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[Burton]

Ok. Tonight's test at home was much better.

I replaced the fuse, wired up some terminals / wires / pins to connect to the sevcon controller directly and started charging. I was pushing in about 50 amps (I think 10 was the stock charger) most of the time and it took the battery all the way up to 90% no problem (~115V) and then slowly brought it up to 95% (~115.6V) while dropping amps to whatever the stock charger can do (I think 10amps) for the last 5%.

This would mean yesterday when the charger shut off at 112.4V it shut off because of the fuse blowing ^_^
This also means two stacks of these (requiring two power sources) could give you a 1C charge rate to 90% easily.

Very cool stuff. I also found time to wire up my 5-15 and 6-30 connectors using the last of my Silicon wire.
I will take some pictures when I get a chance then start making the how to series for this basic build. I suspect in the future I will expand on it to have indicator lights, switches, etc.

Oh Trikester, I tried putting a 100k ohm resistor from B- on the controller to the extra pins on the anderson and it did nothing. I didn't expect it to as they don't connect to anything at all :/ So will likely have to stock with the stock controller to trip the contactor for now.

[Nuts n Volts]

So just to clarify.  You have two RSP-2000-48s (voltage maxed out) and the stock chargers running.  This setup had 50A charge flowing until about 115V?  Or did the current drop before that voltage? 

It's good to see that once you get to 116.4V that the RSP-2000 supplies dont start doing anything weird and the onboard chargers keep pushing the voltage to a full charge even if slowly

Thanks for sharing

[Mr. Fusion]

Hi Burton


Nice work, thanks for sharing!
Did you connect a diode in series to the chargers?


greets

[Doctorbass]

Mr. Fusion, Diode in serie to protect are not usefull becasue the CV seting of the stack of power supply is always higher than the voltage fof the battery so the current flow only in one direction. What is important is to have diode in parallel to each power supply to protect against reverse current.

Also a serie diode would make a big heat problem.. even a good shottky diode would have about 0.6V at 50A witch would need to dissipate about 30W with additional heatsink.

Burton, To get the voltage maxed out  and keep the CC for an extended period  you should connect the voltage sense input of each power supply to the high current connections. you can connect the S- of the first power supply to the end connection of the high current NEG wire and do the same for the positive of the 2nd power supply ( on the S+)

This wil make the RSP-2000 to keep high current longer and will compensate for the voltage drop in the high current wires. This reduce by about 5% the charge time.

I did that on my setup and it work well

Doc

 

[Mr. Fusion]

Mr. Fusion, Diode in serie to protect are not usefull becasue the CV seting of the stack of power supply is always higher than the voltage fof the battery so the current flow only in one direction. What is important is to have diode in parallel to each power supply to protect against reverse current.

Hi Doc

What happens when the max. voltage (112V) of the two RSPs is reached and the stock charger continues to charge the batteries? Then the battery voltage should exceed the max. voltage of the RSP stack. I read that the meanwells shut off with over voltage protection starting at 57.6V -> total of 115.2V. They should be OK until 67.2V -> 134.4V, but how to ensure that the voltage is equally distributed among the two meanwells?

[Burton]

So just to clarify.  You have two RSP-2000-48s (voltage maxed out) and the stock chargers running.  This setup had 50A charge flowing until about 115V?  Or did the current drop before that voltage?

Yes as it is set up now the current did not drop till after 90% charge after which the current slowly went down as the voltage got closer to 115.7 (the resting voltage with both meanwells pots set to max voltage)

Burton, To get the voltage maxed out  and keep the CC for an extended period  you should connect the voltage sense input of each power supply to the high current connections. you can connect the S- of the first power supply to the end connection of the high current NEG wire and do the same for the positive of the 2nd power supply ( on the S+)

I had been meaning to ask you about the sensing circuit as I saw you using pins 1 / 2 (the sensing pins) on your pictures.

Just to clarify

FIRST CHARGER (POS OUT) / ( NEG TO SECOND CHARGER POS )
S+ to POS OUT
S- to FIRST CHARGER NEG TERMINAL ?

SECOND CHARGER (NEG OUT) / (POS TO FIRST CHARGER)
S+ to SECOND CHARGER POS TERMINAL ?
S- NEG OUT

I will make a better video showing the charging / setup this weekend now I know what went wrong in the first video. I should probably do this after setting up the sensing circuit; will have to see if I have some pin connectors sitting around as I don't think I do -_- I guess I could simply update the video later though for those interested to see it now.

