ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Crissa on April 01, 2020, 12:19:40 PM
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So it came up that Zero had emailed some (https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=9922.msg90415) about their COVID19 policy changes, which have now been rendered moot by the most current county shutdown order.
https://twitter.com/theSCLocal/status/1245197074984923138
We've been under shelter orders, but this is even stricter. They should be able to send out parts and support, but they can't manufacture except for customers who are considered essential.
-Crissa
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Did you see the Santa Cruz city Chief of Police on TV the other day? He really looked scary. He said that he was going to crack down on all social gatherings of any size, all nonessential businesses and anyone not keeping their distance from others when out in public.
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Our Sheriff is the guy who got known by revamping the classes and replacing cells with a library at the local jail and then reducing the number of people held at all to a tenth of what it was.
He got elected by campaigning on all the people he didn't keep in jail!
-Crissa
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Here’s a couple of videos on the subject.
This ones R rated & should only be opened/viewed by those not offended by swearwords....
https://youtu.be/uGOZ9eN_rpA
Here’s the same message in G Rating
https://youtu.be/MMBh-eo3tvE
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So the CDC reported estimates that the regular old flu did the following this past winter. Over 50,000,000 had it. Over 700,000 were hospitalized.
And 62,000 died in the US this past winter. We have treatments and vaccines for that. Did anyone remember hearing anything about that? Did we shut down a damn thing?
Nope.
Those people just weren't news worthy. From 2010 to 2016 it killed between 13,000 and 56,000 with 2012 and 2013 being the old worst years.
In 2019 almost 40,000 died in vehicle crashes.
Covid 19 is very bad and depending on the persons over all health it can certainly kill them but historians will look back at all this and shake their heads.
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What portion of 50 million is 700 thousand, NEW?
What portion of 50 million would 20% be, the most conservative hospitalization rate of COVID-19 positive people?
How long was the average stay of those flu victims? The average stay of a COVID19 patient? How many treatments do we have for influenza? How many vaccines and drugs that we know work?
How many proven treatments for COVID19?
Of those who contracted COVID19 in my county over a month ago: None have been cleared since. Those who entered the hospital haven't left yet. We don't have total deaths from Italy yet - but they're staggering. And it doesn't yet count all the secondary deaths or those who died due to being frozen out of the hospitals or undercounted because they died at home.
Yes, the extreme shelter-in-place is a pain and not the best solution. But it's too late for any other solution other than adapting to massive death as we wait for medical science to come up with vaccines and treatments. Which it will: It just takes time.
-Crissa
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My elderly neighbor (who was about the same age I am) went into the hospital late last week and passed away a few days ago from complications of pneumonia. His wife is now living alone in their home by herself, quarantined for the next two weeks. :(
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Erf. Yes. I didn't count the two who've died so far as leaving the hospital. The county only counts one of the deaths because the other wasn't a resident.
Yeah, if they're the only ones who die, it will be less than the flu. But they won't be, and sheltering is what we can do to keep it from being more. The point is that unlike the flu, nearly all of us are not immune. If everyone were to get sick at once, far far more would die.
-Crissa
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Well the good news is a combo of the malaria drug and a Z pack of antibiotics seems helping to get the recovery rate up.
But my point was I didn't have any idea that many people were dieing from the regular flu. At some point illness cases and deaths should trigger major warnings from the media and action from the government. All I've ever really heard is you will feel very bad and miss school or work. But over 60k deaths over 6 months what were they thinking? I figured a few hundred deaths a year from old or just unhealthy people but over 60k.
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The anti-malarial has now been hoarded and consumed by panicked people and the study in France was six cases.
So... So much for that.
But COVID19 has 10 to 20x the death rate of the flu, and 100x the hospitalization rate. That's what they're afraid of: If the hospitals are full of people recovering from COVID19, what happens to anyone else injured? What happens to the doctors and nurses, who are exceedingly unlikely to die from influenza?
-Crissa
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Here’s a good reason to stay the £#€¥ @ home...
https://www.govtech.com/analytics/Kansas-Uses-Cell-Phone-Location-Data-Tool-to-Track-Covid-19.html
Big brother is (or at least can be) watching.
