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[stunthamster]

Sadly, looks like I'm about to chew through my third charger for my 2015 SR. Same symptoms as before - not charging, and after about ten/fifteen minutes, it pops the RCD on the circuit it's on in the house. This would be the second of the 'new' generation chargers, so I'm more than than a little worried.

I'm seriously starting to think that the charger is a symptom rather than the cause. Mailed the logs off to Zero to see what they advise, but I'm expecting yet another week without my bike. At this point I'm seriously thinking I should insist on a new bike, there seems to be something systematically wrong with this one. What do you guys think?

[Ndm]

Seems to be the only chargers on the bikes that are dependable are the meanwell s or the delta Qs

[Semper Why]

Do you think it would be worth your time to try charging on another circuit or at another location?

[stunthamster]

Do you think it would be worth your time to try charging on another circuit or at another location?

I've tried both with the same result. I took a 'once bitten, twice shy' approach and used a different circuit when the bike was returned. That being said, both the original circuit and this one have electronics such as computers etc that I'd expect to have fried long before my bike if it was an electrical fault. I'm at a bit of a loss as to why the same bike would have so many faults. Could a faulty controller cause charger issues?

[MostlyBonkers]

Bad luck again stunthamster.  I wouldn't underestimate the weakness of one component though.  My feeling is that the design of the chargers is fundamentally flawed and that the revisions are merely sticking plasters.

I doubt the other electronics involved in charging the battery have changed since the 2013 models. The Green Watt Power chargers are the significant change, I think.

I don't see how a circuit used for other everyday electronics should suddenly cause trouble for a charger. Someone took some shortcuts somewhere and it's causing problems for us all. That's my angle.

I'd like to see Zero use this as an opportunity to develop a new on-board charger with a 3kW capacity, preferably from a more reputable manufacturer.

My replacement charger hasn't failed yet, but I don't hold out much hope.

[Electric Terry]

Have you tried charging with a charge cord that has the ground pin removed?   I'd be willing to bet that will fix your problem.  A new charger isn't going to fix it, because they are still working at Calex to fix the residual current leak to the green ground wire, so I am pretty certain any "new" charger you get for at least 6 months and probably a lot longer isn't going to solve this part of the problem.  If it's tripping a hard 15 amp circuit breaker that has nothing else on the circuit then there is a different problem.  I'm just talking about GFCI's or RCD's.

[Doctorbass]

Have you tried charging with a charge cord that has the ground pin removed?   I'd be willing to bet that will fix your problem.  A new charger isn't going to fix it, because they are still working at Calex to fix the residual current leak to the green ground wire, so I am pretty certain any "new" charger you get for at least 6 months and probably a lot longer isn't going to solve this part of the problem.  If it's tripping a hard 15 amp circuit breaker that has nothing else on the circuit then there is a different problem.  I'm just talking about GFCI's or RCD's.

OK so Terry you are saying the famous 2015 charger problem  might be related to a current leak to the ground?

we experienced that with our 2015 S powertrain kit form a complete motorcycle. charger wont work the green light flash for about 15 sec but no current is draw by the charger.. then it flash rapidly red .. but no breaker pop.. only flashing led on the display and no cahrge..

Doc

[MostlyBonkers]

Stunt, if you try Terry's suggestion (which I would), just disconnect the earth wire from the ground pin inside the plug. You need the pin to open up the gates for the live and neutral holes. I'm sure you've already worked that out, but just in case! Do let us know if it helps. We could feed this back to Zero via Streetbike if so. You'll still need a new charger, but it'll give them more clues, if they don't already know of course...

[Electric Terry]

OK so Terry you are saying the famous 2015 charger problem  might be related to a current leak to the ground?

we experienced that with our 2015 S powertrain kit form a complete motorcycle. charger wont work the green light flash for about 15 sec but no current is draw by the charger.. then it flash rapidly red .. but no breaker pop.. only flashing led on the display and no cahrge..

Doc

Doc, a fast flashing usually means there is an above average battery isolation measurement.  That issue might be fixed by a new charger I'm not sure. 

