before it would move again.
Dealer called me back and said Zero was sending a new BMS out. He said on the earlier SR/Fs there was an issue with some pins on the BMS being too short. Not sure what bearing that would have on water intrusion, but I guess thats what Zero told him. I think based on posts here its a fairly common issue with the early VIN bikes.
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Short pins wouldn't have as much contact space and be looser when plugged together. If they were greased, there'd be more space for intrusion. Sometimes that means there's gaps in the back of the plug they're in, too, because of the size mis-match.
There's just so many things that can go wrong with electronics.
-Crissa
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crissa - There have been some that have been damaged by rain intrusion, but the errors will clear up when it dries out. It might be a warranty issue.
It's not a warranty issue. It's a design fault.
Who designs a motorcycle and does not plan for it to get wet?
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When I first got my SRF last year I washed it with some water (as you do).
I blew it up completely! Wouldn't even turn on.
I won't be doing that again, well not around the seat area anyway :-)
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How is it a design issue?
As I said, component waterproofing is an invisible layer added at the component factory. If they're the tiniest bit out of spec - and it's not possible to see what this is in most cases until the water intrusion happens - the part will malfunction due to water intrusion.
Add to that things like that it's easy to miss a part with grease, that pins are hidden when they go together.
It's not a design issue if they go 'hey, when inspected, these pins didn't go together' if they were designed to do so.
Nearly every motorcycle on the market has something that will fail if it gets wet or its waterproofing fails. Honestly, I don't know any that won't fail if you add 'a component failed to stay sealed'.
-Crissa
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My BMW c evolution has been standing regularly in the rain at my workplace for years without any problems!
But if a battery has already been set up like this, I can only shake my head
Zero is still in its infancy!! :o
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And my S sits out in the rain regularly, too.
What does this prove? That there are nearly no c evolution riders?
-Crissa
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Thank you for sharing your experiences. I wish I knew how sensitive the MC is to water earlier, then I would have taken more precautions. My previous Zero, the 2016 DSR, seemed a lot more water resistant. Never had any issues. Hopefully service will sort it out without wasting the entire rest of the season waiting for parts...
I did go through the error log on the console by the way, and there was a list of around ten various errors, including something about insulation. But for each item I read, it disappeared. In hindsight I should have written down each error. I hope the service department can take the entire log out by other means though.
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My previous Zero, the 2016 DSR, seemed a lot more water resistant. Never had any issues.
How deep of water did you ever take it through?
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My previous Zero, the 2016 DSR, seemed a lot more water resistant. Never had any issues.
How deep of water did you ever take it through?
Haha, well, I didnt take it swimming. I did do things like clean it with a water hose and drive it right after, let it stay parked in the rain, drive in heavy rain etc.
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So, quick update.
I went to the dealer today. The CEL was lit when I left home, and after I did a stop on the way, it turned off before I reached the dealers repair shop. Not saying I want it to be lit, but that was bad timing for it to go off. The mechanic believed me though, however he never saw the problem before and could not tell me anything more about it. They also only sold ten Zero SR F, so I must be in the unlucky ten percent.
Hopefully CEL warnings disappearance is permanent, and perhaps some condensation still left finally dried up from inside. But the warning light went off before and then came back, so not super optimistic.
I checked the console, and since yesterday I got error 31 (Battery Module Ineligible) and error 43 (Isolation Fault).
The dealer said they will need four weeks to even look at the problem, and do not have any loaner bike service. So, that sucks. Doesn't help to have a good warranty with Zero if the dealer put you in a long queue before acting on it.
I guess I will just keep driving it while waiting for someone to check it, and hope for the best. If it doesn't break down before the winter, maybe I can just have it taken care of in the off season... Kind of disappointed though, one worry I would not expect from a MC that is advertised as nearly maintenance free.