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I'm an essential or expendable depending on how you view it so I'm still out in it. I don't think they can track a turned off flip phone anyway. ;)
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Thank you crissa for helping sorting things out .. !
I work as a nurse and I can tell you that Covid-19 certainly is more dangerous than the seasonal flu. As crissa said.
Look at northern Italy - they used army trucks to transport the coffins to other places due to an local 'overload'.
The biggest crematorium in Milan is closed due to a 20 days waiting list because of the overload.
Only in Bergamo 17 priests died from Covid-19, 50 priests in Italy. That were news from March 22nd.
@ NEW2elec: I wonder about whom historians will shake their heads.
(Well - there is at least one person in the USA I already shake my head at the moment. And it is not you NEW2elec ....)
Look at the channel from Dr. John Campbell (Academic emergency nurse). He started to speak about SARS-CoV-2 / Covid-19 very early and has not stopped. He really sorted things out at an early time and warned and predicted what one by one comes true at the moment.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCF9IOB2TExg3QIBupFtBDxg
To be honest I'm a bit frightened what will happen in the USA in the next few weeks / months ...
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Strange to hear Kansas to use technology we in California haven't even considered using because we'd be sued if we did and we wouldn't have the budget to send deputies to carry it out in any matter. We're already fending off lawsuits from gun shops (who want to be open normal hours instead of limited to delivery service), churches (who want to run their events) and ... manosphere protestors? (no, really, they were out protesting and blocking sidewalks last week.)
-Crissa
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“We’re not in Kansas anymore Toto”
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/03/google-coronavirus-tracking-162715
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My elderly neighbor (who was about the same age I am) went into the hospital late last week and passed away a few days ago from complications of pneumonia...........
Sorry for your loss Richard.
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California has done very well overall.
Santa Cruz County, CA is in good shape, having 59 cases among 276,000 residents (0.02138%) and only one death.
Santa Clara County, CA is three times worse, but also in great shape with 1200 cases among 2,003,000 residents (0.06% or 1 in 1670) and 39 deaths, of which 30 were diseased and 9 were healthy. Reported cases are holding around 60/day with no deaths today. With the measures taken, it's turning out to be under 25% as deadly as the seasonal flu (in this location).
San Francisco is about the same, with half the population and half the cases.
New York City is horrible. Deaths are 3x as bad as the flu so far, and still getting worse.
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I'm disappointed some are focusing on deaths as a % not the total number. I hope all of this is over soon and not another person dies from it. But as of today less than 10k have died from it in the US and over 62k died from the flu in the US in just 6 months. The point still stands that we heard nothing about the mounting death toll from the flu.
Some good news from the BBC.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/york-coronavirus-cases-dropping-first-171231878.html
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I heard on the local NBC TV station news that Santa Cruz issued 40 citations this weekend to people who were getting too close to each other at the beach.
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I'm disappointed some are focusing on deaths as a % not the total number. I hope all of this is over soon and not another person dies from it. But as of today less than 10k have died from it in the US and over 62k died from the flu in the US in just 6 months. The point still stands that we heard nothing about the mounting death toll from the flu.
Some good news from the BBC.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/york-coronavirus-cases-dropping-first-171231878.html
Any idea what the death tole in the US would be from COVID-19 if nothing was done?
According to this https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/04/01/824744490/5-key-facts-the-white-house-isnt-saying-about-their-covid-19-projections 2.2 million.
That’s a long way away from the flu.
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I'm an essential or expendable depending on how you view it so I'm still out in it. I don't think they can track a turned off flip phone anyway. ;)
Same here but I use my phone as my TPMS (Fobo tire pressure Monitor).
I go straight to/from home/work so I’ve nothing to hide.
It’s EXCEPTIONALLY nice to not have to deal with a gas station in this mess.
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I'm an essential or expendable depending on how you view it so I'm still out in it. I don't think they can track a turned off flip phone anyway. ;)
Same here but I use my phone as my TPMS (Fobo tire pressure Monitor).
I go straight to/from home/work so I’ve nothing to hide.
It’s nice to not have to deal with a gas station in this mess.