EDIT: (adding video I just shot)

[Doctorbass]

Burton,

I did a quick video with some details for you here:

Enjoy!

Doc

[Burton]

Nice explanation Thanks for taking the time to post it.

Yeah I blew my 30 amp fuse already lol. I removed the pins from the anderson connector and insulated them and just installed them on my controller instead.

Anyone know what the 40pin connector brand is so I can get pins for it?
I know the chargers have a .5pitch for their pins. I swore I had some laying around so I will have to see if I can find some.

[Nuts n Volts]

So just to clarify.  You have two RSP-2000-48s (voltage maxed out) and the stock chargers running.  This setup had 50A charge flowing until about 115V?  Or did the current drop before that voltage?

Yes as it is set up now the current did not drop till after 90% charge after which the current slowly went down as the voltage got closer to 115.7 (the resting voltage with both meanwells pots set to max voltage)

Sweet!  I'm sold haha.  Thanks for the great videos too

[Burton]

Tomorrow I should be able to make a charging video as I am taking the bike out. I will time it to see what it can do. Granted this will be before the sensing circuit as I don't have any single .5pitch pins laying around ... guess I could always solder the wires to the pinouts but I rather not as I will have to clean them later.

[Doctorbass]

Nice explanation Thanks for taking the time to post it.

Yeah I blew my 30 amp fuse already lol. I removed the pins from the anderson connector and insulated them and just installed them on my controller instead.

Anyone know what the 40pin connector brand is so I can get pins for it?
I know the chargers have a .5pitch for their pins. I swore I had some laying around so I will have to see if I can find some.

BUrton,

I think i remember that the 0.5 pitch pins connector number are mentionned in the PDF of the RSP-2000

Doc

[Burton]

Yeah that one I wasn't worried about finding the pins for since I could use singles for it. The one I need crimp pins for the most is the 40pin connector on the BMS so I can wire the pins on the anderson connector to them to close / control the contactor


http://www.hirose.co.jp/cataloge_hp/en_DF11_20130411.pdf

DF11-12DS-2C Crimp housing
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Hirose-Connector/DF11-12DS-2C/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs%252bGHln7q6pm1D%2fu5fPR%252bY0nIwDkB%252bwyxo%3d

DF11-6DS-2C crimp housing for other connector
http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=DF11-6DS-2Cvirtualkey64550000virtualkey798-DF11-6DS-2C

Pins for 22AWG wire
http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=DF11-22SCAvirtualkey64550000virtualkey798-DF11-22SCA

SEVCON CONTROLER Connector info
http://www.te.com/catalog/pn/en/1-776163-1?RQPN=1-776163-1 (see AMPSEAL Automotive Plug Connector and Header Assembly (PDF, English) )
http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=YqNA2qefETAUziSpjzx9mg%3d%3d (look at bottom for pins)

MBB 34 pin connector
http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=6xtm2vwqiW%2fm6zHGpD5hDA%3d%3d

CCU 18 pin connector
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/JAE-Electronics/MX23A18SF1/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs7eK6h2EBtKkAz7jnNYZmagRPFVYhCTJM%3d

Pins for 40 / 34 / 18 connectors
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/JAE-Electronics/M23S05K351/?qs=%2fha2pyFadugracjPSlc7NSiIBpqPGOljNf0cAWBcq00kv5P6dRh80w%3d%3d


Can't find a public link of any kind to the 40 pin connector but it uses the same pins as the others.


2 pin female connector from Anderson adapter (I think but color is wrong)
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/JAE-Electronics/MX19002S52/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs7eK6h2EBtKkAz7jnNYZmaGjzJN5v55Bc%3d

Female terminals for 2 pin connector from anderson
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/JAE-Electronics/MX19S10K451/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs7eK6h2EBtKkAz7jnNYZmaCO7BmorGNN8%3d

2 pin male connector from anderson to BMS (I think but color is wrong)
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/JAE-Electronics/MX19002P52/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs7eK6h2EBtKkAz7jnNYZmao94c%2f2eNhzY%3d

Male terminals for 2 pin conncetor from anderson
http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/JAE-Electronics/MX19P10K451/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMs7eK6h2EBtKkAz7jnNYZmaK%252bGcCEYs1Ts%3d

[Burton]

Ok it seems at 93% is when the charger starts the slow down.  (since the sensing circuit isn't in place yet [i have parts on order for the pins / connectors])

I was thinking I might want to back off on the voltage setting so the charger stops charging at 90% ... Do I have to worry about this? I am running the chargers directly through the controller. At what percent should I stop the quick charger and let the stock 1250 watt chargers take over so the BMS can balance the cells.