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As far as I know the CEL will stay lit even if the fault disappears, until the bike has gone through a certain number of key-off and key-on cycles (5 I think). Even once the fault has gone you'll still be able to check it out in the logs and I think that's what the dealer should have done if it's an actual Zero dealer (there may be dedicated Zero servicing dealers though and it might be limited to them, I've yet to interact with any dealers). You can also do it yourself by transferring the logs through the app and then once they're on your phone uploading them to the log parser (https://zero-motorcycle-community.github.io/browser-parse/zero-log-parser.html). At the same time you can also send the logs to Zero through the app.
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And my S sits out in the rain regularly, too.
What does this prove?
-Crissa
This only proves that Zero has not learned anything from the debacle of the 2012 models
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As far as I know the CEL will stay lit even if the fault disappears, until the bike has gone through a certain number of key-off and key-on cycles (5 I think). Even once the fault has gone you'll still be able to check it out in the logs and I think that's what the dealer should have done if it's an actual Zero dealer (there may be dedicated Zero servicing dealers though and it might be limited to them, I've yet to interact with any dealers). You can also do it yourself by transferring the logs through the app and then once they're on your phone uploading them to the log parser (https://zero-motorcycle-community.github.io/browser-parse/zero-log-parser.html). At the same time you can also send the logs to Zero through the app.
I went to an official dealer and they will get the log and check it. But the service guy said they need four weeks before they have time to even download the log from the bike. Then probably they need one more month to analyze the log, then four more months to repair the MC? :'D
Not the most efficient place, but it is the only one available who knows anything about Zero here in Oslo where I live unfortunately. The MC community in Norway is small due to the short summer, and most of the bikers want something that goes wroom. So, not many options to deal with my Zero here...
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You could always try emailing your logs with the phone app to support@zeromotorcycles.com
Maybe Zero HQ can take a look and give you some info
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Hi Sinsro,
It really looks like you are on the same path as Hans and I (and a couple of others).
The CEL comes on once the bike gets wet (rain/washing/wet road with lots of spray) - The CEL is frequently, but not always accompanied with Isolation Fault 43 - but the bike still runs fine as far as I could tell.
However, Hans did have issues with charging after a wet ride which was a real pain for him but seemed to clear once the bike dried out.
I never had issues with charging even with the CEL faults lighting up my console all the time - I guess I was just lucky on that point.
My bike was taken in by the dealer for repair as soon as I reported it, but it took them 121 days to get the bike back to me. It eventually had a new spiderbus, new BMS and a new battery before they gave it back. So it sounds like the water did a really good job in messing up my bike :D
It does appear that Zero are struggling to get this particular issue sorted. I don't know if it's a parts accessibility/production issue but every SR/F rider who has had this issue has seen their bike off the road for a good few weeks at best and months (4 months in my case) at worst.
What does seem pretty clear though is that we are able to ride with the issue until they call you in for repairs. I would recommend that you tell the dealer that is what you intend to do just in case there are warranty issues etc.
Oli
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Agree it is a design fault - a motorbike is expected to be driven outside.
I hope Zero will fix this. I might delay buying a SRF until this is adressed.
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Agree it is a design fault - a motorbike is expected to be driven outside.
I hope Zero will fix this. I might delay buying a SRF until this is adressed.
How would we know when this is fixed? I doubt Zero is every going to admit to any design or manufacturing flaw, then come out and say "we fixed it!" If you want the bike, just get it.
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Agree it is a design fault - a motorbike is expected to be driven outside.
I hope Zero will fix this. I might delay buying a SRF until this is adressed.
They fixed it twice already on mine 8) just get one and they will fix it on yours as many times as needed 8)
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... for 2 years.
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Well i want it on the road, not at the dealership waiting for parts or services because the was some rain (which happens quite a lot over there)
Agree it is a design fault - a motorbike is expected to be driven outside.
I hope Zero will fix this. I might delay buying a SRF until this is adressed.
How would we know when this is fixed? I doubt Zero is every going to admit to any design or manufacturing flaw, then come out and say "we fixed it!" If you want the bike, just get it.