My feeling is that it is nice not to have to deal with a gas station at any time. :)
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I'm an essential or expendable depending on how you view it so I'm still out in it. I don't think they can track a turned off flip phone anyway. ;)
Same here but I use my phone as my TPMS (Fobo tire pressure Monitor).
I go straight to/from home/work so I’ve nothing to hide.
It’s nice to not have to deal with a gas station in this mess.
My feeling is that it is nice not to have to deal with a gas station at any time. :)
I fixed it ;D
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Yeah, the county announced they would begin citing this weekend.
https://mobile.twitter.com/sccounty/status/1246205887238160384
It was pretty rainy tho.
-Crissa
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Parks and beaches closed completely - including walking paths - starting the 9th (yesterday) through the 15th. They even sent out an Emergence Extreme Warning text to everyone's phones. I got it both en Espanol and English. Whee.
They're expecting the hospitals to fill this week. Santa Cruz County Health Coronavirus tracking page (https://www.santacruzhealth.org/HSAHome/HSADivisions/PublicHealth/CommunicableDiseaseControl/CoronavirusHome.aspx)
But on the bright side, we should have twice as many ICU beds available after next week. And they've marked thirty of our cases as 'recovered' which is new, a little more than a week ago they weren't willing to list anyone as recovered.
They're predicting California's peak to be at the end of next week.
-Crissa
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I'm disappointed some are focusing on deaths as a % not the total number. I hope all of this is over soon and not another person dies from it. But as of today less than 10k have died from it in the US and over 62k died from the flu in the US in just 6 months. The point still stands that we heard nothing about the mounting death toll from the flu.
Some good news from the BBC.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/york-coronavirus-cases-dropping-first-171231878.html
California looks really bad when you look at total number. But it's not even in the top 10 startes when you look at percentage. Population matters.
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Yeah, the county announced they would begin citing this weekend.
https://mobile.twitter.com/sccounty/status/1246205887238160384
It was pretty rainy tho.
-Crissa
I saw Santa Cruz police fined some Fremont folks hanging out at a 7 Eleven $1000 a piece for public health distancing violations.
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Ouch! https://www.kron4.com/news/bay-area/7-fremont-residents-fined-1000-in-santa-cruz-for-violating-shelter-in-place-orders/
I wondr if they did the same to the protestors blocking the sidewalk in front of the 7-eleven the week before?
-Crissa
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I think it's just human nature to concentrate on the here and now. But what about the there and then? When there were only seven cases in the USA, I said, "this is going to get out of control". Because it's always too little too late.
I wonder who will be processing those citations? And what are they going to do with those protesters all violating the social distance rules. When there's social unrest, how do we force people to be socially responsible? Maybe throw them all in a jail cell. No wait???
On my weekly trips to Walmart I never take my helmet or gloves off. (My new motorcycle gloves are rubber.) Last week some woman was coughing up blood at the self checkout. No mask. No gloves. So many people without a mask. They don't care about anyone but themselves.
The only fever going on in my home is cabin fever, and I'm so thankful that I have that "S" in the garage. When I can't stand it anymore, I head out looking for roads less traveled. If there are no restrictions I especially like the bike and walking paths, practicing my balance and social distance at less than ten MPH. You know, getting my exercise. Nice that dogs don't bark or chase electric motorcycles. In so many ways, this is the best purchase I've ever made.
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I've gone to Petaluma (for work, food industry), Napa, Oakland, SSF (delivering masks and mask-making materials). It's been really pleasant, nice weather, little smog and traffic. There are some joyriders, but there are also a fair number of police at intersections keeping watch.
Good chart, updated daily:
https://garykac.github.io/covid19/cases-norm/cases-lin.gif
EDIT:
Oops, this is the one I was thinking of in the following comments:
https://garykac.github.io/covid19/cases/cases-lin.gif
Interestingly, the US rate is still quite vertical, while all the populous states are flattening. To me that indicates that the spread is now mostly in the more rural states, the red states, the states over-represented in the senate and in the college of electors. You'd think it would be correlated to population density, but I heard an interesting explanation: in rural areas, hospitals are spread out, and people who go an hour or two to the hospital may come back with the virus and spread it in their communities. Also groceries and other services are similar, it's spread at Walmarts and Sam's Clubs and gas stations and churches and such. The main thing correlated with spread it not taking it seriously, not limiting contacts, not wearing masks.
