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[stbrandon]

Hi all!

I recently test drove a 2017 Zero SR after reading up quite a bit on them. 

I'm currently paying on an ICE bike (2015 Honda CTX700) but am wanting to convert over to electric and fell absolutely in love with the SR when I rode it.  My motorcycle is my only transportation and I ride year round as my commuter to work.

I originally wasn't a serious buyer, but as it's a demo model they reached out and now are trying to offload it at 3500.00 off and it has less than 60 miles on it at this point. 

I'd need to trade in my bike (surely at a loss) or try and sell it private party, and my wife is also a hard sell as the upfront cost compared to my ICE bike is high in her eyes. 

Any advice?  Should I try and squeeze them down further on the price as they obviously are trying to offload it (they called me with an additional 1000 down after I told them I liked the bike but couldn't make the transition yet). 

Any insight from you more knowledgeable EV bike riders would be helpful

Thanks!

[ESokoloff]

My advise? (It's worth what you'll pay for it).........

Keep your ICE for a few more years until Solid State battery's make their way to E-moto's.

By that time taking a (BIG) hit on the ICE won't hurt as bad & hopefully be offsetted by greater E-motor selection (manufactures), greater range, reduced charge time & lower price of admission.

I elected to jump in (to E-moto) early due to my ICE-moto's age/mileage as will as my own age (wanted to ENJOY E-moto while I could/can).
Also my employer encourages EV's so I save on fill-ups that help offset the elivated cost of current EV's.

Good luck on your decisions. 

[Rugby4life]

Hi STB,
I made the leap to a demo '17 SR about a week ago. I also use my bike as my full time transportation. I've been commuting year-round since '89. This is my 33rd bike since 1980. First, their offer is pretty good. I got mine for about $4k off but that was after quite a bit of haggling so I think you've squeezed about all you'll get out of them. My wife of 28 years gave up long ago trying to keep up with my bike purchases. Usually she notices when I leave on one bike and come home on a different one (although once it took 2 days because the bikes were the same color). We came to an agreement that as long as the net costs don't affect the family budget, I could buy whatever I wanted.
When calculating net cost, be sure to highlight the vastly reduced maintenance costs and refueling savings. Have you paired your smartphone to the bike using the ZERO app? Plug in your home's cost per KW/h, MPG of your present bike (or her car), and the local cost of a gallon of gas (my bike required mid-grade). If you can charge free at work, that's an additional boost in savings. The app will tell you how much you've saved and what your cost per mile is. Mine is $0.013 per mile and I've saved $44 in gas. My bike has 650 miles of which I contributed 450 of them. I would suggest you get the dealer to charge the bike overnight to get a full and balanced charge, Then take it on an endurance run to see how far you can go on a single charge riding the same roads and riding style as your daily commute. Use the data from that ride to come up with a baseline. Another major selling point I had was that I leave for work at 6am while she gets to sleep 2hrs later. When I was riding some previous bikes, the sound of the exhaust (looking at you Ducatis and Yamaha Roadliner) on start up would shake the walls and wake her (and the neighbors) up earlier than she wanted.
Depending on where you live, the onset of colder weather can drive down the value the bike you're selling faster than the thermometer. If possible, hold on to your Honda until spring when everyone gets the itch to ride again and used bike prices are at their max. I buy most of my used bikes in the window of time from 1 week before black Friday when people want cash for the "big sales" and 2nd week of Jan when the credit card bills from Christmas come due. Since folks "need" the money and see the bike sitting in the corner of the garage and know they won't ride it for another 4-5 months, they'll sell it for a song. I pick up those bikes for 1/2 of what they'll sell for in the spring.

[domingo3]

  I think the '17 SR for 3500 is a fair deal.  Depending on where you live, the market is so small for these that it can literally be affected by one person.  You could buy it now at the price they're offering.  If someone else buys that one, then you'll probably only have the option of a new '18 at MSRP or shipping a used or demo unit from somewhere distant.  If nobody buys the one by you, you may be able to get it for $1000 less next summer.  I don't think they'll drop the price a whole lot more than that.  For the next few years, I believe it will always make financial sense to push back the purchase of a Zero - next years' model will always be looming around the corner with a few new features and longer range, and used or demo prices will drop accordingly.  However, if you keep following that logic, you'll never own one!


  While it's true that you save money on oil changes, valve checks, etc., I don't think that you can make a purely financial argument to buy a Zero compared to holding on to your Honda.  You can slice and dice the projected costs however you like, but it really comes down to if it's worth the premium to go electric.  It was for me.

[Shadow]

Think about what happens when your Zero needs to go to the shop for a couple of months (or more?) - would you regret your decision?

If you can still get to work without the Zero as your only bike, then I say yes do that.

Maybe something as simple as a regular service call can turn into months with a Zero in the shop. If you interact with a shop just plan for not having your bike a few months.

[stbrandon]

Are Zero's not reliable bikes?  I know there is a chance of defects and such on anything, but reliability is important to me regardless of lag time on repairs. 

I do have access to a car when needed.

