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[nevetsyad]

This part of their message was confusing:

"The intermittent cut outs are a bit more difficult to determine in the logs, but it looked like they happened most often after charging, without completely turning off the bike. I would recommend key cycling the bike after charging the bike, and before riding."

Are they admitting that they can see my cutouts but it's my fault for not turning the bike off and on at the right times when charging?

[Shadow]

Sounds to me like they're suggesting you try something, and see if the problem remains. If the problem goes away, then you could try the other way and cause the problem again. That could narrow down the possibilities and lead some better information for developing a fix.

[nevetsyad]

It sounds like they think my bike is on while charging some times? I don't leave it on while charging, maybe some part of it isn't turning off? Either way, it's at the dealership, why aren't they looking into this and testing it? They want to send it home after the plastics are back on. I can't help but think I'm going to be riding it back there the next weekend after I take it home.

[MajorMajor]

Can't they give you the bike back to use until the plastics arrive? (how far away is the dealer?)

[nevetsyad]

It's about an hour away, at the closest dealer that still works on Zeros. Apparently, most of the plastics are already on it now, they're still waiting on one though.

I'm frustrated that there's something physically wrong with my bike, and I'm being given a fourth firmware update to fix it. My voltage will still drop to 92v when I'm trying to do highway speeds. If this update tells the bike that it's okay to keep putting out ~600 amps while the voltage is that low, I'm sure the voltage will drop even lower. I can't wait to see how the bike functions at 80v.

The bike will still randomly turn off when it shorts out also. Screw it, at least I got someone from Zero to reply to me once. They even looked at the logs I pointed out and finally said that there's a problem. Only took 18 months. That's sadly become a win in my book!

[MichaelJohn]

7 weeks and counting now.

"snip"

After all this, I wish I kept my Honda NC750 SD. Or even the VFR 1200FD and its sky high running costs. But then I wouldn't have had the pleasure of riding my Zero.  I hope, by some magic, that my bike is back on the road soon.

I thought you might regret getting rid of your NC. I appreciate mine more all the time. I am so sorry that you have had to go through this prolonged wait. When my BMS failed my bike was at the dealership for 4 weeks and Scotts Valley is only 70 miles from me. If I did not have a second motorcycle I would have been a lot more impatient than I was. I know that Zero is a young company and there are bound to be teething issues but I find it mildly ironic that the simple electric motorcycle which is touted for having so few moving parts and being almost maintenance-free is far less reliable than my complicated old gas burner that has run perfectly from day one and I never think twice about it. I love my SR - but I would not be without a second motorcycle.

[Fivespeed302]

7 weeks and counting now.

"snip"

After all this, I wish I kept my Honda NC750 SD. Or even the VFR 1200FD and its sky high running costs. But then I wouldn't have had the pleasure of riding my Zero.  I hope, by some magic, that my bike is back on the road soon.

I thought you might regret getting rid of your NC. I appreciate mine more all the time. I am so sorry that you have had to go through this prolonged wait. When my BMS failed my bike was at the dealership for 4 weeks and Scotts Valley is only 70 miles from me. If I did not have a second motorcycle I would have been a lot more impatient than I was. I know that Zero is a young company and there are bound to be teething issues but I find it mildly ironic that the simple electric motorcycle which is touted for having so few moving parts and being almost maintenance-free is far less reliable than my complicated old gas burner that has run perfectly from day one and I never think twice about it. I love my SR - but I would not be without a second motorcycle.

I felt the same for a couple of years but now it's very reliable.  I hope you get yours sorted out because it is amazing once you don't have to worry about it..

[MostlyBonkers]

7 weeks and counting now.

"snip"

After all this, I wish I kept my Honda NC750 SD. Or even the VFR 1200FD and its sky high running costs. But then I wouldn't have had the pleasure of riding my Zero.  I hope, by some magic, that my bike is back on the road soon.

I thought you might regret getting rid of your NC. I appreciate mine more all the time. I am so sorry that you have had to go through this prolonged wait. When my BMS failed my bike was at the dealership for 4 weeks and Scotts Valley is only 70 miles from me. If I did not have a second motorcycle I would have been a lot more impatient than I was. I know that Zero is a young company and there are bound to be teething issues but I find it mildly ironic that the simple electric motorcycle which is touted for having so few moving parts and being almost maintenance-free is far less reliable than my complicated old gas burner that has run perfectly from day one and I never think twice about it. I love my SR - but I would not be without a second motorcycle.

I remember our conversations when I bought the NC750. It is an extremely good motorcycle. Hindsight is a wonderful thing!

I'm hoping to get my Zero back on the road at some point. I'd like to put a few thousand miles on it before I get rid. At the moment, I don't know if I'll feel confident enough to keep it beyond the warranty period. I'm also going to ask that Zero extend my warranty for a year as a form of compensation.

The situation is so bad with Zero's customer service that they think that all I need is some new bearings. That's as of Wednesday. Two days ago. This is incompetence beyond belief! My dealer is as livid as I am.

It was the King's birthday in Holland yesterday, so they all had the day off. I hope they enjoyed some rest and relaxation because they're going to get both barrels today...

One new piece of information is that apparently they've shipped $250,000 worth of spares to Europe for this new distribution centre. What's the betting that there isn't a 2014 DS rear wheel amongst that lot?