I have another thought worth testing. You can run 3 of these chargers on a single J1772. You can also run ONE of them on a 5-15. So in my mind I could run 4 of these off one chargpoint charging station if I have two cards. The J1772 would be hooked up to the three chargers and the fourth hooked up to the nema 5-15.

I would likely need to make a Y connector for the anderson connector and I would have to upgrade the diodes ... I think. Since they are only 60 amps. But that would give me a 1C charge rate! I would want to keep the "units" separate though in case  I want to just use one stack.

I am going to wire the current stack up to run off two power sources and test the theory first before ordering another set of chargers. And then I need to start thinking of how to mount them on the bike. I am thinking of just throwing them in a E21 case or two on the front of the bike. I am going to have the vetter cowl up there in the future and all extra weight should be up high and forward.

[Doctorbass]

Burton,

I am charging my 2012 pack at up to 74.7V with the quick charger and the pack when it is full with the onboard charger is at 75V.  That's 99.6% of the total voltage and never got any problem. The cells remain all very well balanced. I was a bit worrie about that  when I began to do that but over the time I saw that all cells remain balanced very well. I think you can do the same if you make sure to use the onboard charger do a cell balancing at the end of charge job to about every 5 cycles.

btw even if you go 2s2p with 4 meanwells you will have to connect the current share pin between each paralleled charger. This will make paralleled charger to share the current 50% each.

These RSP are fully isolated between the output and input so you can connect the AC input of the charger that have output paralleled or serie, with different AC source at the input that are in our out of phase.  ex you can connect one of the 3 or 4 rsp  to a 220V 15A and the 2 or 3 other to a different  220-30A.

I recommend you to get some of these cheap and compact led display AC current and voltage meter available from ebay. this will give you a good idea of the power draw at the input. I know there is some that will alco calculate the watts and kWh and that are panel mount  in a really compact size but these are LCD. I have oedered one already.

Doc

[Burton]

I have ordered the connector and enough pins for 4 meanwells knowing I would likely end up getting two more So that is 4 6 pin connectors plus crimping pins and 4 12 pin connectors and crimping pins. I am going to have to get more silicon wire to and maybe replace the two I use in tandem with my anderson connector to the controller.

I will draw up a better diagram showing the load sensing circuit, the current sensing circuit, and the connections to power sources later today along with diodes etc) Speaking of diodes I better order some 120 amp diodes or 6 more of the 60 amp ones I have and stack them like yours.

Charger stack 1:
Charger 1 in series with Charger 2 (both powered by J1772 for 20amps)
Charger 1 (outputs negative) Connects to charger 3 via 6pin connector for pins 1 3 5
Charger 2 (outputs positive) Connects to charger 4 via 6 pin connector for pins 1 3 5

Charger stack 2:
Charger 3 in series with Charger 4 (one powered by J1772 for 10amps and another from a 5-15 at ~16 amps)
Charger 3 (outputs negative) Connects to charger 1 via 6pin connector for pins 1 3 5
Charger 4 (outputs positive) Connects to charger 2 via 6 pin connector for pins 1 3 5

Should I put this on a toggle switch so I can shut the current sensing off when I am only using one stack? So a SPTT (triple throw) I was told by EC charging at 1C in the summer might not be possible when it gets really hot. And if I have to charge at someone's house where I only have access to two 110 20amp circuits  I want to be able to only use one stack.

Thanks for advice

EDIT:

Do I need 4 awg wire for the outputs of the chargers and for the inputs to the controller? I think the anderson connector supports up to 110 amps but only gives a 6gauge connector to do it with. What is 10 awg  silicon insulated wire rated for  amps? If I recall your using 6 gauge with more amps then I would be pulling so I assume I need 6 gauge for  my output wires and my controller input wires (which currently has 2 10awg wires)