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[Kocho]

That's different.

Are you guys making assumptions about "different programming" for Euro vs. US spec or know for sure? I recall another thread for the S/DS/R models, where Zero confirmed the bikes are identical and the diff. in specs are due to how the different countries measure or define the power spec.

Similarly, different fuel economy ratings in US, Japan, and Europe for the same vehicles are usually due to the different test conditions they are subjected to...

The normal bikes are the same. But a lot of countries here in the EU have power restrictions for the youngest of riders which on a Zero you can implement with a simple firmware update.

[clay.leihy]

The normal bikes are the same. But a lot of countries here in the EU have power restrictions for the youngest of riders which on a Zero you can implement with a simple firmware update.

Hence the "special" 11kW models. http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/eu/11kw
(C'mon everybody, read the brochure, I Googled it so you don't have to.)

Sent from my Z981 using Tapatalk

[Erasmo]

I'm just confirming the reason why Zero has a limited model. Why are we even talking about this in a cell thread.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

I'll note something relevant: Farasis' web site is now redesigned, and the landing page opens with a video of a Zero now: http://www.farasis.com/

And they have a particular (but kind of sparse) page on their cells and modules: http://www.farasis.com/solutions/cells/

I can't find a link to the spec sheets, any more, though. I have a copy and know the URL at least.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

I've updated the relevant wiki sections:
http://zeromanual.com/index.php/Unofficial_Service_Manual#Cells
http://zeromanual.com/index.php/Unofficial_Service_Manual#Cell_Arrangement

[ZERO SRF KEITH]

can i assume that an srf battery that sat totally discharged at the dealer for 13 months might still be good

[ESokoloff]

can i assume that an srf battery that sat totally discharged at the dealer for 13 months might still be good

Good for what?
Maybe a small boat anchor.

Lithium ion battery's can’t survive below a certain SOC (State Of Charge) so sounds like that battery is scrap.

[ZERO SRF KEITH]

well if you read the original post by the farasis engineer , you would have a hard time ruining it witin the 5 year warranty period

[ESokoloff]

well if you read the original post by the farasis engineer , you would have a hard time ruining it witin the 5 year warranty period

You asked about a “totally discharged” battery whereas the OP was referencing a battery with   “Super low voltage”.

The OP claims that the battery can exist in this low voltage state for 6 yrs (72 months).
The battery you are referring to has sat for 18% of that time so has likely suffered measurable damage.

[MVetter]

What does 'totally discharged' mean. 95 volts is empty, but 0 volts is dead dead totally deadified dead. What is the voltage of the pack in question?

[Auriga]

Per Zero guidance, a battery can be recovered if the voltage is at or above 60V and each cell is above their cutoff voltage. Normal pack range is about 90V to 116V. The bike/battery will still accept charge on a regular charger. Below that, irreversible/super damaging dendrite growth will occur and the battery is scrap. Note I really wouldn't recommend actually letting it drain that low, as its still likely to negatively impact range/performance

95V -> 60V without any load should take a long time, so 6 years sounds possible.

@MVetter is right, what is totally discharged? If it's a used battery taken out of a bike, we really rarely do that unless they're scrap or battery performance is less than 80% normal. You'd want to get pack voltage and each cell voltage(If a cell is too low, the battery is dead, regardless of pack voltage)  If it's a new battery sitting around, no way it would normally deplete itself in that timeframe.

I'd be skeptical, depending on battery characteristics and reason for removal.

[MVetter]

Right, unless there's something egregiously wrong like a short or a parasitic drain. Case in point I've got a monolith on a DSR outside that had a parasitic drain and it's down to 9.6vdc. I'm going to drop it off at Zero HQ for recycling next time I'm up there.

[gt13013]

If you can get the logs from the bike, you could probably check some history of the battery pack.
I don't know how the logs look like on a SR/F, but I attach some lines of my FXS logs.
I guess that on a "Discharge level" line (I take here the example of line 09403):
AH is the depletion of the pack. My packs should have around 26 Ah of capacity (FXS 2016 with two 3.3 kWh packs). Consequently the value of AH (12 Ah) agrees with the SOC (52%).
L stands for the voltage of the lower cell, ie 3648 mV
H stands for the voltage of the upper cell, ie 3654 mV
What is l ? It seems often close to L in my logs, but I am not able to guess what it is...
B stands for the unbalance, B = H - L = 6 mV
PT is probably the Pack Temperature, 19°C
BT is probably another temperature, which one?...
PV is the Pack Voltage, 102215 mV

Since there are 28 cells in this pack, the average voltage of a cell should be 102215 / 28 = 3650.5 mV
That fits perfectly with the values of L and H.

If the logs of the SR/F are similar to mine, from the logs, you could probably be able to check some history of the bike, get the voltage of the pack along the previous months, and the voltage of the lower cell.
You should try to get them as soon as possible, since when the memory is full, the older data of the log are erased, and replaced by the new data.

[ZERO SRF KEITH]

bike had minor accident which damaged the bms ,but absolutly no damage to battery case itself,
dealer and zero reps decided it would be in there best interest to totally drain the battery,
so now it appears they destroyed a battery that only needed a bms board,
and since the bike had an accident they wont warranty anything
this is a 2020 srf
pretty sad and terrible customer service

[Auriga]

i'm sorry, I know that sucks.

Discharging a potentially compromised or scrap battery before storage/recycling is what you are supposed to do to reduce the likelihood and ferocity of a fire. I'm not sure there are any youtube videos that show a Zero on fire, but if they go up they will reduce the bike to a pile of slag, and there's not much that can be done but wait for it to burn out. Obviously I have no insight into whether that should have been done for your case.

Nobody's auto/moto warranty covers accidents, can't fault Zero for that. Wouldn't your insurance be responsible for either the repair cost or totaling out the bike? Any dealer that's boneheaded enough to sell/give you your battery that Zero determined to be a fire hazard is asking to be sued out of existence when it hurts you/burns your house down.