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[Hans2183]

SR/X probably then

[shayan]

I concur that computer modeling is really good these days and less expensive than actual wind tunnel testing. But i think everyone has to do some form of wind tunnel testing to get some sort of real world data (or do actual real world testing with cross winds, turbulence created by vehicles ahead etc). It would be quite dangerous to have an aerodynamically unstable bike. On the other hand obviously, Zero does not have all the money in the world to put into such investments.

Looking at the highway range claims from Lightning, i'm sure a decent chunk of that is because it is slippery in the wind. So they must've done some amount of aero development. it would also help to have a good aero to aid cooling of different components as well.

Oh and as mentioned by a Zero rep, these two models are supposed to catch a lot of attention. If its not a whole lot of improvement, it would'nt catch any attention

[TheRan]

Second bike at the end of 2020:
Come on FXR! 

Not gonna happen with the 7.2 battery. It'd be cool to see a more off road focused DS(R) using parts from the FX like suspension and wheels. Not that I'd ever get one as it'd be too tall for me.

[enaef]

Regarding the SR/S I'm going for sort of a sports-tourer with fairing which covers the entire battery at least.
Motor etc. like the SR/F.

Some birds calling it from the rooftops ...

The bird confirmed, what I was told at the EICMA last year.

[wavelet]

Regarding the SR/S I'm going for sort of a sports-tourer with fairing which covers the entire battery at least.
Motor etc. like the SR/F.

Some birds calling it from the rooftops ...

The bird confirmed, what I was told at the EICMA last year.

I certainly hope so... guess we'll see in 3 weeks.
Next step for zero, which should be a lot less work than completely redoing the drivetrain for high-voltage CCS DC support, is to fix the charging.
This is the other part of the range solution, after improving aerodynamics and gradual improvement of battery capacity.

For about half the market (most of Europe), 3-phase 22kW public AC chargers are readily available.
The setup on the bike should be capable of supporting 15-18kW (in order not to exceed 1C, if that's still the significant limitation(*)) without using up the  tank space, so that's still available for storage or extra battery.
This doesn't necessarily have to be on the base SR/S -- a factory option would work fine, but on a full day's sport-touring, being able to cut charge times by a third would be very useful.

(*) I expect it might be, among other reasons, due to the lack of active cooling.

[Auriga]

LOL. There's no way they can fit 22kW of AC charging into the bike. Especially without using the tank space. Look at all the space they need just to get to 12kW. It's not like the chargers aren't close to 95% efficient already.

My money is on higher rate CCS charging. Especially if they can find a high power dcdc converter. Get Farasis to agree to raise the 1C limit and we might see ~20kW there.

I'll bet they'll release what is essentially a fully faired SR/F. Everything else may not launch at the same time, but might get announced.

[TheRan]

Diginow managed to fit nearly 10kW into the space of the stock SDS charger (well, a tiny bit larger), and that's with 3 separate units. Zero themselves should be able to do better, at least better than they do at the moment.

[pacificcricket]

Diginow managed to fit nearly 10kW into the space of the stock SDS charger (well, a tiny bit larger), and that's with 3 separate units. Zero themselves should be able to do better, at least better than they do at the moment.

Yeah, and that's a fool's errand. Why carry the ballast around, when you can reorganize the battery cells to increase voltage and use stationary DC charging stations ? Oh yeah, that requires engineering, and engineering requires engineers... good engineers are expensive, but the electric motorcycle market is inherently small and non-lucrative. So there you have it, catch 22.

[dukecola]

Diginow managed to fit nearly 10kW into the space of the stock SDS charger (well, a tiny bit larger), and that's with 3 separate units. Zero themselves should be able to do better, at least better than they do at the moment.

Yeah, and that's a fool's errand. Why carry the ballast around, when you can reorganize the battery cells to increase voltage and use stationary DC charging stations ? Oh yeah, that requires engineering, and engineering requires engineers... good engineers are expensive, but the electric motorcycle market is inherently small and non-lucrative. So there you have it, catch 22.

The catch-22 is CCS still is sparse and mostly in coastal states along or near interstates. Fine for cars, but not adequate for motorcycles, not really in areas motorcycles ride. IMO L2 is where it's at and bikes should be optimized for L2 charging. There are few L3's in my region and where they are located, I don't ride.

[Crissa]

CCS compatibility means all those J-stations work plus the CCS stations.  It's not 'or', it's 'and'.

-Crissa

(although it does mean it requires a beefier J-station compatible on-board charger to be compatible with the higher-voltage CCS-compatible battery.  If we could get to the point where CCS was super-common, the bike could shed weight and only DC charge, but that's not a current standard as there's no home CCS chargers at the moment.)

[pacificcricket]

The catch-22 is CCS still is sparse and mostly in coastal states along or near interstates. Fine for cars, but not adequate for motorcycles, not really in areas motorcycles ride. IMO L2 is where it's at and bikes should be optimized for L2 charging. There are few L3's in my region and where they are located, I don't ride.

Not sure why this is difficult to understand... if you're charging from AC power source, that means you're carrying around your charger(s). If you approach or exceed 1C of your battery pack on 14kW and above, that is quite a beefy AC-DC system that adds bulk and weight to the motorcycle which has neither to spare. ChaDemo is another DC standard, and would also work if the battery voltage is increased.

[Crissa]

I don't think it's difficult to understand, it's just that CCS chargers are not currently a reliable network everywhere a bike would want to charge yet.

-Crissa

[pacificcricket]

I don't think it's difficult to understand, it's just that CCS chargers are not currently a reliable network everywhere a bike would want to charge yet.

-Crissa

You again ignored ChaDemo, but either way... Zero can talk to Elon, and get access to Tesla network. Problem solved.

[TheRan]

You did raise the point of dropping the "ballast", I assume that means going DC and not having a built in charger. Even if you do keep the charger DC isn't wide spread which means you're still going to want a decent AC charger, DC doesn't negate that need (yet).

[pacificcricket]

DC isn't wide spread

Here is a visual aid to my point above : https://www.tesla.com/findus?bounds=54.35650839634679%2C-57.398826562500005%2C21.312328391805742%2C-141.7738265625&zoom=5&filters=supercharger

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/tesla-elon-musk-open-supercharger-network/