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Hi Sinsro,
It really looks like you are on the same path as Hans and I (and a couple of others).
The CEL comes on once the bike gets wet (rain/washing/wet road with lots of spray) - The CEL is frequently, but not always accompanied with Isolation Fault 43 - but the bike still runs fine as far as I could tell.
However, Hans did have issues with charging after a wet ride which was a real pain for him but seemed to clear once the bike dried out.
I never had issues with charging even with the CEL faults lighting up my console all the time - I guess I was just lucky on that point.
My bike was taken in by the dealer for repair as soon as I reported it, but it took them 121 days to get the bike back to me. It eventually had a new spiderbus, new BMS and a new battery before they gave it back. So it sounds like the water did a really good job in messing up my bike :D
It does appear that Zero are struggling to get this particular issue sorted. I don't know if it's a parts accessibility/production issue but every SR/F rider who has had this issue has seen their bike off the road for a good few weeks at best and months (4 months in my case) at worst.
What does seem pretty clear though is that we are able to ride with the issue until they call you in for repairs. I would recommend that you tell the dealer that is what you intend to do just in case there are warranty issues etc.
Oli
Thank you for sharing your experience. It looks clear to me I should just ride the MC until the end of the season, then let them have it in for repair for as long as they want over the winter. Perhaps by that time, Zero has also figured out a way to make the repairs more permanent by using new waterproofed replacement parts? Probably not, but staying optimistic.
The way it looks now, it seems I should get a new MC before the warranty wears off. Being unable to ride it for extended periods of time is a hassle, but if you also add a periodic weather dependent large repair cost on top of that then it is really better to just get another MC.
Do you know if the new Zero SR/S has been reported to have similar issues? If so, I guess the only safe choice is to find another E-MC manufacturer...
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Agree it is a design fault - a motorbike is expected to be driven outside.
I hope Zero will fix this. I might delay buying a SRF until this is adressed.
They fixed it twice already on mine 8) just get one and they will fix it on yours as many times as needed 8)
Just as successful as someone I know who has become really good at quitting smoking, haha.
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You could always try emailing your logs with the phone app to support@zeromotorcycles.com
Maybe Zero HQ can take a look and give you some info
Do you know how to get to the logs in the zero next gen app? I remember it was in the support section of the old app, but cant find it anywhere in the new one... Maybe I am blind :P
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3rd tab at bottom "prestaties" in Dutch where you manage dashboard and riding modes.
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Do you know if the new Zero SR/S has been reported to have similar issues?
Yes, the SR/S is susceptible to isolation faults. I think someone else started a thread about this, and I've responded about it. I now cover the tank and charge port area with a plastic bag under my not so "water-proof" cover whenever there's a chance of rain or dew. I also drilled small holes in the 12V battery cover to prevent water from pooling there again. I'm not sure what I'm going to do when it rains on a work day. My bike was fine riding in heavy rain the first couple of weeks after purchase. It faulted a few weeks into the COVID lockdown after an extremely heavy storm. I now check the 12V battery daily with the ZeroNG app to have some confidence that the bike is functional.
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Just a quick update. The CEL warning has gone for a while now, and the MC seems normal. I even drove it through heavy rain and hale for a few hours, and it did not get affected.
I hope this is a good sign, but perhaps now the damage detector itself is broken, haha.
Will take it to service on 23 July, so will let you guys know what they find...
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For mine it also went away from time to time. I think I remember you can even remove it yourself by toggling key ignition switch 4 to 5 times when the bike is dry. Then it goes away. But in my case I would return when riding in heavy rain.
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My own 2 cents on this topic. Got my SR/F in December, with over 10'000 km going trouble-free on it today. I have been using car washers at least 15 times until last week when I got my very first "isolation fault" error message. I finally checked the user's manual to find out that high-pressure washers were indeed to be avoided (silly me). I had the CEL warning light turned on last week for a few days but now it is gone and I will save my coins for toilets and coffee machines. I have been driving in heavy rain probably no more than two times for a total of less than 30 minutes and my bike sleeps in the dry.
