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[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

Thanks for charting that. Onboard charger troubleshooting and prediction would be good to improve.

Is that the way a charger fails?  Or could it be one or more failing cells in the battery pack that are reaching an excessively high voltage and that causes the BMS to shut the charger off?  In my case, I found that the charger would cut off at 92%, but if you left it plugged in for a few more days, the voltage would increase about 2% a day, until 98% would be indicated, at which time I would pull the plug and go riding.   

I don't know! Your hypothesis sounds very good and testable, though, via logs.

[hubert]

each time I checked with the app, the imbalance was shown at about 3mV. Means there is no issue with the battery itself, hopefully.

[Richard230]

each time I checked with the app, the imbalance was shown at about 3mV. Means there is no issue with the battery itself, hopefully.

I had similar cell balance readings when I had my 2014 w/PT, but I am just not sure how reliable those voltages are.  After four years and hundreds of recharges I would have expected that the various pack voltages would be off more than that, plus I am also not sure just what packs are being monitored by the app/BMS system. The number flash up on the screen kind of randomly and don't indicate which pack voltage is being tested. In particular, I wonder if it is really checking the Power Tank (which failed once when the PT was first installed and needed to be completely replaced by a factory technician). The voltages displayed on the app seem to be checking only three or four cell packs, not the five that I believe a 2014 S with a PT has installed in the chassis. 

[dvdt]

I can now answer my own question regarding time to on-board charger failure from observation of initial symptoms of degradation --- about 8 months. My 2014 on-board charger failed (suddenly) to a state that tripped GFI. My local dealer's service department was booked for several weeks, but suggested that the factory might be able to assist. Indeed, the factory was able to help out (props to the various folks in Zero's customer service), so I'm back on the road with an updated on-board charger.

There is now at least one case for which a degrading on-board charger can fail suddenly, please bear that in mind when planning journeys. In my case, if the degrading on-board charger had failed one day sooner, I would have had an unplanned long walk....

[hubert]

Hello dvdt, what do you mean with "updated charger"? Has it been replaced, or repaired via a miracle firmware up?

[Richard230]

I can now answer my own question regarding time to on-board charger failure from observation of initial symptoms of degradation --- about 8 months. My 2014 on-board charger failed (suddenly) to a state that tripped GFI. My local dealer's service department was booked for several weeks, but suggested that the factory might be able to assist. Indeed, the factory was able to help out (props to the various folks in Zero's customer service), so I'm back on the road with an updated on-board charger.

There is now at least one case for which a degrading on-board charger can fail suddenly, please bear that in mind when planning journeys. In my case, if the degrading on-board charger had failed one day sooner, I would have had an unplanned long walk....

Was there any warning before it failed?  Did it slowly refuse to charge to 100% (or in my 2014 S's case only charging to 92% and 113 volts) or did the charger operate normally, before it suddenly failed, which in your case sounds like an internal short? 

[dvdt]

Howdy Hubert
 what do you mean with "updated charger" --- the on board charger was replaced with a new on board charger having an updated part number. Unfortunately, no miracle firmware solution, my regrets for the ambiguous wording.

Hi Richard
The charger operated normally one evening, charging to about 95% at time I unplugged it to begin my return ride home. In the recent past, 96% was as high as the on-board charger would reach. The next morning, plugging in at work at a GFI 120VAC outlet I've used many times in the past several years, the GFI would trip immediately. I tried a few other circuits (perhaps not the most prudent choice in retrospect) with similar results of tripping GFI.

[Richard230]

Howdy Hubert
 what do you mean with "updated charger" --- the on board charger was replaced with a new on board charger having an updated part number. Unfortunately, no miracle firmware solution, my regrets for the ambiguous wording.

Hi Richard
The charger operated normally one evening, charging to about 95% at time I unplugged it to begin my return ride home. In the recent past, 96% was as high as the on-board charger would reach. The next morning, plugging in at work at a GFI 120VAC outlet I've used many times in the past several years, the GFI would trip immediately. I tried a few other circuits (perhaps not the most prudent choice in retrospect) with similar results of tripping GFI.

Thanks for the update.  I'll keep my fingers crossed that my daughter's charger hangs in there.  She is in the process of buying a home and doesn't need any surprise expenses.

[hubert]

OK, thank you dvdt for the news. And ahh, the most imporant question, was it replaced in warranty despite the 2014 being OOW? If not, how much have you been charged for the charger? :-)

[Булгаков]

my OEM charger failed suddenly on my 2014 Zero, no previous warning. it was replaced under warranty though.

[zerovolt]

For me ,  Zero motorcycle  is cool ... Thanks ZERO...

On my zero s 2014 48000 KMS,    the company gave me and install new charger for free, about 1300 $ can., under warranty.

My old charger  had passed slowly 100 % to 85 % last 2 months.

[Richard230]

For me ,  Zero motorcycle  is cool ... Thanks ZERO...

On my zero s 2014 48000 KMS,    the company gave me and install new charger for free, about 1300 $ can., under warranty.

My old charger  had passed slowly 100 % to 85 % last 2 months.

My question is: Is that the charger failing, or is that an indication that there is an issue with one of more cells of the battery pack?  My daughter's charger shuts off at 92%, but if she leaves it plugged in for a week, the charger will turn on by itself once a day and charge for a short time before shutting down again. Eventually the pack's charge display will climb to 100%. So what does that mean? 

[zerovolt]

in june   the charger 'issue was ecxatly similar to bike' daughter. But , in july and august , the top charge was 85 %,  112 volts never  more

[Richard230]

in june   the charger 'issue was ecxatly similar to bike' daughter. But , in july and august , the top charge was 85 %,  112 volts never  more

I don't know what to make of that.  I wonder what could fail in a charger that would make it stop charging at 112 volts?  I might add that when my daughter's 2014 S would stop charging at 92% the voltage on the Zero app would indicate 113 volts.

[hubert]

Did some chargings with an external charger adjusted at 116.5V, and indeed, I can get 100% again. Using only the onboard charger, it tops at 95% (before unplugging), and at start of riding the display falls immediately down to 93%.

Definitely not a battery issue! The remaining question, how long until the onboard charger dies completely?