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[oobflyer]

I'm charging my 2015 at 4 kW using the three Delta-Q Quic chargers in addition to the onboard charger. It's a bit of a hassle bringing the chargers with me (on long rides only), but it's nice to be able to charge quickly at J1772 stations or RV parks (you can use a total of 4 off-board chargers for a total of 5 kW if you want). The convenience of the built-in 'ChargeTank' is elegant, but I also like the longer range that the 'PowerTank' offers.
So, I don't regret not waiting for the 2016 - I'm still very  happy with my 2015 SR.
The only thing that I'm really jealous of is the new sustained top speed. I do see the thermal warning light come on quite often forcing me to slow down until the motor cools down.

[Domenick_Y]

I can't figure out how Zero was able to change the gearing on the Zero SR from 2015 to 2016 and yet the 0-60 time and top speed didn't change.  The new IPM motor puts out the same torque, weight stayed the same at 414lbs, and same motor controller.

The reduction in the number of teeth on the rear sprocket from 132T to 130T should result in higher speed but lower torque at the wheel.

Zero could limit the motor to a lower rpm in 2016 to keep the top speed the same.

So why didn't the 0-60 time for 2016 change? Shouldn't the 0-60 time for the 2016 Zero SR be slower? What am I missing?  Is it just programming in the motor controller?

Though I can't say for sure, the 0-to-60 time might have stayed the same because of the increased power ability of the new cells. It's not been reported because it's not hugely relevant to most user's experience, but besides having more energy capacity, the new battery cells also have more power output capability, or, in more technical terms, a higher C rating.

[Doug S]

...the new battery cells also have more power output capability, or, in more technical terms, a higher C rating.

Generally speaking, the C rating of a cell is used to refer to the speed with which it can be charged, not discharged. I do believe you're correct that the new cells are rated for higher discharge rate, but aren't they still using the same Sevcon Size 6 controller that's limited to 660 amps anyhow? Higher discharge capability from the battery pack wouldn't help unless they've upgraded the controller too.

[Cortezdtv]

If they were using the size 6 to 100% of its potential....

[NoiseBoy]

If they were using the size 6 to 100% of its potential....

I think they probably are at higher speeds? Just a lower ramp/multiplication at low speeds to avoid people hurting themselves.

[xmjsilverx]

gborgan, yes, I own a 2015 SR.  It's quick but not compared to a liter bike.  I am not saying it's slow by any means, my point is if you are going to redesign the motor then add a little more power and torque.  It should be progressive just like any motorcycle.  Year by year they increase power.  I'm not sure why that seems like such a ridiculous request.  Another thing we don't think much about is how high the bike has to be geared to get a 0-60 time of 3.3 seconds.  That's all well and good but this bike can't complete a quarter mile with out being topped out long before the end.  Why not bump up the hp and tq, gear it a little lower, get the same 0-60 times but hit 125mph now.  The bike is awesome for what it is but not mainstream enough for most people.

[NEW2elec]

I agree 125 or 150 at least on your top of line R bike.  The bikes aren't going cross country ( ok for most of us not iron butted) so they need to be really fun or very practical.  The S and DS cover the practical side while the FX and the SR need to be wild rides even for liter bike riders and two stroke jumpers.  I want this company to succeed more than any product I have bought in years so it may be time to branch off an outside the box team and let em rip.  I don't know how many Egos or Lightnings have been sold but I would say single digits.  Now put Zero's dealers and customer service behind a bike with those kind of stats and you can sale them at $35k to the market that can go that route no problem.  Bragging rights are a petty thing but they sale product just ask any Super bowl champion team.

[Nuts n Volts]

I'm sure Zero has a plan to bring more power to the lineup. This motor is a step in that direction, but ultimately the controller is what determines the power you get.  Probably waiting on sevcon to deliver a higher power controller (in a low voltage package) or rolling their own into production.  Great to see Zero make upgrades in so many diverse aspects of the bike. Good on them


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[grmarks]

Why not bump up the hp and tq, gear it a little lower, get the same 0-60 times but hit 125mph now.  The bike is awesome for what it is but not mainstream enough for most people.

A higher gear you mean. High gears give more speed.