Very simply all I'm stating is that if you are having trouble charging on a sensitive Ground Fault Circuit, it's because of the ground wire itself and you can solve that.  This includes all ChargePoint charging stations which have a very sensitive level 1 GFI setting. 

Also keep in mind many charger brands have this issue.  This is nothing special to Calex.  I have been carrying at least one charge cord without the ground pin since 2012.  The delta Q chargers also disagreed with the level 1 ChargePoint stations most of the time.  It would have a "Ground Fault" failure and blink red and cut off charging for 15 minutes and then try again only to fail again.  I had 4 different Delta Q's when I was in Florida and tried them all separately and they all did this at about 90% of all ChargePoint stations if I used a new charge cord with the ground pin.

When I got to California the place I was staying had a GFI outlet and both the Delta Q's and Calex chargers disagreed with the GFI.  Strangely the Elcons and Meanwells make friends with the GFI.  Jeremiah Johnson with his 2013 Zero race bike (meanwells) would come to visit often and could plug into the same outlet and charge just fine.  Not sure why.  All I know is if you need to charge, there is something you can do about it for now.

[stunthamster]

Have you tried charging with a charge cord that has the ground pin removed?   I'd be willing to bet that will fix your problem.  A new charger isn't going to fix it, because they are still working at Calex to fix the residual current leak to the green ground wire, so I am pretty certain any "new" charger you get for at least 6 months and probably a lot longer isn't going to solve this part of the problem.  If it's tripping a hard 15 amp circuit breaker that has nothing else on the circuit then there is a different problem.  I'm just talking about GFCI's or RCD's.

Hi Electric Terry - interesting idea, I'll give it a go tomorrow and let you guys know how I get on.

[Kocho]

I did break off the ground pin on my cheap extension cord that I carry with me on the bike occasionally. Without it, my Vectrix charges fine at the same picky CFGI outlet that refused to charge it before (with ground pin it charges fine on all CFGIs at home, just this one at work is trouble). Also my first charger was fine even at the flaky CFGI at work, but my second charger apparently irritates it more than the first one and it trips. Pulling off the ground pin with pliers was easy on the cheap cord (might be a bit more work on a quality cord). 

[stunthamster]

That seems to have done the trick. I've unconnected the Earth pin, and I have a happily charging Zero. Interestingly, when it started to charge, it flashed the warning triangle a few times, but now seems to be happily charging. Fingers crossed, fault fixed. I guess the question is, does this invalidate warranties etc?

Cheers for the advice Electric Terry, much appreciated.

[Electric Terry]

That seems to have done the trick. I've unconnected the Earth pin, and I have a happily charging Zero. Interestingly, when it started to charge, it flashed the warning triangle a few times, but now seems to be happily charging. Fingers crossed, fault fixed. I guess the question is, does this invalidate warranties etc?

Cheers for the advice Electric Terry, much appreciated.

You're quite welcome.  I have a few miles under my belt and hence a few tricks up my sleeve.  Glad I could help.

But as you see above Kocho figured this out with his Vectrix also.  It's not a Zero specific problem, many many charger brands dislike GFI's.  This is why I say instead of going through the hassle to get the bike to the dealer and replace the charger, simply try pulling out the ground pin first and try that.   Because that will probably fix the problem easily.  where a new charger probably isn't going to do it until they for sure solve the design problem which I don't believe they have done yet.

[Erasmo]

Instead of removing the earth pin I would recommend using a cheater plug:



That way you can use the unmodified cable at normal grounded outlets.

[Electric Terry]

Yes good call Erasmo.  I've always needed to charge right away and never had one with me at the time so had to resort to just breaking the pin.  And I have so many cords now without the pin I haven't needed to get a cheater.  But that is definitely the better option!  Just make sure to always carry it with you somewhere on the bike that you won't lose it.  For those with a powertank and that don't have luggage racks, finding a place to keep it is the hardest part I see.  Perhaps in a jacket pocket or something.