[domingo3]

Shadow brings up a good point.  Many of us believe that Zeros overall are pretty reliable, but we don't really have good data to generate statistics.  Anecdotally, the people who do have issues often wait quite a while to get them back on the road.  My personal experience was a month to replace a motor under warranty.  Maybe you could try to negotiate with the dealer to promise a loaner bike if there was an issue.

[Doug S]

Personally, I've never thought Zeros are especially reliable. EVs have the POTENTIAL to be very reliable, based on much simpler design, but the technology (especially charging technology) and the companies are far from mature. My experience pretty much bears that out -- a poorly designed rear shock required two warranty replacements and then one out of my own pocket, the rear wheel bearing failed due to being underdesigned, an unreliable onboard charger has been replaced twice, and there was a disaster with an aftermarket item which shall go nameless. That's not a very good record for a bike with 36,000 miles on it, but they're all what I said: poor design by a startup company which doesn't have much design experience yet, and an aftermarket item which you could say the same thing about.

It's worth noting that all of those things have been upgraded since my 2014 SR was built. Current suspensions and bearings are much better designs using better components, the charger has (at least we're told) been upgraded, and even the aftermarket part is much improved now. I'm still convinced that Zero will BECOME much more reliable than just about any ICE bike, but I'm not at all sure they're there yet. I hope I'm wrong and they've already surpassed their ICE competition.

[buutvrij for life]

In general, from MY '15 and newer, Zero's are reliable.
But they can't beat a Honda regarding reliability.

[Shadow]

Are Zero's not reliable bikes?  I know there is a chance of defects and such on anything, but reliability is important to me regardless of lag time on repairs. 

I do have access to a car when needed.

Say then you should get a Zero and experience the joy of efficient and expedient travel   Accelerates like a luxury Tesla car for 1/10th of the cost. Although I would only recommend an EV with 6kW or better charging system, based on my year and more of daily riding a Zero DSR. The bikes are great with standard 1kW charging for going to work and charge while at work, going home and charge while at home. For thousands of dollars cost you may want more than just to commute, how about riding because it is enjoyable? With 1kW charging only, you will be limited in your joy and use of the machine.

[NEW2elec]

I won't copy Doug S's quote for size reasons but he said it perfectly.
Some bikes have been tougher than others and the great ones don't get the volume of praise equal to the complaints of some lemons.
The only other bad issue is the limited places to get any issues fixed.  If you have a bad shut down problem can you get the bike to a Zero dealer and how far away and willing are they to work on the bike?  Some dealers put them at the back of the line, sometimes more than once.

Good luck, if you get one, they are an amazing ride experience but don't have 100 years of improvements behind them like ICE bikes.

[Electric Terry]

A 2017 SR for $3500 off is an amazing deal and I'd say get it!  I've got over 125,000 miles on Zero's now and I will echo what has been stated.  If you carry a lot of things or weigh more than 150 pounds, the 2014's and earlier could have suspension and bearing issues.  I had 4 sets of bearings go out on my 2012 Zero S over 80,000 miles but I was also carrying double the GVWR weight.

My 2015 has about 45,000 miles on it now and has been totally reliable with the exception of the onboard charger, which after its most recent failure I finally decided to remove it and replace it with 13,000 watts of charger power, where the old one was only 1300 watts so it charges 10 times faster. 

The bikes get more reliable every year, so the 2017 is probably as good or better than many ICE bikes.  Of course I am going to say go down and buy that bike today and start riding it!  Try to sell the Honda private party, vs trade-in, but if you wait too long (as was said above) that SR might disappear and you'll then be forced to get a 2018 Zero locally.  Not that that is terrible, just more expensive and it sounds like you might have a wif....errr....I mean budget you need to keep happy.

[gyrocyclist]

Are Zero's not reliable bikes?  I know there is a chance of defects and such on anything, but reliability is important to me regardless of lag time on repairs. 

I do have access to a car when needed.

8K miles on my 2016 SR with no problems. Sounds like a great deal.

[wavelet]

stbrandon, what do you do with your current bike besides commuting? I presume your DCX700 has the half-fairing (which IIUC is standard) and according to some quick googling, real-world fuel tank range on it is 180-200mi
That makes it fine for middleweight touring.

The Zero's range  at highway speeds is 80mi, or 100mi if you have the Power Tank. That makes it IMO not usable for touring, unless you spend several $K and a lot of DIY effort on mounting 3d-party chargers, and even then you need to plan charging stops ahead.
Also, there's currently no factory or 3d-party fairing solution (there a couple of people who've rolled their own), a.f.a. weather protection goes.

[stbrandon]

I primarily commute and take short fun drives around town.  Sadly, I have no riding friends to tour with.  I wanted to do day trips and such, but it’s never happened.

If I wasn’t upside down on my ICE bike I’d be jumping on this demo Zero no questions asked.  Sadly, I just don’t have the cash to pay my bike off to swap to a new one with as large of a monthly jump as the Zero would be even at a discount.

It’s still there a week later, so who knows.  Maybe they will reach out to me again with a better deal as it sits on their floor longer!