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I have been using car washers at least 15 times until last week when I got my very first "isolation fault" error message. I finally checked the user's manual to find out that high-pressure washers were indeed to be avoided (silly me).
If you're going to use a pressure washer on ANY motorcycle, read here (https://guidelineshealth.com/how-to/washing-your-motorcycle-with-pressure-washer/) before you do.
Much damage to even ICE motorcycles have been done because of pressure washing. Best to use a cheap low pressure washer, if you're going to use one at all on ANY motorcycle.
-Don- Auburn, CA
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I didn't even use a pressure washer on mine to get to the issue. In my case I did start after rinsing it with a hose (with garden spray nozzle) and then returned during every heavy rain ride. It didn't show before on heavy rain rides so I think there might be a relation to that wash.
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Washed my “S” and started getting isolation faults. I posted here and most said it will go away in time. Returning from a three mile trip to the post office, and while making a left turn, it went dark and the rear wheel stopped turning. Almost went down. Pushed it to a parking lot, and it was like pushing thru molasses. Eddy currents in the motor, to a shorted controller. I’m only assuming the controller is shorted. Latest from the dealer (EGPS) the BMS is being replaced under warranty. I don’t think thats the only issue, but time will tell. There is some truth to the theory that it will dry out and go away in time, because I was almost there. Until suddenly I wasn’t. So riding while the lights are flashing isolation faults, might not be such a good idea. If my bike has a future, it will be fair weather and sponge baths only cuz water and electricity don’t mix.
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It'll drag the rear wheel in failure during heat, too. That part is normal (and exhausting).
-Crissa
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Wow that's a bummer. Mine got eventually repaired for that insulation error. Still without errors so far, granted covid reduced my rides a lot.
It took some time to get fixed so I easily did 3.000 km including 50 and 100km rides in rain with the error popping up. Maybe I was just lucky.
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The quality of Zero just does not allow rain rides without having a guilty conscience. I also had to suffer with my Zero.
Funny is only that Zero does not teach from his mistakes and now sells a motorcycle for over 20K that can only be used limited.
With my c evo now everything runs differently fortunately.
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Dude, I just spent a week where my motorcycle didn't dry out, making several runs in pouring rain plus to locations that didn't have covered parking. Hours in actual rain.
My Zero still works fine. It's not use-limited.
-Crissa
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Agree with crissa here. I used it for over a year (over 13k) in ALL conditions and had an issue with water infiltration once.
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You just have to be able to ignore the disco lighting in the instrument cluster!
But as a Zero owner you have to accept a lot :D
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What a bizarre thing to agree on.
lots of people: My Zero got wet and stopped working.
2 people: mine doesn't, so there's probably no problem, must be Water Elves or something.
Cas :)
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For me Zero is now already dead because Energica and Dellorto have merged and announced drives and motorcycles in the small and medium electric bike range.
So the Zero segment S and DS get strong and better competition. ;D
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Well reread my response, I never said mine doesn't.
And also you nor me have numbers on this so "lots of people" might be any percentage of owners world wide. Hard to conclude on that.
I only reacted on the harsh statement that zeroes are useless in rain by telling you I do use it that way a lot. As did crissa.
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My point is, what use is telling these people that it works for you? Just a trolly sort of observation is all. (I'll crawl back under my rock)
Cas :)
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My point is, what use is telling these people that it works for you? Just a trolly sort of observation is all. (I'll crawl back under my rock)
Centra's post 'Zeros are useless!' was the trolly post. It said Zeros can't be used in the rain. My exception proves that is not true.
I never said a bike couldn't have problems in the rain. That's true of any bike, ICE or EV. And of course, we have the sample set - people with problems are mire likely to seek out a forum to get help than people without problems.
From one observation, we got to hear from 1/10th the UK owners who suffered the wet spider problem. But we only hear from 1/hundreds of the riders without that problem.
