Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[MikeL]

Sounds like it has something to do with charging. But they are investigating the issue and halting production/deliveries. Those already with the bike (not sure who has actually received one) are still able to ride and this appears to be cautionary.

https://electrek.co/2019/10/14/harley-davidson-pauses-livewire-electric-motorcycle-production/

[DonTom]

Sounds like it has something to do with charging. But they are investigating the issue and halting production/deliveries. Those already with the bike (not sure who has actually received one) are still able to ride and this appears to be cautionary.

I figured they discovered a problem that was causing the delays. Obviously, the bike's on-board charger has a safety related issue.

Lousy charger anyway, with no true level two charging available. Perhaps they should change it to something like whatever Energica is using for their OBC.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[NoMoreIdeas]

An AC charging issue has got to be the easiest one to fix. If it was level 3 your are probably dealing with the chemistry of the cells.

[DonTom]

An AC charging issue has got to be the easiest one to fix. If it was level 3 your are probably dealing with the chemistry of the cells.

Yep. But IMO, they need a much updated charger and not bother fixing the level one only charger the bike comes with.

IMO, a 30K$  bike should not have the same type of OBC in 2020 model as a 2013 Zero DS, etc.

And BTW, why do they only let their battery charge at 12KW with CCS?    My Energica has a smaller battery that can accept 25 KW. The Energica charges twice the speed of the Harley with either DC CCS or 240 VAC.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[Fran K]

.....

And BTW, why do they only let their battery charge at 12KW with CCS?    My Energica has a smaller battery that can accept 25 KW. The Energica charges twice the speed of the Harley with either DC CCS or 240 VAC.

-Don-  Reno, NV

Don you started a separate thread on this.  One has lithium ion cells the other has lithium and another word.  1c vs 2c charging.   From memory,. Not satisfied with effort spent in response to your question so far?

[MikeL]

I do agree with it's cost it should have more capable charging. But I also understand electric motorcycle engineering is in its infancy. Manufacturers are balancing a lot of different things, available technology, R&D budgets, supply chains, weight, engineering, etc.

I hope in the future (hoping HD keeps making electric), they introduce more capable tech. With several manufacturers in both car and motorcycles now, I wouldn't be surprised if we see smaller more capable charging tech as the suppliers have companies willing to buy in bulk.

[DonTom]

Don you started a separate thread on this.  One has lithium ion cells the other has lithium and another word.  1c vs 2c charging.   From memory,. Not satisfied with effort spent in response to your question so far?

My question was not technical.  On a 30K$ bike, why would they use such a battery if it can only handle 1C when the technology is there for 2C?

And why would they use a cheap charger that has no true Level Two charging?

I can understand Zeros and other lower priced bikes doing such, but not with a 30K$ bike.

IMO, it HD wants to sell a 30K$ bike, it should not be built like a 15K$ bike.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[Richard230]

Here is the story from Motorcycle.com.  I note that the problem seems to be with the on-board 120V charger. I wonder what that could be?  I guess we will find out some day:
https://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/harley-davidson/harley-davidson-suspends-livewire-production.html

[NEW2elec]

I read that they now say don't use your home to charge just come in to the dealer and use the DC charging.
https://powersportsfinance.com/harley-davidson-halts-production-of-livewire/


They were filming the Long Way Up show using Live Wires going from South America to LA.  I wonder if that real world hard use testing was where the issue was found?

Hey out there can somebody make a charge unit that works off a 110 plug and doesn't screw up?  There is a market for one if you can.

[MVetter]

Wouldn't be difficult. H-D is just suuuuuuuper secretive and a bureaucratic hellhole if you try to get any technical information about the bikes, especially things like the specs for the controller.

[DonTom]

A One has lithium ion cells the other has lithium and another word.

Lithium Polymer.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[Richard230]

I read that they now say don't use your home to charge just come in to the dealer and use the DC charging.
https://powersportsfinance.com/harley-davidson-halts-production-of-livewire/


They were filming the Long Way Up show using Live Wires going from South America to LA.  I wonder if that real world hard use testing was where the issue was found?

Hey out there can somebody make a charge unit that works off a 110 plug and doesn't screw up?  There is a market for one if you can.

That trip has already been done, going in the other direction, by a single unsupported traveler riding a 2012 ZF9 Zero S.  I wonder if H-D knows that?  I would love to see them make a big deal out of their ride, probably supported by an army of ICE 4-wheel drive vehicles, and then be told that they should have tried that 6 years ago.   

[MikeL]

That trip has already been done, going in the other direction, by a single unsupported traveler riding a 2012 ZF9 Zero S.  I wonder if H-D knows that?  I would love to see them make a big deal out of their ride, probably supported by an army of ICE 4-wheel drive vehicles, and then be told that they should have tried that 6 years ago.   

They already have shown they are also using a Rivian Truck as well. At least one of the photos that was released had two HD LiveWires in the back of a Rivian.

I don't believe this LiveWire trip is supposed to be "Look what electric motorcycles can do." If you look at HD's marketing for awhile now it's about being out on the road, adventure, and being "different." So this trip is probably more about using new technology to go have the same type of adventure. Their marketing is heavily focused on influencers now who fit that ideal.

[NEW2elec]

I saw a video from a source that dug a bit deeper into the show.  They have or had 4 Live Wires and 2 Rivians and at least one Ford truck with a trailer.  Likely with a generator in the trailer.  I would assume the bikes can charge from the Rivians as well.  I'm sure Rivian gave them the big 200 kWh optioned trucks. 
I want to watch the show as much for the Rivians as anything else.

[MVetter]

Can you share the video?