I wonder if we have a lemon law here in the UK. It might be time to invoke that and get my money back. Zero simply don't have a right to sell a product with so many reliability issues and no support.

[JaimeC]

I read this thread and I am reminded of a conversation I had with the former owner of my local motorcycle dealership.  They didn't acquire the Zero brand until the new owners took over but we were discussing the multiple brands they DID carry (basically, all of the European brands).

He was comparing BMW to the motorcycles under the Piaggio umbrella (Vespa, Piaggio, Moto Guzzi and Aprilia).

He said the Piaggio brands were basically reliable motorcycles but due to their screwed-up parts department they were a NIGHTMARE to deal with.  You wait for a part, call their parts line only to find out the person you'd been working with left the company and the new person had no idea what you were talking about but promised to get right on it.  He said the problem wasn't limited to just their two-wheeled products either; one of their subsidiaries made airplanes and a pilot friend of his bitched about his problems getting parts for his plane.

BMW was the exact opposite.  Their recent bikes are NOTORIOUSLY unreliable (Consumer Reports listed them as the second least-reliable brand just ahead of Can-Am).  HOWEVER he said their parts distribution network was second to none.  They warehoused nearly everything in the States and anything that had to be ordered from Europe was quickly air-freighted across.

His ideal motorcycle would've been Piaggio's reliability with BMW's parts department.

In a little over a year and over 9,000 miles I've been basically problem-free with my 2016 S.  The only issue I had was the turn-signal glitch I had on delivery and it did take them two tries to get that straightened out.  I also thought it took a ridiculous amount of time to get the top box (which is a GIVI product, oddly enough the mounting bracket was shipped with the bike so I really can't blame Zero on that one).  The Commuter wind screen I had ordered also came pretty promptly.  However it took them over three weeks to ship a replacement seat bolt recently.

I sure hope Zero gets their Parts Distribution and Service issues straightened out because otherwise I think it's a fine product.  Even producing an actual Factory-authorized service manual would go a long way in this regard.

[MostlyBonkers]

What I find quite interesting is that when Zero realise they've messed up in quite a spectacular fashion, they still want to do the right thing.

The latest is that the wheel got "confused" but it is on its way and about three weeks out. However, because of all the delays and cock-ups, Aaron is shipping a set of wheels by air freight. ETA is next week. Note that it's a set of wheels, meaning a front and a rear. I only need a new rear wheel.

Oddly though, the other set of wheels that are going via snail mail will also get delivered to the dealer. At this point it would make more sense for them to just stop at the European distribution centre.

All being well, my bike will be back on the road next week. Hooray! My dealer will end up with three extra wheels that they don't need and will probably never require.  All at Zero's expense. It makes no sense at all.

At this stage of the game it's just a relief to hear that Zero actually have a stock of 2014 DS wheels.

I'm not going to hold my breath after this whole fiasco. I will let you all know how it turns out though...

[nevetsyad]

Wow, Aaron made things right for you. It's sad that it takes the director of customer service to make things happen. I wish he'd let me know why my refund request didn't get approved.

[MostlyBonkers]

Wow, Aaron made things right for you. It's sad that it takes the director of customer service to make things happen. I wish he'd let me know why my refund request didn't get approved.

I was trying to be nice on the back of getting some news that gives me hope. The reality is that Aaron is at the heart of all these horror stories. If he'd bothered to set up proper processes and procedures in the first place, none of this would be happening.

It's one of those situations that I'm becoming increasingly aware of in business. Bad practice and a lack of any organisation and structure just leads to utter chaos.  Everything becomes such a mess that people are just reacting to the next phone call or threatening email all the time. Most emails get ignored. In that environment the only way to achieve anything is to doorstep them.

All I can suggest is that you call them. You will probably speak to Jennifer who was very helpful.  She told me that she doesn't get phone calls like mine very often. Either that was a lie or people aren't ringing them enough.

I would say its worth ringing them about your refund. Remind them about the dates and times of emails. Resend them all. Just keep at them.  If you live nearby, visit them. Just keep going there regularly until you reach a satisfactory outcome. It shouldn't be that way, but it is unfortunately.

Good luck!

[maggot]

I am understanding the dealership billable hours get paid by Zero Motorcycles for warranty work, or is that not true?

To be honest, I really don't know but that is probably how it works.

I also sent e-mail directly to Zero EU but they didn't bother answering.

Lucky me, I got an reply from Zero EU. They apologised for the delay and told that the batterypack was shipped on 11th of April. ?? ?? ?? ??  I left my bike to the dealer in January and at the beginning of February they ordered a new battery pack. So apparently the battery pack was sent just after my e-mail directly to Zero EU. I don't know if this is just a consequence or not. I also still don't know if the battery pack has been sent from Europe or USA.

Still no sight of the battery pack.  Also, no reply from Zero EU to my e-mail I sent three weeks ago...

[nevetsyad]

Waiting for my plastics since March. I hear you. Have you written Zero CA? They'll reply, for a while.

[maggot]

Waiting for my plastics since March. I hear you. Have you written Zero CA? They'll reply, for a while.

Haven't tried that yet but I guess it wouldn't hurt to try. Seems to me that ZERO doesn't really care about their customers after sales. I would have some sympathy for the company if they would at least explain what's causing the very unacceptable delay. But no. Lack of communication is not a good customer service strategy.