[wavelet]

I agree 125 or 150 at least on your top of line R bike.  The bikes aren't going cross country ( ok for most of us not iron butted) so they need to be really fun or very practical.  The S and DS cover the practical side while the FX and the SR need to be wild rides even for liter bike riders and two stroke jumpers.  I want this company to succeed more than any product I have bought in years so it may be time to branch off an outside the box team and let em rip. 

The whole company is an outside-the-box team... The entire EV motorcycle market (as opposed to the electric scooter market) is still at that phase. Recall how many employees they have, and that despite being considered a big success, Zero will still sell <2000 bikes this year. If you want them to succeed in the near future, the only way to to sell a lot more of what they have now, not significantly increasing price.
Once they're selling 30K-40K bikes a year, different story.
Concentrating on incremental improvements and selling to fleets may not be sexy, but will allow them to sell.

I don't know how many Egos or Lightnings have been sold but I would say single digits.  Now put Zero's dealers and customer service behind a bike with those kind of stats and you can sale them at $35k to the market that can go that route no problem.

And that's exactly how large this market is... Single digits. If that's all Ego / Lightning will manage to sell, neither company will survive (let alone thrive) a year or two from now. Think of what happened to Mission and other would-be companies in this space. Even Brammo.

And 150mph e-motorcycles would require a lot of expensive windtunnel work, because wind resistance absolutely kills range. It's not an coincidence that even $100K Teslas have an electronic speed limit of 155mph, when according to various calculations they could probably do 205-210mph.

[NEW2elec]

I don't want them to stop making their bread and butter bikes.  Now my understanding is Egos come from a much larger Italian high performance company so money isn't a problem for them.
Lightning has glitches that stop the bike on video test rides.  I like some of Lightning's patents and would like to see Zero acquire them and put their tech team on patching some holes.  You get the fairings already to go the oil cooled motor casing that supports weight as part of the frame.  There are a lot of sport bike owners that drop big money when they first buy and on and on as they keep it running.  As a company you want that money and the customers that don't care what they spend they just want the "best".

[Domenick_Y]

...the new battery cells also have more power output capability, or, in more technical terms, a higher C rating.

Generally speaking, the C rating of a cell is used to refer to the speed with which it can be charged, not discharged.

C rate is a metric equally relevant to both charge and discharge.
http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/what_is_the_c_rate

[MostlyBonkers]

Which is entirely the correct way to do it.
And to be honest, if I had to choose between a 5% increase in battery size each year, and whistles and bells like Traction Control... Then I'd pick the battery improvement every single time.

That they have improved the battery size AND kept the cost the same, is really good news. It shows Zero are passing the cost savings in battery tech along to us the customers, just like they promised they would years ago, again excellent news.

Personally I'm stoked about the 2016 bikes, and I forsee my 2013 will be traded in for one some point in the coming year. 

I'm with Justin here, despite wanting to see Traction Control. I'm sure it will come eventually. In the meantime we just need to remember to treat these bikes with the respect they deserve. I learnt the hard way...

It's easy to get distracted by a wish list of features when the price point is probably the most critical consideration for Zero. It's why getting a subsidy here in the UK would make such a big difference.

[rayivers]

I got back yesterday from an Orlando mini-vacation, most of which was spent at the show.  I thought it was excellent - tons of custom and production bikes, hot babes, and dozens of OEM & aftermarket suppliers with knowledgeable reps ready and willing to discuss their products - or nearly anything MC-related - in depth.  The first two industry-only days were the best for one-on-one vendor discussions, as the weekend was pretty busy - but it never got mobbed, it was always easy to move around.  The Orlando convention center is way huge, it's definitely the largest building I've ever been inside.

Harley and KTM weren't there, but Zero was out in force.  They had a killer location near the center of the floor, and interest was high every time I passed by.  The presentation Scot Harden made on Thursday was media-only, but I was able to watch it through the clear divider and thought it was quite good.  I finally got to meet Harlan (and talk his ear off) and learned a ton of Zero-related stuff I'd been curious about for months.  I asked Jason? at Zero about one thing I thought I might have been imagining; that my FX never seemed quite as fast after it overheated the first (and only) time.  His reply was "there may well be something to that", which I wasn't expecting.  I wonder if this might've been one of the reasons for the switch to the IPM configuration.  The '16 FX has taller bars and a cool brake pedal with a more aggressive (and replaceable) foot, in case that's of interest to the dirt guys.

