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[cjmdjm]

Hi all,

I've been toying with the idea of getting an electric motorcycle for years now, mainly for commuting, and a little weekend fun.  I have an 8 mile commute, so I don't need a lot of range.  20 miles of range would get me there and back easily (mix of city and highway).

The last time I checked, several years ago, you could get a new electric bike from $6999 (the 3.1 kwh Brammo Enertia).  A little reading reveals that as far back as 2009, you could get an Enertia for $7999.  I thought I'd wait a few years for prices to drop.

Today in 2017, with a little googling, I can't find anything cheaper than the Zero FX 3.3 kwh, starting at $8499, which is more of a dirt bike.  Am I missing something?  Surely with improving technology, better batteries, electronics, and motors since 2009, the cost of an entry level electric motorcycle hasn't gone... up?

Thanks guys!

[andrews]

Super Soco?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[benswing]

There is now a healthy used market for Zeros and you can find some 2013+ Zeros with 100+ miles of range for less than the price of a new 3.3kWh Zero FX.  Take a look on cycletrader and elsewhere.

[cjmdjm]

Yeah, I've looked at electric bicycles, which can be had for under $1000, but are usually limited to 20mph.  This is a little slow for my 8 mile commute, which also involves 4 or 5 miles of interstate highway/freeway, where a bicycle won't work.  Similarly, bikes like the Super Soco are limited to 28mph (though the range is pretty good).

I guess I had hoped that by now there would be something between the Super Soco and the 8 year old Brammo Enertia (62mph, 20 to 40 mile range).  But it appears that you can't have anything like an Enertia for less than $8400, compared to $6999 back 3 years ago.  Benswing might have it right, used might be the way to go.  Maybe a used Zero FX, or maybe there are low miles Enertias still floating around.

[benswing]

There are a few Zeros between 6-8k that are 2013+.  I wouldn't get anything 2012 or earlier unless you are an electronics wiz and like troubleshooting. 

https://www.cycletrader.com/search-results?type=Motorcycle%7C356953&radius=any&zip=07042&price=*%3A10000&sort=price%3Aasc&modelkeyword=1&layoutView=listView&page=1&make=Zero%20Motorcycles%7C705321056&

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

Maybe you should consider an alternative explanation, that those businesses were offering the bikes at too low a price to stay in business.

[MrDude_1]

There are good reasons Zeros don't become cheaper each year like disc players and TVs.
As the batteries and other parts became cheaper, they used the "additional" profit to expand. Once expanded they could buy better motorcycle parts because they're in bulk. So while the price has not gone down, the bikes are greatly improved and they're selling them at a sustainable level.
Maybe you dont need a better product, but they need one to stay in business.

[togo]

Amen!

[Erasmo]

Yeah, I've looked at electric bicycles, which can be had for under $1000, but are usually limited to 20mph.  This is a little slow for my 8 mile commute, which also involves 4 or 5 miles of interstate highway/freeway, where a bicycle won't work.  Similarly, bikes like the Super Soco are limited to 28mph (though the range is pretty good).

I guess I had hoped that by now there would be something between the Super Soco and the 8 year old Brammo Enertia (62mph, 20 to 40 mile range).  But it appears that you can't have anything like an Enertia for less than $8400, compared to $6999 back 3 years ago.  Benswing might have it right, used might be the way to go.  Maybe a used Zero FX, or maybe there are low miles Enertias still floating around.

Most of the time you can hack those e-bikes to a higher speed, but to be honest you make up a lot of time since you don't have to deal with traffic shenanigans. Isn't there a way to work that doesn't include highways?

[MrDude_1]

Yeah, I've looked at electric bicycles, which can be had for under $1000, but are usually limited to 20mph.  This is a little slow for my 8 mile commute, which also involves 4 or 5 miles of interstate highway/freeway, where a bicycle won't work.  Similarly, bikes like the Super Soco are limited to 28mph (though the range is pretty good).

I guess I had hoped that by now there would be something between the Super Soco and the 8 year old Brammo Enertia (62mph, 20 to 40 mile range).  But it appears that you can't have anything like an Enertia for less than $8400, compared to $6999 back 3 years ago.  Benswing might have it right, used might be the way to go.  Maybe a used Zero FX, or maybe there are low miles Enertias still floating around.

Most of the time you can hack those e-bikes to a higher speed, but to be honest you make up a lot of time since you don't have to deal with traffic shenanigans. Isn't there a way to work that doesn't include highways?

my e-bike goes 45mph sustained for a little over 20 miles before it starts to slow... or 100+ miles if I keep it to normal bicycle speeds.

[hubert]

8 miles (13km), that's quite easy with a good bicycle (except if there is a big mountain inside). With or without electric motor. e-bikes are limited to 20mph in the US and even worse, 25km/h in the EU. However, it is soooo easy to get a "conversion kit" from china or elsewhere which takes your bike far beyond the official limits. That's the way I went 9 years ago to commute 2x20km with the e-bicycle every day instead of that stinky poisonous diesel car. Now I'm still commuting the same distance, either with the Zero S (lazyness) or with the (not electric) velomobile which is a kinda muscular fighter aircraft (at  ground level....) and is so comfortable yet getting wet very quickly!

[togo]

Throw that Velo shell on that Zero S, see how few wh/mile, you get! : - )

[cjmdjm]

Maybe you should consider an alternative explanation, that those businesses were offering the bikes at too low a price to stay in business.

Yeah, that's the only conclusion I can see.  I had hoped that I had missed a cheaper 60mph bike in my search.  Brammo must not have been making a profit on the Enertia at those prices (they did go out of business, after all).  And Victory chose to sell only the pricier Empulse.

I do also wonder if demand just isn't growing quick enough.  Tesla, for instance, sold like 10x more of their Model S, than their original Roadster.  And they are looking to sell 10x more of their new Model 3, than the Model S/X.  Maybe it's the increasing demand that allows them to lower prices, using economies of scale.  If electric motorcycles just aren't catching on, then they can't lower costs with economies of scale.  Much as it sounds great to me, to get rid of the manual transmission, loud engine, and vibrations of a gas bike, your average biker may not agree.  Most may find these things essential to the motorcycling experience.

Still, high tech gadgets going down in price every year, is usually a very safe bet.

Now I'm still commuting the same distance, either with the Zero S (lazyness) or with the (not electric) velomobile which is a kinda muscular fighter aircraft (at  ground level....) and is so comfortable yet getting wet very quickly!

I had never heard of a velomobile before, thats very cool!  Rather like the enclosed bike that holds the human powered world speed record (82mph!).  What kind do you have exactly?  I wonder how fast something like that could go, if equipped with a Zero motorcycle powertrain?  A little reading reveals that a motorcycle experiences about the same force of air drag as a car, which explains why highway range is so much worse than city range, and so hard for electric motorcycles, vs electric cars.  But a velomobile should be much more slippery.

[Ashveratu]

If you can overlook the lack of future (or current) factory service/parts support, you maybe able to find a Victory Empulse on cycletrader for around 8 or 9 grand. I recently put a $500 deposit on one. My current Brammo Empulse is still going strong, just passed 6k miles.

[Feee]

Hope you guys don't mind me jumping in... Any advice on an affordable bike in the UK?! 🤔😀