-Crissa
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@Hans2183
Who says that the post was addressed to you ???
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OTOH I don't think I've heard of a bike that's conked out when it's got wet since... 1985? So, well done Zero!
Cas :)
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OTOH I don't think I've heard of a bike that's conked out when it's got wet since... 1985? So, well done Zero!
You don't hang out on BMW fora, then?
Or rebuild Ninjas?
Or...
-Crissa
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I had the joys of 15 years of BMW ownership with all the pleasures of their many failures (I don't think I've ever owned a single BMW that didn't break - we're talking 9 bikes here I think), but failure from water ingress was not a thing that occurred fortunately. And oddly before, during, and after the BMW tenure I was always a Kwacker, and again, no electrical woes - they were just too simple though, not even CANBUS.
Cas :)
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I got my first motorcycle in 2003 and rain was not a concern but an attraction. All of my friends constantly rode in rain, sought out big storms, fully decked out in raingear, and went off to watch landslides and stand in rivers on the road. The thought of a bike failure never occurred a single time to any of us, ever. No bike of mine has had a problem with that, including my FX.
There seems to be some reading comprehension issues here from Zero fanpersons. centra was talking about his experience, bike being >$20 so obviously Gen 3 and not Gen 2. He did not say "useless" but "limited use". Regardless, this is a valid complaint. Bikes that fail when they get wet are inexcusable, even electric ones, especially when they have been around for 14 years.
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Indeed, and making excuses just means real problems don't get fixed. If we want to see it done right - look at how Yamaha and Honda operate.
Cas :)
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I’d just like to add to this thread by adding that I live in the UK and as such riding in the rain is a prerequisite of owning a motorcycle.
I have had zero ( :D) problems with my srf riding in appalling conditions for almost 2 years!
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Thank you, jonblow! As an SR/F owner for a year now, it's good to hear positive experiences. I haven't ridden mine in the rain a lot (but some), and the only problem I've had was an early failure with the drive belt breaking at 54 miles. Now pushing 5k miles, the only remaining problem is avoiding speeding citations, and accepting the fact that I've gone through that first rear tire really, really fast!
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I'm located in Plymouth UK. Last year my SRF was taken back to Holland for error 43 "insolation fault" and spent 2 months there being rebuilt.
Unfortunately I've just had another error 43. This time Zero has trained a UK technician to deal with this (? remake connections waterproof??) so it doesn't have to go back to Holland, but has to go 300 miles away. Crated up today.
Interestingly my dealer (Davant, Torquay) says that there's another SRF going back for the same reason. I think both were very early models bought as ex demos.
The bright side? I get a lone bike, of unknown type, probably not an SRF, so I get to try another Zero.
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What a bizarre thing to agree on.
lots of people: My Zero got wet and stopped working.
2 people: mine doesn't, so there's probably no problem, must be Water Elves or something.
Cas :)
Better make that (at least) 3 owners that ride Weather or not.
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You could say 4 as I ride in the rain a lot with no issues, however I have had isolation faults from spraying the bike down with a hose. So, while the bike isn't exposed to the extent that it's unrideable it's also not sealed as well as it should (and probably could) be.
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The bright side? I get a lone bike, of unknown type, probably not an SRF, so I get to try another Zero.
What did you eventually get as a loan bike Peter?
When mine was in for repair I was given another SR/F (with Netherlands plates ;D)
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I got a brand new S with NL plates on loan.
I like it, same battery, smaller motor, much lighter and nimble. Not such acceleration, but a better range.
It has much better top speed acceleration than the Black forest I tried, which is why I went for the SRF, as the black forest seemed under powered on overtaking. I now think the black forest demo was cooked somehow and had reduced power. Shame, I could have used the luggage!
No news of SRF coming back......
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Well, the Black Forest has a larger amount of air resistance than an SR/F, and a smaller motor. It is also lighter, but that won't make enough of a difference compared to the motor.
Did you play around with the mode button? That's usually the problem on test rides.