I got to ride an FX, SR and Yamaha R6 on the streets surrounding the convention center, plus a Suzuki quad on the dirt track (all were 2015 models).  I had no experience with rearsets and had only ridden electrics for over a year, so the first mile on the R6 wasn't pretty.   Riding in tight formation with 6-10 other bikes at reduced speeds isn't exactly the best way to get the feel of a new bike, but it was much better than nothing.  One guy went down hard on a Zero DS right in front of me - bike and rider were a little banged up, but OK.

Pretty much everyone I spoke with had at least some familiarity with - and interest in - electric bikes.  All asked about range; I started with my worst-case '14 2.8 FX figure of 35 miles (which is also Zero's spec, and one I can usually achieve on either street or dirt), then added in the multiplication factors of the various '15-'16 models as best I remembered them.  Most seemed surprised that the mileage was so high on the 13.0 and Power Tank models.

Zero was the only electric MC brand at the show AFAIK.  The Big Four guys had no news about upcoming electrics, and no one I spoke to at Yamaha had ever heard of the PES2 or PED2 bikes which supposedly ship next year.

Ray

[mrwilsn]

I got back yesterday from an Orlando mini-vacation, most of which was spent at the show.  I thought it was excellent - tons of custom and production bikes, hot babes, and dozens of OEM & aftermarket suppliers with knowledgeable reps ready and willing to discuss their products - or nearly anything MC-related - in depth.  The first two industry-only days were the best for one-on-one vendor discussions, as the weekend was pretty busy - but it never got mobbed, it was always easy to move around.  The Orlando convention center is way huge, it's definitely the largest building I've ever been inside.

Harley and KTM weren't there, but Zero was out in force.  They had a killer location near the center of the floor, and interest was high every time I passed by.  The presentation Scot Harden made on Thursday was media-only, but I was able to watch it through the clear divider and thought it was quite good.  I finally got to meet Harlan (and talk his ear off) and learned a ton of Zero-related stuff I'd been curious about for months.  I asked Jason? at Zero about one thing I thought I might have been imagining; that my FX never seemed quite as fast after it overheated the first (and only) time.  His reply was "there may well be something to that", which I wasn't expecting.  I wonder if this might've been one of the reasons for the switch to the IPM configuration.  The '16 FX has taller bars and a cool brake pedal with a more aggressive (and replaceable) foot, in case that's of interest to the dirt guys.

I got to ride an FX, SR and Yamaha R6 on the streets surrounding the convention center, plus a Suzuki quad on the dirt track (all were 2015 models).  I had no experience with rearsets and had only ridden electrics for over a year, so the first mile on the R6 wasn't pretty.   Riding in tight formation with 6-10 other bikes at reduced speeds isn't exactly the best way to get the feel of a new bike, but it was much better than nothing.  One guy went down hard on a Zero DS right in front of me - bike and rider were a little banged up, but OK.

Pretty much everyone I spoke with had at least some familiarity with - and interest in - electric bikes.  All asked about range; I started with my worst-case '14 2.8 FX figure of 35 miles (which is also Zero's spec, and one I can usually achieve on either street or dirt), then added in the multiplication factors of the various '15-'16 models as best I remembered them.  Most seemed surprised that the mileage was so high on the 13.0 and Power Tank models.

Zero was the only electric MC brand at the show AFAIK.  The Big Four guys had no news about upcoming electrics, and no one I spoke to at Yamaha had ever heard of the PES2 or PED2 bikes which supposedly ship next year.

Ray

I was considering making a trip to Orlando to test ride the new bikes. Now that I find out the demos were 2015 models I'm glad I didn't. Although, it still might have been cool to talk to the Zero reps about electric bikes.  And it also would be cool to see the new bikes in person to see if there are any subtle differences with past models that hasn't been discussed in the Media releases.  I guess I'll have to wait until they show up at dealers.

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