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[BamBam]

I'm no expert, but according to the link provided above by Togo.........yes.

[ESokoloff]

Thank you for that.
It's not what I wanted to hear/read, but I won't shoot the messenger

But now which charging strategy is more important to battery longevity.
Lower then 100% level or cell ballence?
Is it possible to get both?

Perhaps alternate charge strategies?

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

Thank you for that.
It's not what I wanted to hear/read, but I won't shoot the messenger

But now which charging strategy is more important to battery longevity.
Lower then 100% level or cell ballence?
Is it possible to get both?

Perhaps alternate charge strategies?

Cell balance is achievable if the charger plateaus at 80% or 110V just as easily as 100%. The BMS just does this while charging and taper assists.

Zero published the new charging recommendations a year ago and the entire owner community has fretted incessantly about it.

It’s still okay to charge to 100% but long term resting states are better if no higher than 80%. Like, really long term. Short term parking at 80% is good if you can afford it in your daily commute.

100% is built into their warranty. 80% just gives you more life than the warranty implies.

[ESokoloff]

My commute is about 55 miles round trip. 2016 DSR (no Power Tank).

My present daily commute routine is to charge at work.
Typically I'll have 70% +- when I get home.
If for some reason I have less then 60-65%, I'll top off to at least that level.
When I arrive at work I'll have approx 25% left.

I like to maintain that surplus in case of road closures or having to return home before the end of work/full charge (I.E. range anxiety).

At this point, I'm thinking that I'll try to unplug somewhere around 80%+  (providing this allows full cell balance.
Whether I do this occasional or habitually to be determined..........

What I've found when stoping charging below 100% is that after unplugging, the charge level will (falsely) be higher then it would if allowed to charge to 100%.
This false figure will come into play if one were to push the range to the max. (Don't ask how I know!!!). Limp home mode sucks (but works).

Hopefully by the time this battery degrades to the point of effecting performance, Solid State battery's will be available with all their advanced advantages.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

Unplugging the charger in the middle of the charge is not the same as setting the charger so that it levels off at a lower voltage.

It should balance better if you use a charger level-off setting instead of pulling the plug.

Also, unplugging the onboard charger while it's operating is a bad idea; I think we all agree that the Calex 1200 is a piece of equipment not worth messing with.

If you're commuting every day, there's very little benefit for you not to charge to 100%. The difference between 100% and 80% for that time period is not going to be critical.

It seems like it's much easier for you to just "not charge" when you finish a commute leg and you're at 60-70%, and then wait for the end of the next leg to actually charge, rather than trying to get an 80% target.

[ESokoloff]

I'm a nebee in EV/charging so bare with me.

Sounds like the stock charger (which I have) is not charge level selectable & thus my best option with it is to just leave plugged in until the charge is compleat (100%). 

When charging above 80%, is it storage time or level above 80% that is (most) detrimental to battery longevity?

On average, the bike sits for 1.5 hrs at most after charge is compleat before I start my home bound leg. 

I'm trying to maximize my charging at work to help offset the cost of the bike & I'm trying to learn/understand the optimal charging scheme.
If I can extend the battery life I'm all ears...... ummmmmm eyes

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

Per http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/owner-resources/charging-recommendations/

All they are saying is that normally, you should unplug it when the charge is complete. (Not before)

For long-term storage, 30-70% is a better range for the battery.

So, it only matters how long it sits continuously above 80% or whatever. What I've heard suggests that it's just a matter of whether the battery chemistry sits around for a very long time at a high state of charge.

You're not doing that. So this is not a concern for you, except maybe for long term winter storage.

[ESokoloff]

I ride Weather or not so no storage concerns. 

To recap.....

The Ultimate battery longevity can only be achieved with an aftermarket charger that can be configured to stop charging at a predetermined level (voltage) & it will then balance the cells.

However, using the stock charger & following Zero’s recommendations should still yeld an exceptable life from the battery.

Hope my understanding on this is correct. 
I was happy following the Zero procedure until I read the link Togo provided.


The only thing I question on the Zero recommendation is “charge after each usage”.
What if your running  errands? You won’t charge at each stop (unless range anxiety is an issue).


On my commute I start @ 100% at the end of work. I then ride home with 60+% & leave that level overnight.
Ride to work & plug in @ +-20%.

