Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[ColoPaul]

About 34F on the ride into work this morning.   Can anyone out there beat that?

The Zero performed well, (although it started from a 50F garage).   At work, the bike then sat out all day and chilled to maybe 39F or so.
Going home, when I turned the bike on, I got a blink code on the display 
5 short, 1 long.    Clear as mud!  It went away when I put the kickstand up.  So I rode home, no problems.
Turns out the blink code is "kickstand sensor error".  Bet it's a connector that has a temp sensitivity and goes away when it warms up.

I am curious if I would have noticeable reduced range at cold temps - but my work ride is only 8 miles one way.  Couldn't tell a difference.

This is a picture of work when I got there this morning!

[craigq]

Re. cold and range, after overnight charging on the XU when it's about 15*C (59*F) and above the first bar gets 5.1-5.5 KM When it's about 4*C (39*F) I've seen the first bar get 4.7 KM.

My coldest commute yielded about 80 Wh/mile round-trip (4*C morning, 14*C afternoon), then it warmed up again and the last commute was 69 Wh/mile (16*C morning and ~25*C afternoon); during July without cold temperature fluctuations it was consistently around 70 Wh/mile.

[protomech]

First bar range, at least on my bike, is a little variable. It hasn't gotten super cold here, but I typically see 5-7 miles on it before it disappears.

[Doctorbass]

I guess that using the zero windshield + heated grip and seat would certainly help!.. it would only consume like 100Watts... wich is 100wh for an hour... to be more confortable.... that must be considered!

DOc

[dahlheim]

with my bmw i normally commute to work on bike year-round, but i have to change from 20W50 to 10W40 oil in the winter months.  it typically gets down near 0F here, and is often 20F or less.  the zero manual says not to operate the bike at 20F or lower, and that the computer will shut the bike off at those temps.  so, i guess it'll be back to the R1150 for the dead of winter, with the zero cozy in the garage...

[ZeroSinMA]

Rode my 2011 S in 35F last winter. I won't ride below freezing because I don't trust the roads here to not have ice patches. The bike was stored in an unheated garage. Took off at 35F and rode with no problems. Didn't ride far so no idea of the range issus.

[mehve]

I don't relish the thought of not riding my Zero. Does the 20F include windchill?  Hmm.  Winter is coming...

[cirrus pete]

Ride my bike every work day to the train station here in the NYC area. I have ridden in temperatures below 15F excluding windchill on occasion. As long as there is now snow on the road I am on the bike. Luckily my ride is short and I am well bundled in a jacket and ski gloves. I am looking forward to the windshield I bought this year to help with the windchill this winter. 
Regarding the range, my rides are short and I leave the bike plugged in overnight so it isn't a practical issue although for sure the range is diminished based on how quickly the bars drop in the cold.

[ZeroSinMA]

Ride my bike every work day to the train station here in the NYC area. I have ridden in temperatures below 15F excluding windchill on occasion. As long as there is now snow on the road I am on the bike. Luckily my ride is short and I am well bundled in a jacket and ski gloves. I am looking forward to the windshield I bought this year to help with the windchill this winter. 
Regarding the range, my rides are short and I leave the bike plugged in overnight so it isn't a practical issue although for sure the range is diminished based on how quickly the bars drop in the cold.

Like humans, batteries function best at room temperature, and any deviation towards hot and cold changes the performance and/or longevity. Operating a battery at elevated temperatures momentarily improves performance by lowering the internal resistance and speeding up the chemical metabolism, but such a condition shortens service life if allowed to continue for a long period of time. Some manufacturers of lead acid batteries make use of the improved performance at warmer temperatures and specify the batteries at a toasty 27°C (80°F).

Cold temperature increases the internal resistance and diminishes the capacity. Batteries that would provide 100 percent capacity at 27°C (80°F) will typically deliver only 50 percent at –18°C (0°F). The capacity decrease is linear with temperature.

Li-ion also performs better at high temperatures than at low ones. Heat lowers the internal resistance but this stresses the battery.

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/discharging_at_high_and_low_temperatures

[ColoPaul]

I commuted this morning at 25F.  That' about my limit.  Funny, it's supposed to be 77F by this afternoon for my ride home.    That's Colorado.

I noticed a definite lack of power!  I'll try to be quantitative:
There is a short hill that if I'm going 60 at the start of; normally if I go WOT I can be at 70 by the time I get to the top.  This morning I went WOT and by the top I was only going 63.   I'd guess that top speed on a flat may have been ~72 or so.

Also, by the end of my short (8 mile) commute; I could tell that the power was returning to normal.  I guess the batteries were self-heating enough due to usage to overcome the cold losses?

[protomech]

ZF6 battery may be power-limited at cold temperatures. Motor is ~22 kW, battery is 5.3 kWh, it's rated for 5C continuous but that's at room temperature. At low temperatures you may get 3C or less out of it (waving hands here) .. which would limit you to around 15 kW / 20 hp.

[kcoplan]

Ride my bike every work day to the train station here in the NYC area. I have ridden in temperatures below 15F excluding windchill on occasion. As long as there is now snow on the road I am on the bike. Luckily my ride is short and I am well bundled in a jacket and ski gloves. I am looking forward to the windshield I bought this year to help with the windchill this winter. 
Regarding the range, my rides are short and I leave the bike plugged in overnight so it isn't a practical issue although for sure the range is diminished based on how quickly the bars drop in the cold.

I thought the motors were supposed to cut out at below 20 degrees farenheit.  How did you get away with riding at 15 degrees, Cirrus Pete?

I was wondering if you start in a 50 degree garage and go out into 15 degree weather, will the heat generated by riding the bike be enough to keep the motor and batteries above 20 degrees and running.  Not sure whether this would work at freeway speeds, when the air flow will carry off a lot of motor heat.  Could you block up the motor ventilation like you sometimes see diesel trucks do?

--Karl

[protomech]

Temperature limitation is almost certainly a battery limitation, not a motor limitation.

Motor will definitely keep itself heated, probably at least 30-50C above ambient.

Battery will heat itself somewhat, during the summer I found that the battery stayed about 10C above ambient both when in operation and when left in the sun. During the winter (in NA), heating from the sun may be less (and particularly if you ride home late at night when the sun has dipped below the horizon) .. so I would not count on this.

[cirrus pete]

[/quote]

I thought the motors were supposed to cut out at below 20 degrees farenheit.  How did you get away with riding at 15 degrees, Cirrus Pete?

I was wondering if you start in a 50 degree garage and go out into 15 degree weather, will the heat generated by riding the bike be enough to keep the motor and batteries above 20 degrees and running.  Not sure whether this would work at freeway speeds, when the air flow will carry off a lot of motor heat.  Could you block up the motor ventilation like you sometimes see diesel trucks do?

--Karl
[/quote]
Karl,
I dunno. All I can say is that I have never had the motor cut out due to low temp issues. only degradation of battery/range. (in fact, until you posted it, i wasn't even aware of that limitation. Hopefully I won't have a dead cat in a box now!) I have had the ingnition key hole freeze when some moisture got in it and then froze as the day got colder. Certainly not a "zero" specific issue but itreally sucked when I got home that night in freezing weather and couldn't get the key in the bike to ride home. Now during the winter I keep a can of lock antifreeze spray in my saddlebag!

[kbfcanada]

So, is this a challenge? I hope to ride at least a bit this winter, but it gets pretty cold on my long commutes even at 5*C (of course it's usually windy here at the same time). I find that Zero's windscreen is not sufficient for me and I'm considering finding something else. Any recommendations? I'll also have to get out my snowmobile helmet I wonder how long the bike could last at -40...