-Crissa
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Hi instead of starting a new thread for the same issue, I'm replying to this old one.
I've ridden in rain many times with no issues on my SRS but last week I rode home in a blustery monsoon that required riding very slowly so as not to be blown off the road, and the rain was as heavy as rain can be... tropical storm level rain. The next day my bike would start charging when I connected it and then would stop. I cleared errors 31 and 43 a few times. I noticed it would still run, and was at 44SOC so I went for a ride hoping to dry it out. This worked, but the CEL lit. The manual says to clear error codes when this happens, but now there were no error codes. I used my OBD2 scanner and it showed P0AA6 "Hybrid/EV Battery Voltage System Isolation Fault". I cleared it using the scanner and after that I had no more problems.
Anyone have any ideas or experience where water intrusion is most likely to occur, that would cause errors like that... ineligible battery and isolation faults?
I'd like to fix this so it doesn't happen again. It was thankfully merely annoying but did take up a couple hours of my time when I had other things to attend to.
Reading about P0AA6, it seems to point to where the battery HV could be shorted to the vehicle chassis by water. The DC side of the chargers, between the pack and the motor drive, and where the DC to DC converter is connected are my first guesses. I also assume it has nothing to do with the 12V side or the charging port. Just assuming.
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Anyone have any ideas or experience where water intrusion is most likely to occur, that would cause errors like that...
When I had this problem, after several days of intense rain, water had leaked through my "water-proof" cover and soaked the middle of the bike. I found water in my charger port and in the 12V battery cover. My 12V battery had to be removed and revived before I could get fault codes. I read that the drain for the charger port allows water to run down the wiring below the port. Since this was during the COVID pandemic, after talking to a mechanic I choose to let the bike sit an my house rather than at the shop. After several days of warm weather, the isolation faults cleared. After a few days of riding, the trouble light stayed off. To hopefully prevent this from happening again, I drilled a drain hole in the battery cover and now put a plastic bag over the storage and charge port areas in addition to a new "water-proof" cover.
I had commuted with this bike in the rain several times soon after I got it, and often commuted with my previous SR in the rain. I liked to think that this much use kept the interior warm and resistant to water penetration. It's certain that I didn't have a problem until the SR/S sat for weeks and then was soaked in a bad storm.
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Thanks, I will look at these parts soon. I've read more about that isolation code. Turns out, in a Toyota Prius, it can be set not only by HV issues but also 12v components, such as the air conditioning compressor. So, making new assumptions here, the 12v side of a zero might also cause P0AA6.
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I've had the same problem on my '20 SR/F - it turns out the fan units on the chargers are not waterproof. Zero are replacing them FOC out-of-warranty (to be fair it's only just out of warranty and it's been faulty since I bought it). They have a new part with which to replace them which is apparently now waterproof.
I also had a cracked and shorting busbar in the bellypan somewhere - not carrying HV but it was corroded white around the pin where the water got in. Again, seems like it must have been a manufacturing defect for a part under no stress and never seen since factory build to crack at all.
Cas :)
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Thats helpful, thanks! Mine is also a 2020.
At some point soon when I have worked down my stack of projects already in progress Ill take off the fairings in the garage and look it over carefully and make some changes.
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I've had the same problem on my '20 SR/F - it turns out the fan units on the chargers are not waterproof. Zero are replacing them FOC out-of-warranty (to be fair it's only just out of warranty and it's been faulty since I bought it). They have a new part with which to replace them which is apparently now waterproof. ...
Good to know, thanks for reporting about this. That is also exactly my situation.
In my case, after two CEL alarms and consequent motor-not-starting events this year, that problem has been diagnosed July 7th (they told me they use a special software while spraying water), then a short discussion ensued to get it under warranty since my bike is even older than yours, then a couple of weeks waiting for the parts.
Luckily for me we had a very dry summer (here in Europe) thus, 7000 trouble-free km later, I am yet to take an appointment to replace these chargers.