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[scZero]

Curious if you Nige or anyone has the spec on a contactor replacement part?  Would like to replace it with something better that'll have a less likelihood of failing.   

I've dug into the bike already, plastics off, controller / charger unbolted.  I had to get this far just to tie into the three wires for a test point on the controller.  Now that I'm this deep into it I might as well just pull the pack out and replace the contactor.  Will also connect up to the controller to see what version of the firmware is on there (its stock) and if the one on the Alltrax download sight is more recent, flash it.  I also want to tweak the settings of the controller a bit to see if I can get any more power and acceleration out of this 2010.

[scZero]

welcome

Hey BTW, whiel I had it open i also added a HD pair of cable's one connect to the internal neg bus directly onthe battery and the other on the fused side of the positive. This gives me a (direct) fused connection to the battery with a sealed anderson plug hanging down (you can see it on the pic) This gives me un-adultered batt voltage and a chance to bypass everything if needed if voltage crashes below charger start up voltage or connecting an inverter or a DC charger etc etc. No brainer for $10

I need to ask you more about this offline, I can't see it in the pic.  I see the stock blue anderson connections but can't see the one you installed.  I have the rear of the pack apart and contactor out.

[scZero]

FYI for those interested and as a reference,  the 2010 Contactor and I believe 2011 contactor is as follows (printed on contactor):

Manufacturer: AllTrax
Part #: MZJ-200D/48-48A
DC Contactor
Coil: 48V DC
Contact: 48V DC 200A
Utilization Category: DC-1
Standard: GB14048.4

Available at EVdrives for about $42:
http://www.evdrives.com/product_p/sol-mzj200.htm

AllTrax page:
http://www.alltraxinc.com/Products_Sys_Components

However I'd like to replace it with something better since this one failed, worse case I can put the samething back but I really don't want to be dropping nor pushing the bike again anytime soon!

[scZero]

Took the contactor apart and it didn't look dirty or as messed up as I though it'd be.  I definitely see where it was arching, but don't know if this would induce an issue where it'd fail to keep its relayed connection.

[scZero]

Here's what my good friend who's an electrical / computer hardware engineer had to say about the pitting of the contactor:

"I would be a little worried about that contractor, the pitted area is where the current is flowing through and it is probably not as low a resistance as it should be.
You could try sanding it smooth again and see if the problem goes away. I think at this point I would want to know how many other people have had contractor problems. I can't say this is your problem but I would try and get rid of the pitting especially if others have experienced problems."

So I may try that and see how things go.  Just wondering why it pitted so bad and how to prevent it.

[nigezero]

far out, that is some pretty substantial pitting!

Great that you have the specs; you could try elmofo.com.au they have some that look right but hundreds of dollars - worth an email to them, great guys

feel free to email me SC nm(at)solarbusinesss.com.au

[nigezero]

Great little guide on the issue from altrax here too, SC.

http://www.alltraxinc.com/files/Doc120-046-A_TN010-Contactor-Fuse-Diode-Lessons-Learned.pdf

Have you tried emailing them and asking for advice on a suitable substitute? I Know Manly Tom would be delighted and Id probably thrown one in the cupboard and replace next time shes open.

[scZero]

Just called technical support from AllTrax.  First of all what a pleasant experience!  Greeted well, the CS rep listened to my entire problem and configuration, my  symptoms, and then responded in a very educated fashion. 

He said that contactors will have signs of pitting, that they're rated for 10,000 cycles and with these cycles pitting can occur.  However he agreed that the pitting can cause issues of the relay loosing its connection and failing as in my case and recommended hooking it up to to pack voltage and making the ground to close the circuit.  He said thats how they make these work and hook them up, but Zero could be doing something different.  Also he said AllTrax doesn't make the Contactor, only the controller.  So it appears they just supplied them for customers.

As for putting in a better / more durable Contactor, he asked what my controller model was.  He came back saying its a 500 Amp and that I'd need at least a contactor rated at 400AMP continuous.   I read off the spec of the contactor that was in my zero, where it said 48VDC 200A and he said I should upgrade to the 48VDC 400A contactor.  So I'll try to hunt one of these guys down here soon.

Also the CS guy took the time to explain what all the settings ment in the AllTrax controller software.   There was only one setting that I was able to change since the others were setup either max or correctly and that one was the "Max Output Current" which stock was 90% and we turned that one up to 100%.

[scZero]

Looks like a higher quality and more durable contactor candidate:
http://www.evdrives.com/product_p/sol-400a.htm

[nigezero]

That's cool, I'd love to know how to turn mine up too.. X

[scZero]

Sure Nige, its rather easy.  So you've never connected to the Alltrax Controller vis RS232 and the Alltrax software?  I can guide you through it, pretty simple.  Some youtube videos are out there that are nice to view before you get started.

Just sent you a mail to you address above so you have mine.

[scZero]

So to comment about contactors.  I believe there's a better contactor than the one I bought.  Better meaning a better design.  I improved upon it by getting a higher rated contactor.  However the design is flawed unless there's a design that is made that ensures the contactor plate (circle part) and its mating contactor points are perfectly flat.  As you can see in my pics, the contactor is arching and making pits.  This is because its favoring in certain areas / taking the path of least resistance.  And then arching / welding.  A perfectly designed contactor would have the area of contact perfectly flat where the contact area is not favor in one spot but rather distributed evenly across the contacting plane.  Since these contactors are made in china I don't see them using the best materials nor the best testing to ensure longevity.

[oregonrider89]

Hi,

I have a 2010 DS with 11,000 miles. I use it as a daily commuter and I love it!

My problem started with the speedometer no longer registering speed. After extensive troubleshooting (replace sensor, replace instrument panel) and no resolution Zero sent me a new battery. The new battery worked fine for about 200 miles then I developed a glitch similar to the one in this thread. I swapped out the throttle, MBB and other boards (removing and installing the battery with each troubleshooting protocol) using the old battery as a donor but the problem remained.

One day, while I was looking in the old battery I noticed that  a wire coming out of the contactor had fused; I went to NAPA and bought some connectors and, $1 later, the old battery is back in the bike and running like a champ and I have a speedometer again. I still have a "new" replacement battery -the one with the glitch- that I am not using but I now believe that problem can be solved with a new contactor.

Zero has been amazingly supportive with troubleshooting guidance and always gave me any parts that were needed. I will be a repeat customer...after another 10k miles, that is!

Thanks for all the posts, this is great information.

[nigezero]

Now I'm intrigued - which wire was it?

A large one feeding power or a control/signal wire or (my guess) one of the wires going to the fuses ?

I'll bet it was an overheated fuse holder that stressed the wire

[scZero]

Glad you had such a good experience and Zero treated you well!

Where exactly is the MBB on the 2010?  In the pack and is it that very small box with thin black plastic on the left side by the anderson connector?