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[alko]

Just wanted to start by saying Zero has neen very good answering my questions via email. Usually within 24 hours which is great. I really appreciate that.
My last question to them was if there is a DC charge tank in the works for my 2017 DSR in the near future. Unfortunately, there is not.  Thats too bad.
My question to you is, will there be an aftermarket option?

[DonTom]

Just wanted to start by saying Zero has neen very good answering my questions via email. Usually within 24 hours which is great. I really appreciate that.
My last question to them was if there is a DC charge tank in the works for my 2017 DSR in the near future. Unfortunately, there is not.  Thats too bad.
My question to you is, will there be an aftermarket option?

What is it that you're trying to accomplish? The quick charger Anderson connector above the motor is for DC input.

The problem is that the infrastructure for the 116.5 VDC input doesn't exist out on the road. But the Zero external quick chargers do put out DC. If they only had charging stations with four or five Zero quick chargers in parallel out on the road, with a long cable, we would be all set for fast Zero road charging. 

There are other ways possible to fast charge with DC--but don't expect to see it until Zero's become a VERY common thing to see on the road--and I think that is unlikely for a while.

My Zero SR has the power tank. So when I am on a long trip, I put a quick-charger in each saddle bag, along with the necessary cables to quickly charge from J1772's. There are other ways to quick charge too such as after market.


-Don-  Reno, NV

[alko]

A dc quick charging station can charge in 20 minutes with just one connection. Thats what I'm talking about. They just installed a dc quick charging station in my home town that charges from 50 kw up to 350 kw. Zeros charge tank is only 6 kw.

[NEW2elec]

The voltage is too low.  The amps needed for 350kws at 116 volts is over 3000 amps.  That was one of the things we were talking about for the SRF which was, would they increase the voltage on the new bike.  They didn't of course and instead went with a 12kw AC charging option.

[MVetter]

The other thing to consider is that even if a DC station via CCS or CHAdeMO were to interface with Zero bikes, all batteries are currently capped at a 1C charge rate under warranty. This means, unless you void the warranty, the absolute fastest you can charge a Zero from empty --> full is 1 hour, no matter the battery size.

[DonTom]

A dc quick charging station can charge in 20 minutes with just one connection. Thats what I'm talking about. They just installed a dc quick charging station in my home town that charges from 50 kw up to 350 kw. Zeros charge tank is only 6 kw.

What type of DC charging station?

Tesla uses 480 volts DC, some now above 120KW (>250 amps).

If you're going to charge with DC, no charge tank is needed on the vehicle. DC charging is the charger, unlike J-1772 which is NOT a charger, just is AC supply power for your charge tank which converts it to the DC for the battery.

If the charger is not in the bike, that means you can have a MUCH larger charger. But you cannot go over the rating of your battery. Fully charging from near 0 SOC to 100% faster than an hour is probably asking for trouble on any of the Zero batteries. More charge current will get the batteries a lot hotter, until the battery is destroyed.

BTW, with the Tesla DC Superchargers, your best charge is done in about 20 minutes. After that, the charge rate MUST drop  to prevent the batteries from overheating. And Teslas have coolant for the batteries. Because of the small size of motorcycles, and the battery, there are many limitations on what you can safely do. Cars, like my Tesla, have more room for things like battery coolant.

It would be nice if there were 1C DC chargers on the road for Zeros, but it is very unlikely to ever happen, unless Zero becomes extremely common the the road.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[ultrarnr]

Zero offered CHAdeMO back around the 2013-2014 time frame. It worked well with Eaton, Fuji and one or two other brands of CHAdeMO chargers. It didn't work well with some of the makes of CHAdeMO systems in California. I had one on order for my 2014 SR for about 6 months before Zero gave up and canceled it. Considering that most of the CHAdeMO systems in North Carolina were Eatons and Fuji it would have been great. Life went on and when Energica dropped their prices I jumped at the chance to get an electric motorcycle with DCFC. Now having done multi-day trips with both a Zero SR equipped with 6.3 kW charging and an Energica with CCS charging I will never buy another electric motorcycle without DCFC capability. Going out to western NC again this year in July, faster charging makes the trip so much more enjoyable.

[alko]

The other thing to consider is that even if a DC station via CCS or CHAdeMO were to interface with Zero bikes, all batteries are currently capped at a 1C charge rate under warranty. This means, unless you void the warranty, the absolute fastest you can charge a Zero from empty --> full is 1 hour, no matter the battery size.

Thanks. I didn't know that. I'm no expert in this field, but your post made sense.

[alko]

What type of DC charging station? Quote

I'll go snap a picture and post it. There is no name on the station. But they are white with green.

[alko]

If you're going to charge with DC, no charge tank is needed on the vehicle. DC charging is the charger, unlike J-1772 which is NOT a charger, just is AC supply power for your charge tank which converts it to the DC for the battery.
[/quote]

Didn't know that either.
Thanks
That seem so simple, so why isn't that a standard?

[alko]

Was told by my Wal-Mart manager that every Wal-Mart in the country will have these by end of year. Too bad it won't help us one damn bit. Come on Zero!

[MVetter]

As I understand it one of the advantages of staying the low voltage range they do means they don't have to spend (millions?) a lot of cash for higher voltage certifications, not to mention a complete redesign of the batteries. As such they get to market it as safer because it's lower voltage. It's not going to zap nearly as painfully if a short happens and you get zapped at 110 volts vs 380.

It seems very likely it's a combination of the heavy investment they already have into their current setup coupled with a giant wad of cash they may not have to make the change. So frankly while the CCS/CHAdeMO stations sound wonderful, most of the infrastructure here in the US is the level 2 stations.

As an exercise, just for funsies, I'd like you to map out couple day trips in different directions on PlugShare. See how many J1772 stations are along your route. Now turn on CCS and see how many of those are along the same routes.

[DonTom]

That seem so simple, so why isn't that a standard?

Perhaps someday there will be. For now, there are too many issues to work out.

However, even now there are many work-arounds for AC charging.  I charge my Zero motorcycles along with two quick chargers (three chargers total) with my Tesla Wall Connector. That way, I do not have to run long thick extension cords all over the house.

I simply use a Tesla-Tap. This will also work on the Tesla "destination chargers" which are the same thing (240 VAC at 48 amps).

However, when it comes to DC charging, there is no simple way to convert high current DC.  Many other issues also, such as  Tesla's 480 volts DC Superchargers. One of the other reasons is that the Tesla Super Chargers authenticate VINs. As soon as I plug in my Tesla, it knows it is MY Tesla. Nothing else other than Tesla can charge from the DC Superchargers.   If I am charged for the Supercharge, it automatically goes to my credit card by just plugging in--no buttons to press or anything.

I doubt I will still be alive when they have a DC standard for charging. We're lucky, IMO, that J1772 became a common AC standard.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[DonTom]

Was told by my Wal-Mart manager that every Wal-Mart in the country will have these by end of year. Too bad it won't help us one damn bit. Come on Zero!

But will help me a lot with my Tesla.

But I always thought it would be nice if the large DC chargers at least had an AC outlet on them that we could use on our Zeros.  120 VAC is so common, but so rare when we need it on the road.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[MVetter]

But I always thought it would be nice if the large DC chargers at least had an AC outlet on them that we could use on our Zeros.  120 VAC is so common, but so rare when we need it on the road.

Uh, I don't know what it's like where you are but in my area it's very common for ChargePoint stations to have both J1772 and a standard 5-15 (wall) outlet on them.