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[Burton]

Figured I would start a new thread for this as it is bound to be picture heavy. I will be sure to add it to my content post (found in signature) later.

Motor in box, from guess who? It was the last one ... there are no more now.



Under all that foam is a white box with the motor. It had several markings.




Inside the box the motor was sandwiched between two pieces of foam. I cut both sides and laid the box on the side to push it out ... you know since it weights like 40lbs



This is the encoder side of the motor in foam.


And now sans-foam. You can see the SR sticker, some markings on motor, and a 29 degree sticker (which is the encoder offset used during commissioning). Note two screws to keep plate on


Close up of markings. Also the encoder pinout is different than the 2013 I think as there appears to be an extra yellow wire (will have to ask about that)



Turning the foam over to pulley side.


And sans foam again two screws to hold plate in place.



The wires are also black and not orange colored. From what I have been told the phases on the motor have the wires shift vs the 2013 motor meaning M1 is the longest vs the 2013 where M1 was shortest. This will require turning the controller around which means removing it, removing the heat sync, and remounting it backwards so the pin out of the controller faces the back of the battery. It will likely not get as wet this way either so it is a win win.

I will likely share more content when friday / saturday roles around as I am climbing tomorrow and don't want to rush the installation without documenting it.

[Justin Andrews]

This should solve your bearing problem... 

[Burton]

For those wondering why I am "upgrading" to this motor...


This motor had been modified for racing before I took ownership of it with 600 miles on the bike. Really expensive ceramic bearings were installed and the plates had been ventilated with drainage ports put in place to handle water.

After about 10k miles these ceramic bearings started to fail and cause play in the rotor / shaft ... at one point it felt like I was going over cobble stones at certain speeds. So I ordered new bearings and rode the bike till they came in.

New bearings came in, I replaced them (see signature for documentation of that), and went on my merry way.

3k miles later the same early symptoms were showing up so I pulled the motor and sure enough play was starting to show up in the motor. Instead of simply replacing the bearings, with identical bearings mind you, Harlan at Hollywood Electrics said he would inspect it for me if I paid shipping. This makes sense as it would be pointless to have the bearings go bad again.

Sent the motor off and BOOM here it is in his shop.



He showed me some rust on from the coating wearing off inside the motor. I ride year round and it snows here so we also get the harsh chemicals which go with it. If this bike was only used for racing this likely wouldn't have happened so fast (under a year of riding)



The Encoder sometime in the last 3k miles took a hit ... can't tell you when or how though just that it happened. I know it happened in last 3k as I reviewed the video of my deconstructing the motor the first time I replaced the bearings and didn't see any damage then.



And here is the problem ... wear ... and lots of it. One person responded to me with "man that bearing really ate that shaft up," and they were right. The lesson here outside of not modifying the motor is if you get bearing problems to stop riding the bike I know this damage largely started while still on the ceramic bearings as I again reviewed my video and footage when I replaced the bearings the first time.


This is what it should look like.



The shaft could be replaced and I requested to also have the bearings replaced. With labor this would have come to about $450 + add on the $100 it took me to ship it there and the $100 it will cost to ship it back and we are nearly half way to a new motor. So Harlan was kind enough to buy the motor off me and give me credit to place towards his last 2014 SR NIB motor.

This should not have heating problems with the riding I do, and neither did my modified motor mind you, and it is sealed! For the environment I ride in this will make such a big difference

There you have it, the reason I am swapping the old motor out.

[Burton]

This should solve your bearing problem... 

Yup ...

[pacificcricket]

Burton, was your 2013 an S model ? Does that mean you have to do some kind of magic with the firmware/controller for the new SR motor ?

[Burton]

Burton, was your 2013 an S model ? Does that mean you have to do some kind of magic with the firmware/controller for the new SR motor ?

I have a 2013 model S 11.4 ... with a size 6 controller and I use to have a ventilated race modified motor So I call it a 2013 SR lol

The only thing I think I have to do is set top dead center (TDC) of the encoder in DVT to get this motor to work with what I have set up.

[pacificcricket]

I have a 2013 model S 11.4 ... with a size 6 controller and I use to have a ventilated race modified motor So I call it a 2013 SR lol

The only thing I think I have to do is set top dead center (TDC) of the encoder in DVT to get this motor to work with what I have set up.

Very cool! Can't wait for the report with the results!

[Burton]

I don't expect much of a difference between the two motors ... but I could see the temps being higher than my ventilated one for sure.

Will have to double check my thermal cuttof temp in DVT to make sure it meets specs of motor of course.

[Lipo423]

Burton,

I have got a couple of questions:

- From the enclosure picture, this is the new 2016 ZF 75-7R motor, right? (is it able to manage intensive/hard/high temp use, better?)
- Is it expensive? (I just got a new 2014 SR, and I find the temp warning/cut out very annoying…I live in Spain, and well, in the summer is rather hot here  )
- Do you know if it is just a swaping operation -in my case- or I would need to make modifications?

Thanks so much

[Justin Andrews]

I was never keen on these ventilated motor mods, fine for racing, but for regular road use then roads are simply too harsh especially in winter to expose the interior of the motor. I consider this to be one of the problems with the 2012 motors, and they were designed to be open.

[dean mcneil]

Been working on water cooled  sr motor,  stiill  testing looks promising.

[Burton]

- From the enclosure picture, this is the new 2016 ZF 75-7R motor, right? (is it able to manage intensive/hard/high temp use, better?)

This is a 2014 SR motor not the 2016. It is very hard to get a 2016 motor at this time but I do have plans to get one next year. I likely won't have the SR motor long enough to see if it overheats in summer My 2013 ventilated motor never overheated even at 75-80mph in 110 F for 30 minutes of riding. But being exposed makes it easier to degrade.

- Is it expensive? (I just got a new 2014 SR, and I find the temp warning/cut out very annoying…I live in Spain, and well, in the summer is rather hot here  )

The 2014 SR motors run around $1600 new.

- Do you know if it is just a swaping operation -in my case- or I would need to make modifications?

In my case, since I am swapping to a 2014 SR motor, it is a simple case of swapping the motors then commissioning the motor (details later)

To swap any 2013-2015 bike to a IPM (2016 SR motor) you need to not only commission the motor but you also need to find some way to update the controller software / firmware to be able to use the motor properly. This means knowing someone who can first get you a motor (as it is rather difficult) and they are also willing to give you a way to update your controller via DVT or some proprietary Zero tool ...

In short, you won't see many people upgrading to a 2016 IPM motor by themselves anytime soon less they have someone like Harlan do it for them. I still plan on doing a IPM upgrade next year if I can find someone who can get me the motor and give me a way to upgrade my controller software/firmware to use the motor without breaking the programming on the BMS/MBB level (aka bricking the bike)

[Burton]

Been working on water cooled  sr motor,  stiill  testing looks promising.

Have you tried the half full ATF method of cooling yet to see how well it works vs stock?

Do you have any data points you can share?

Given the level of difficulty to create a watercooling system and integrate it into the SR motor plates it might be easier to just throw an IPM motor on there and not do any added cooling ... if they function as advertised

[dean mcneil]

Havent heard of atf  oil cooling. Have tried dry ice , ventilated motor and forced ventilating the motor. I live in Texas and summer here is 105f plus. And I run the motor at max rpm continuously.

[dean mcneil]

Im using 2014 running gear on a shifter kart frame and competing against the shifters and this no easy task.