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> Same here but I use my phone as my TPMS (Fobo tire pressure Monitor).
Data off, Bluetooth on?
But yeah, same here, nothing to hide.
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The main thing correlated with spread it not taking it seriously, not limiting contacts, not wearing masks.
I live in Georgia, and I still see about 20% of people shopping there not wearing masks. A lot of people really do believe there's a conspiracy around all this, and it sucks that trust the narrative a few people in media give them so much.
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Well, even spotty mask use is helping: https://mobile.twitter.com/sccounty/status/1253718341572718592
The county has required masks in public places now, so we'll see if that little bit left changed things.
We also lost a grocery store as seven of its staff tested positive for COVID19, at least one was in the hospital. They shut the store down. This was also the part of the county which had the first school closure before the shelter order and before the UC completely shut because one of the staff tested positive. (It was one of the first community-acquired cases confirmed.)
-Crissa
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The shitdown is slowly being lifted in some places and increased in others. Our parks and beaches are closed from eleven to five during the day (and they're normally closed an hour after sunset to an hour before mostly) to prevent tourism.
The scuttlebutt is that Zero is starting up the production line - they've been putting out repairs and doing only limited production. I heard they have a bunch of police bikes to build. So that's cool. I wonder what the SR/ police bikes look like...
I saw another SR/S on the road again, looked like one from the factory.
-Crissa
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The shitdown is slowly being lifted in some places and increased in others. Our parks and beaches are closed from eleven to five during the day (and they're normally closed an hour after sunset to an hour before mostly) to prevent tourism.
The scuttlebutt is that Zero is starting up the production line - they've been putting out repairs and doing only limited production. I heard they have a bunch of police bikes to build. So that's cool. I wonder what the SR/ police bikes look like...
I saw another SR/S on the road again, looked like one from the factory.
-Crissa
What drives me crazy is that each little county has their own set of rules regarding what people can do and what they can't. It depends upon where you are when you get caught. Most police seem to be more interested in keeping the local public beaches, parks and trails only for their residents and not for the general public that probably is paying taxes to support and maintain them. San Mateo county as of yesterday increased their travel restriction to visit a recreation area from 5 miles to 10 miles. What has the mileage traveled got to do with anything? Why 5 miles and what changed to allow people to travel 10 miles now? I am really having a problem understanding the logic behind all of these different rules that are made up by individual local health officers. I would feel better if they would explain their reasoning, instead of just announcing the regulations without any justification. ???
Regarding Zero, that is the way to get back to work. Build or service "authority" vehicles. Doing anything to support the cops is considered an essential service and you are allowed to do that. My BMW shop claims that they are staying open because they service and maintain police BMW motorcycles. Hopefully the Zero factory can stay open long enough building cop bikes for the crisis rules to be lifted sufficiently to allow full production of all of the vehicles to commence. I just hope there is enough loose cash left in the enthusiast market to purchase them.
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The rules should be pretty consistent now; they're trying to make most counties follow the same suggestions.
But the number of cases and how people are responding varies from county to county.
The big thing is trying to pre-empt as much county to county travel as possible. That limits spread. Hence the daytime park closures.
The state was saying San Mateo's range from home rule was unenforceable and possibly unconstitutional.
-Crissa
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The rules should be pretty consistent now; they're trying to make most counties follow the same suggestions.
But the number of cases and how people are responding varies from county to county.
The big thing is trying to pre-empt as much county to county travel as possible. That limits spread. Hence the daytime park closures.
The state was saying San Mateo's range from home rule was unenforceable and possibly unconstitutional.
-Crissa
According to news reports last night the Pacifica cops sent 745 people home who were walking along the Pacifica State Beach this weekend for being more than 5 miles away from home. It is a mystery to me how they determined this as it would require interviewing each person and checking their ID for just walking on the sand. That would surely take a lot of time. The town doesn't have much of a police department to begin with and you would think they would have better things to do. ::) The news media sure didn't even hint that the 5, now 10-mile, rule might be unconstitutional. ???
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Pacifica doesn't have a very large beach, there's only a handful of choke points.
-Crissa