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[Curt]

Of all the make & model subforums, Zero makes up 91.6% of the posts (55143). 73.8% of posts are for Zero 2013+ (44434) and 17.8% are for Zero 2012 and earlier (10709). Within the Zero 2013+ forum, I counted that ~38% are about SR/F, meaning the SR/F already makes up over 25% of all posts on EMF. The next most popular model has 1.8%, and there are already 14 subforums with less than 1% of posts, and six with less than 100 posts.

[Richard230]

What I find interesting are the number of electric motorcycle brands that seem to no longer be with us.  One of the better examples of dead brand forums are the list on:  http://www.elmoto.net/forum.php

After reviewing those old brands, it kind of gives you the idea that many two-wheel EV founders, their employees and their few customers probably had some good ideas that died due to the lack of an EV customer market - especially during the early days of the technology. 

The only company that seems to have really hung in there over the years is Lightning. And they have done that by not producing or selling anything (other than maybe a few LS-218 models).  It is amazing what a lot of hot air can support.   

[Shadow]

...Yo Mods: C'mon man!

Yes? We might agree to rename as Gen 1 (2009-2012), Gen 2 (2013+ S/D/FX), Gen 3 (2020+ Cypher III)?

I hear and appreciate the discussion yet this is presently something I have no access to do.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

...Yo Mods: C'mon man!

Yes? We might agree to rename as Gen 1 (2009-2012), Gen 2 (2013+ S/D/FX), Gen 3 (2020+ Cypher III)?

I hear and appreciate the discussion yet this is presently something I have no access to do.

After asking around about this with some Zero insiders, I think Shadow’s suggestions are the best so far. Gen 1-3 with some years or models. S/DS/FX say for Gen 2 and SR/F etc for Gen 3.

I’d still use SR/F instead of Cypher III unless or until dealers use the term with customers. Otherwise new owners won’t understand where their questions should go.

[togo]

I agree with Shadow and Brian.

[Ayebah]

May I suggest the break be when IPM was implemented. That’s when Zero overrode control of Sevcon

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

May I suggest the break be when IPM was implemented. That’s when Zero overrode control of Sevcon

No, because IPM is invisible to most owners, especially those looking for help with their bikes. People buy these bikes off of dealer lots or secondhand, and the only reason we have a knowledge base is coordinated reverse engineering.

[oobflyer]

Interesting that this is STILL being discussed! Who is the moderator of this forum? Is this a difficult decision?
Yay or Nay?

 

[Shadow]

Moderator yes, no privs however to restructure the forum topics. Will need admin action. Question about whether you want moderator level to be able to do these kinds of things or if it is fine the way it is? Waiting for Zero Motorcycles to show if they have any other Cypher III products to release, too.

[remmie]

Maybe the moderator(s) wanted to wait for the announcement of the all the 2020 models and see if there for example was an DSR/F announced, or even if the entire 2nd generation would be made obsolete. But it seems the SR/F is still the only MAJOR different model from the rest.

So I would say, move the SR/F to the 3rd generation Zero motorcycles section

Like I allready said earlier, just about EVERYTHING is different on the SR/F and I see lots of confusion in answers from other users to a question about an SR/F. They reply with knowledge and solutions from the 2nd generation bikes which is often totally different.

just me 0.02€ 

[Richard230]

Maybe the moderator(s) wanted to wait for the announcement of the all the 2020 models and see if there for example was an DSR/F announced, or even if the entire 2nd generation would be made obsolete. But it seems the SR/F is still the only MAJOR different model from the rest.

So I would say, move the SR/F to the 3rd generation Zero motorcycles section

Like I allready said earlier, just about EVERYTHING is different on the SR/F and I see lots of confusion in answers from other users to a question about an SR/F. They reply with knowledge and solutions from the 2nd generation bikes which is often totally different.

just me 0.02€ 

+1.  I agree - for whatever that is worth.  2 cents, maybe? 

[remmie]

So the 2020 line-up does not feature a DSR/F or FX/F.

But why is there STILL no 3rd generation subforum. I see more and more confusion between models.

For example :  one owner says his SR/F firmware update fails (it even says SR/F in the title) and a 2nd generation owner says that his DSR updated just fine to version 38.
2 totally different way to update. the 2nd generation does this via bluetooth and the app, while the 3rd generation owner (SR/F) does this via the built in GSM connection. So the answer from the DSR owner, with all good intentions, is of absolutely no use to the original poster of the thread 

I still vote for a seperate subforum for the 3rd generation models

Or the moderators should just plain say NO. That is still an answer.

[Shadow]

Or the moderators should just plain say NO. That is still an answer.

Moderator is just me, and before I asked to do it there was two admin(s) and no moderator. Changing forum and sub-forum structure may break outside links and is currently admin level privilege. We've done it recently with the change from Racing to Events. You'll notice that I've applied the same treatment to this discussion... the thread is pinned to the top, and we're getting some nice information to learn from.

Note in my experience the admins are quick to respond to all requests however I don't think it is very clear *what* you would like to happen.

Meanwhile we might tag every SR/F topic with "SR/F"; that is a way to keep the discussion free-flowing. I do have the ability to rename topics so that is something I could help you with. It is also something you can do yourself without any admin or moderator when posting and there's no rule against doing so.

> > What are they calling the new software? Crypto-something?

> Cypher III. Which no owner is going to think of, and potential owners definitely won’t.

When you think about the lack of service manual from Zero, kind of fits, haha.

Buying a Honda NM4.  Service manual was $45 on the used market, and is an inch thick.

I'm okay with move/rename topics that are better off to be in another location, that's what a moderator is for. Some will figure it out and especially if you're already used to it that won't be any issue.

Where I'm personally still confused is how we ever got along so well with FX and S/DS but now SR/F is too different?   I thought the 2013+ split was because of pack voltages and how the old parts are completely different than the new ones. Was it a problem that FX and S/DS shared a same sub-forum?  We could split those out too and I just want to know what is the action that will make it easier (less problems)?

[Crissa]

Well, in this forum are models that have to go to the dealer to update the firmware.

Yes, there was also an update of the app - but that affected everyone.  They updated all the apps, so the menus are all different, even on my 2014.  (I had to un-pair and then run the app for it to work, btw.)

There's now three generations of chargers, too.  I was at the dealer today, and at close there was me, a guy on a new SR and another guy on a new SR/F.  We all charge different, we all have different uses, and we all have different motors.  But what we share is greater.  Battery configuration, battery management, history.  They were impressed to see a five year old bike that's not been babied to still have most of its battery capacity.

We share more than we don't.  All that experience with the older models is experience that new riders of SR/Fs need to have access to.

-Crissa

[heroto]

No malice or offense intended to the mods or anyone.\
Long past time to create an SR/F specific thread or similar
Suspect more tree branches to follow .