Is this reasonable or should I plug in/top off to 100% at home too?
Work encourages EV & I would like to use their power instead of mine (providing I’m not compromising battery longevity).

The question is which is more detrimental?
Leaving battery at 100% or 64-74% overnight/weekend?

[dennis-NL]

I commute 80km to work on a 2013DS 12,5kW.
If I ride performance (120-140km/h) the battery will be 15-20% at work and will be charging for like 6 hours to get 100% on 1,3kW charging.
But the cable will be connected for 8-9 hours depending my working day.

At home it will stay longer on loader till the morning I leave again.

For me I think it should not be bad for the battery, because I use it every day (in weekend I <also> drive for fun ;-) )
Think the recommendations are only for the extreme periods of time not using the bike?

But I will be following this item because now ordered the Diginow 2.5 bellypan mounted 3,3kW version wich I can program to stop charging at certain level power.
The cell balancing bit is for me very important, I will want it to be finished in good fashion.

By the way, my experience:
* usable battery capacity: 11,3kW (12.5 battery)
   - 3 times I had it driven to completly empty and me pushing, oops!, my fault thinking 3% in the app is really 3% (also on dashboard was 0 when app showed 15%, so I was allready breaking my luck)
   - it will drop in speed first 100km/h....20km/h, and: shutdown when I was doing like 10km/h on a bicycle lane and using about 0,3kW for allready 4km, and: walk
   - to bad you can't put it in neutral
* 50-110km/h  travels: 85-100W/km
* 110-140km/h travels: 100-140W/km

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

Here are screenshots of my iOS based Bluetooth app control screens (but not the protocol details). The buttons send preset configurations to the V2.5 charging controller.

[dennis-NL]

Oki, that looks allready fine.
Is this app gonna be released soon?
I mean when people like me get the v2.5 bellypan version is the app available and workable for noobs like me?
Also on Android I hope.... 

[togo]

Even without the app,

1140,90,1,800,0,50

Should instruct a single-unit diginow v2.5 to charge to 114v at 800 watts.

[dennis-NL]

Oki, but I suppose first have too make connection (with/how?) and have a password?
Any manual for it online?

[originalspacerob]

I have been wondering the same as DennisNL. I also am getting thr belly pan 2.5 and wondered how to write the commands. I guess we can always ask Morgan when we get them. I asked the question about the basic strings in one of my emails and did not hear anything. Brian, can you maybe steer us in the direction of how the strings work and how to write them?  The app is available for sending bluetooth commands already but Diginow is supposed to release an actual app to control the chargers. In the meantime we need to use the app Brian is using. I just don’t know how to get the commands and if the chargers come with basic ones to use so we are familiar with the process.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[originalspacerob]

I ride Weather or not so no storage concerns. 

To recap.....

The Ultimate battery longevity can only be achieved with an aftermarket charger that can be configured to stop charging at a predetermined level (voltage) & it will then balance the cells.

However, using the stock charger & following Zero’s recommendations should still yeld an exceptable life from the battery.

Hope my understanding on this is correct. 
I was happy following the Zero procedure until I read the link Togo provided.


The only thing I question on the Zero recommendation is “charge after each usage”.
What if your running  errands? You won’t charge at each stop (unless range anxiety is an issue).


On my commute I start @ 100% at the end of work. I then ride home with 60+% & leave that level overnight.
Ride to work & plug in @ +-20%.

Is this reasonable or should I plug in/top off to 100% at home too?
Work encourages EV & I would like to use their power instead of mine (providing I’m not compromising battery longevity).

The question is which is more detrimental?
Leaving battery at 100% or 64-74% overnight/weekend?

My commute is similar to yours. On my way to work I use about 20% of the battery. So i use this process.

Charge at work to 100%
Ride home arrive with 75-80%
Ride back to work and arrive with 50-60%
Charge at work for 4-5 hours and leave it plugged in until i go home.
Leave work with 100%

Start cycle again.

I have only plugged in at home 4 or so times the rest is work paying for my commute and errands.

Thats my typical commute. I don’t think the 2-4 hours staying plugged in is going to hurt anything and seems to be well within battery guide lines and Zero Recommendations. Staying at 100% charge for really long times,like weeks is bad and I can see that.
   


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk