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[MrDude_1]

Ok, thanks dv8. I'm a little disappointed to be honest, but I appreciate you letting us know the facts so people don't get disappointed further down the line. Overall it's good news for those buying a charge tank with 220/240 volts at home or work.

Having followed the developments of the charge tank and the Diginow Super Charger over the last few months, my conclusion is that the business of charging is not simple!  One of those things that sounds simple but in reality is far from it!

It needs to be as quick and simple as filling up with petrol. That's why hydrogen  is still in the game, as much as I hate it for being inefficient, produced from fossil fuels and highly taxable.

Eh, the business of charging IS simple. Plug it in and walk away.
Its the building of everything to make that happen safely, that is difficult.

[alexanderfoti]

Any thoughts on how the charge tank is installed at the dealer.

Assuming I chose a charge tank, then purchase the diginow later on. Would it be trivial to remove the charge tank, or is it going to require BMS programming for example?

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

There is this one video of the install:

And the user guide: http://media.zeromotorcycles.com/resources/user-guides/2016/2016-Zero-Charge-Tank-User-Guide.pdf


My dealer hasn't even received a charge tank yet for installation. There's not enough information yet about this. The power tank installation is known to not be customer-reversable. On the other hand, the Super Charger does not necessarily need to be installed in the tank area, even if it's best placed there.

[alexanderfoti]

Thanks Brian, that's interesting.

Will see what my dealer says about the charge tank availability...

[MostlyBonkers]

Alexander, since the Super Charger is more or less available now, I'd just get one of those. It sounds like it's much more versatile. None of this 'only charging at 2.1 kW from a 240V supply' business when said outlets are capable of a continuous 3kW.  Also, do you want to stop for a one hour lunch break when traveling or do you have a desire to while away three hours every time you need to charge? Besides, buying a charge tank to then go through all the hassle and expense of swiping it out for a super charger a few months later doesn't make much sense.  I hope this helps.

Mr Dude, I agree that the user's side of charging should be as simple as plugging in, but it isn't really. There are a number of different variables that make it much more cognitive than simply using a payroll pump. Different charging points that all need a subscription, different plugs in different countries, the time it takes and how that varies.

I'll say that at least the charge tank makes it as simple as possible. I'm impressed that someone thought to make it useable via the standard kettle plug, even though it only increases the charge rate by about 900W over using the onboard.

Anyone know if you could use a Y-adapter to make use of a double socket UK domestic wall outlet? Two three pin UK plugs into a Mennekes plug would provide up to 6kW to the charge tank.  That would be very useful, especially when on the road and visiting people.

[alexanderfoti]

Alexander, since the Super Charger is more or less available now, I'd just get one of those. It sounds like it's much more versatile. None of this 'only charging at 2.1 kW from a 240V supply' business when said outlets are capable of a continuous 3kW.  Also, do you want to stop for a one hour lunch break when traveling or do you have a desire to while away three hours every time you need to charge? Besides, buying a charge tank to then go through all the hassle and expense of swiping it out for a super charger a few months later doesn't make much sense.  I hope this helps.

I agree. My thoughts of using the supercharger in the UK, would be going to work in various central London locations, and using a fast charge point whilst I am at a clients premises, or popping into the services. That way I can wack in 20/30% in 30 minutes for a coffee break and then proceed.

Im eager to get a charging solution in place though, as without the ability to that, it will severely limit the usable range for me.

[benswing]

Someone asked why zero doesn't "just use the powerful digiNow charger".  That is because they were  invented after Zero developed the charge tank.  If the digiNow Supercharger works as advertised and is Diablo, there may be a chance of them working together in the (far) future.  But the Supercharger needs to show it can withstand the rigors of real world riding. 

My "little" trip will certainly shed some light on that question.


Subscribe to Benswing on YouTube to follow my summer journeys.
Like Ben Rich - Electric Biker on Facebook.

[Semper Why]

So, the saga of my Charge Tank is a long and weird one. I drove to the dealership early Saturday morning. I took the slightly longer route, but kept my speed down below 55 mph and there were several stretches of 40 mph. It was... quite relaxing, actually. I saw many things I would not have seen if I had just gone screaming down the interstate. I might have made it all the way, based upon the projected trip and how fast I was consuming power. But to be safe, I stopped at a Chevrolet dealership and borrow their wall outlet for an hour. Very nice people. We talked about the Zero and the new Volt, which they had just received a week prior. Chevy has really sexxed up the look of it for 2017.

Anyhow, I dropped off the motorcycle at the dealership. I got to meet all of the people who had been just voices on a phone so far. It was a good day. They said they would try to get to my bike that afternoon, but probably not. They were closed Sunday & Monday, so Tuesday is probably when they would work on the bike.

I called Tuesday. They hadn't gotten to it. Their Zero tech works the late shift, so he was going to roll in at about 4PM and get to work on it.

I called Wednesday. Their tech apparently went on a date instead of coming into work. He was being disciplined and my bike was first on the list.

I called Thursday. The Charge Tank and the bike were apparently unfriendly with each other. When the Charge Tank was installed, the bike wouldn't turn on. As soon as the charge tank was disconnected, the bike would start normally. Zero tech support had gone home for the day at this point, but they would be contacted as soon as the tech came in at 4 PM (1PM Zero HQ time).

I called Friday. They couldn't figure it out. They took the Charge Tank off the bike and re-installed it, following the procedure with double-checking everything. The problem still occurs. They didn't have a 2nd Charge Tanks to swap in. This is not their first Charge Tank and none of the others have had this problem.

They called me today. Working with Zero tech support, the problem is apparently the main board on the motorcycle. The area that deals with accessories is causing problems when it's energized by the quick charger being attached. A new main board is being shipped from Zero to my dealership. So this quick install has so far, taken a week.

To be fair, it's entirely possible there was some other problem with my main board lurking in there. If the bike is going to need a major repair like this, it's probably best that it breaks down at the dealership.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

So, the saga of my Charge Tank is a long and weird one. I drove to the dealership early Saturday morning. I took the slightly longer route, but kept my speed down below 55 mph and there were several stretches of 40 mph. It was... quite relaxing, actually. I saw many things I would not have seen if I had just gone screaming down the interstate. I might have made it all the way, based upon the projected trip and how fast I was consuming power. But to be safe, I stopped at a Chevrolet dealership and borrow their wall outlet for an hour. Very nice people. We talked about the Zero and the new Volt, which they had just received a week prior. Chevy has really sexxed up the look of it for 2017.

You know, I'm forming a write-up of what it's like to ride all day on a Zero trying to cover ground, and the 55mph electric experience is certainly interesting from a gas motorcycle touring perspective. Anyway, those observations jibe with mine and maybe I'll try to write it up that way.

Anyhow, I dropped off the motorcycle at the dealership. I got to meet all of the people who had been just voices on a phone so far. It was a good day. They said they would try to get to my bike that afternoon, but probably not. They were closed Sunday & Monday, so Tuesday is probably when they would work on the bike.

...

I called Thursday. The Charge Tank and the bike were apparently unfriendly with each other. When the Charge Tank was installed, the bike wouldn't turn on. As soon as the charge tank was disconnected, the bike would start normally. Zero tech support had gone home for the day at this point, but they would be contacted as soon as the tech came in at 4 PM (1PM Zero HQ time).

I called Friday. They couldn't figure it out. They took the Charge Tank off the bike and re-installed it, following the procedure with double-checking everything. The problem still occurs. They didn't have a 2nd Charge Tanks to swap in. This is not their first Charge Tank and none of the others have had this problem.

They called me today. Working with Zero tech support, the problem is apparently the main board on the motorcycle. The area that deals with accessories is causing problems when it's energized by the quick charger being attached. A new main board is being shipped from Zero to my dealership. So this quick install has so far, taken a week.

To be fair, it's entirely possible there was some other problem with my main board lurking in there. If the bike is going to need a major repair like this, it's probably best that it breaks down at the dealership.

This is really interesting. The concerns that I've heard when I visit Zero HQ and allude to this project are about systems integration, and yet somehow the Elcon and Super Charger seem more independent than this. (Although there are some aspects I've learned and baked into the documentation in suitably abstract ways to protect installers and users.)


It's certainly true that engineering teams that never coordinate from different companies are bound to design more defensively, especially the side that feels more likely to be blamed for problems.


Anyway, good luck!

[Semper Why]

An update to the saga of the Charge Tank: It took a week for the new main board to ship from Zero to my dealership. It arrived on Friday and they told me that they were wrenching on it on Saturday. The main board is apparently buried deep in the bike, so this 2 hour installation just became a massive job.

On Tuesday, I called and they told me the bike... still isn't working. The new board is behaving just like the old board and reporting that the board has a fault in the auxiliary charging circuits. At this point, I'm thinking the problem isn't with the board and the dealership service techs agree with me. So, back to work with the Zero techs.

On Thursday, I got a call from the dealership and received an update on the status of the bike. It's still not working and they're still working with Zero tech support. After a nice chat with the service department manager, I explained to him in a gentle hinting fashion that 1) I really want my charge tank, and 2) I'm not terribly attached to this specific Zero yet and if he needs to ship it back to the factory in exchange for one with a working charge tank, I will not object terribly hard.

We just finished week 3 of me being without a bike. I keep telling myself that this is the price of being an early adopter. But... damn.

[Richard230]

An update to the saga of the Charge Tank: It took a week for the new main board to ship from Zero to my dealership. It arrived on Friday and they told me that they were wrenching on it on Saturday. The main board is apparently buried deep in the bike, so this 2 hour installation just became a massive job.

On Tuesday, I called and they told me the bike... still isn't working. The new board is behaving just like the old board and reporting that the board has a fault in the auxiliary charging circuits. At this point, I'm thinking the problem isn't with the board and the dealership service techs agree with me. So, back to work with the Zero techs.

On Thursday, I got a call from the dealership and received an update on the status of the bike. It's still not working and they're still working with Zero tech support. After a nice chat with the service department manager, I explained to him in a gentle hinting fashion that 1) I really want my charge tank, and 2) I'm not terribly attached to this specific Zero yet and if he needs to ship it back to the factory in exchange for one with a working charge tank, I will not object terribly hard.

We just finished week 3 of me being without a bike. I keep telling myself that this is the price of being an early adopter. But... damn.

I had something similar happen to me when my power tank was installed.  First it was a defective power tank, which was replaced, but the bike still wouldn't work properly.  The problem turned out to be a bent connector pin that was mashed when the bike was assembled at the factory. I guess you have to be careful when connecting multi-pin connectors.

[Semper Why]

Update: my Zero has apparently stumped both the dealership and tech support. They are shipping it back to Zero HQ for further analysis.

This sucks.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-T217A using Tapatalk

[turbojet]

Just picked up my 2016 DSR after dealer installed the charge tank.  Took a couple days for them to complete the job (2nd one they have installed).  No dealer charge so install charge must be included in the price of the charge tank.  The main issue is that I now have a complete "tank" body piece that I don't need.  I agree with the sentiment that Zero should be installing these at the factory if people order them at the same time they order the bike.  Haven't used it yet, will report back soon.

[turbojet]

Here is my 2016 DSR charging at the local grocery store (Fred Meyer for those of you from the NW) Blink charge station.  I am only a Blink guest but could have saved nearly 25% BY being a member.  Left the bike for under an hour and went from 52% TO 98% charge.  Cost was $2.45. Cheers!

[Semper Why]

I agree with the sentiment that Zero should be installing these at the factory if people order them at the same time they order the bike.  Haven't used it yet, will report back soon.

Just a reminder: The 2016s were out & about for months before the charge tank was available.  Kind of hard to install something that doesn't exist yet on the bike at the factory. Now that the tanks are appearing, yeah it would be convenient to have them installed at the factory. But no other manufacturer pre-installs a dealer-installed accessory for you. If you order a ground effects kit for your car, the dealer will still install it when it arrives.

Update on the bike: Zero has finished their work and it's being shipped back to my dealership today.