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[Richard230]

Perhaps the real weak link is the lack of dealer technician training in electric motorcycles.  If you are a competent and qualified service technician on IC motorcycles, trying to learn how to repair this new EV technology is no doubt quite a challenge.  A few techs can probably learn how to do it, but I bet most really struggle with the concept.  I have been servicing my IC motorcycles for over 50 years and I wouldn't have a clue what to do if my Zero stopped running.  Somehow Zero needs to set up a factory training program for their dealer service techs and provide a funding method for that training.  I think that is what is behind many of the problems that some people have had with their bikes.

I note that my 2014 Zero S (built in December 2013), once its power tank issue was resolve by a Zero tech, has been running perfectly ever since.  There appears to be nothing wrong with Zero's design, just the occasional assembly or component glitch that can be really hard to diagnose for someone who is not familiar with the technology. 

[chdfarl]

I emailed Brammo on this issue and they seemed open to the concept but I cant really discuss our conversation. I didn't bother to contact Zero since they are a "no service necessary company" no that's not a real quote but you know what I mean.
ICE bikes do have electric motors (starters, alternators) and PC interfaced ECUs that any professional tech should be familiar with so its not an inconceivable stretch. Ive been watching and studying the EV evolution in motorcycles for well over ten years and my Grandfather (now 96 going on 97 years old) has been building electric bicycles as long as I remember so perhaps my perspective is off but don't underestimate the grease monkeys!

[firepower]

Having a service Manual would be a big help, every motorbike I Have owned I have been able to purchase or download for free service manuals.
Downloading manual and forum support was one of my reasons of purchasing my SV650S.
Not even a service manual for the mechanical parts of the bike   but we all know that is basic to fix.

We should at least be able to fault find to module level, every device has an inbuilt processor and must have its own diagnostics.
Digital mulitmeters ($30) are cheap and even digital oscilloscopes ($400) are not expensive these days.

[mikeisted]

So my 2012 S ZF9 has recently stopped working with the 2:4 flashing warning.  I suspect the BMS corrosion issue is the cause. I purchased the bike ex demo with 1300 dry dealer miles on the clock in May 2014 and have added only around 2000 miles to that.  The bike was first registered by the dealer in 2012 (and they are no longer a dealer).

Here in the UK, the only service centre is now Street bike in Birmingham.  I called and spoke with Roger who was very helpful.  However, Zero have indicated to him that the bike is no longer under warranty.

I'm taking the bike up next weekend for them to take a look at and I'll keep you posted.

So while Street bike have been great and I love the bike itself, Zero's stance so far is less than reassuring.  I'm hoping to make some progress once the bike is with Street bike and they can provide Zero with more information.

[firepower]

Just check and make sure all recall work has been done. This is safety issue and has no time limit.
 

[vchampain]

Mike,

In this case, you are in presence of a known issue, aka 'hidden defect' well documented here through users testimonies. Whatever the warranty terms are you have national level & european level regulation protecting you and, of course, you're entitled to a repair, and can have all the cost paid for by Zero. First step would be to ask it politely. Second step would be to escalate internally. Third step would be to sue.

V

[mikeisted]

That's good advice. Cheers.

[ut-zero]

Having a service Manual would be a big help, every motorbike I Have owned I have been able to purchase or download for free service manuals.
We should at least be able to fault find to module level, every device has an inbuilt processor and must have its own diagnostics.
Digital mulitmeters ($30) are cheap and even digital oscilloscopes ($400) are not expensive these days.

+1

[Cortezdtv]

They don't want people working on the controller batt etc because of the risk of shock from controller or batteries granted if your careful they are safe I mean I was a big stereo guy before I really started tinkering with the fx I'm not scared of burning down a car so eh a bike little stuff lol
Before backseats


Totally forgot about the electric car too


[/img]

[CliC]

Like you, I wonder what support is going to be like for my 2012, especially now that it's out of warranty. Two dealers I've worked with were able to perform recall updates on the electronics (with Zero's help possibly), but for a persistent front fork issue I had to get involved more than I would have liked (it ultimately was fixed however).

If you have a competent dealer close by that is bullish on electric motorcycles, then you are probably OK. But since there is no dealer near me any longer (and I live in Houston, 4th largest city in the US), I find Zeros hard to recommend to Joe average motorcyclist unless that person is also an EV geek.

It's too bad, too, because I generally feel Zero has a good product (especially in the 2015 models where the components have been upgraded). But they have to get more of their dealers knowledgeable and comfortable with the tech, and work out whatever communication and other issues exist between them and those dealers, before they will become mainstream.

[mikeisted]

I've updated the thread on my current BMS/battery issue at http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=4123.msg26242#msg26242

It seems I need to find £3950 for a replacement battery which has seemingly failed after only 3500 miles.

In the brief time I have had the bike, so many people have been interested in it and consequently the 'electric revolution'.  But this issue will simply play into the hands of those that scoff at the idea of ever replacing ICE.  If a leading e-bike manufacturer such as Zero is not prepared to go the extra mile, they are letting the whole side down.  If that's the case, it is perhaps better they move over and let someone else carry the torch...

I've asked for the BMS to be replaced and am hoping then for small miracle.... or a change of heart from Zero.

[Ndm]

I'm on the same page , these are extremely expensive machines and either the manufacturer needs to stand behind them or set up proper channels to get problems resolved quickly if they arise, I'm in love with the bikes (I've only just recently ridden a brammo) but feel the risk is too high to spend such a large chunk of cash on, it seems to me zeros apparent lack of customer service and brammo clearing out bikes without word on why or if they will even be around next year is too much of a gamble , most people work hard for what they have and deserve prompt resolutions from a company they have put their faith and money into

[rightleft22]

Follow up
After some great help from my dealership Zero agreed to fix the issues I was having under warranty.  (I purchased the new 2011 in 2013)
It was a fight though.

It would be great is Zero offered a way to rebuild the batteries at a reasonable cost. Until they do I can't recommend the purchase of a zero bike to anyone that does not have a technical/mechanical background.

I think the success of Zero will be greatly influenced by the community, those who 'signed' on  first

"The Law of the Few", or, as Malcolm Gladwell states, "The success of any kind of social epidemic is heavily dependent on the involvement of people with a particular and rare set of social gifts".[3] According to Malcolm Gladwell, economists call this the "80/20 Principle, which is the idea that in any situation roughly 80 percent of the 'work' will be done by 20 percent of the participants" (see Pareto Principle).[4] These people are described in the following ways: Connectors, Mavens, Persuaders.

I do not think that Zero has done a great job in working with the community.

[MotoRyder]

rightleft22 — checking on how the process went working to get your issue resolved with your Zero motorcycle.

Your original post on this topic (Zero Support) was on: October 21, 2014.

Your recent post where you mentioned potential resolution of it was today, January 27, 2015.

That is a 3 month + 1 week period for the problem...where was the majority of the delay for it taking so long ??

[flexydude]

my 2012 broke down last year, was a month before i could get it to he dealer, a 5 hour drive. It's been there almost 4 months now.my 2010 ds has been sitting 2 months now waiting for a new mbb dealer is supposed to send me. zero sucks