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[gt13013]

I have a 2016 FXS and a 2023 S.
I use custom mode, with throttle regen to 0% and brake regen to 100%.
I find the brake regen quite correct on the FXS, and the regenerative braking is sufficient in most situations, if you stay in a quiet driving mode. It uses the Z-Force 75-5 motor with a 420 A controller.
On the other hand, I find the regenerative braking very weak and insufficient on the S, which forces you to brake constantly with the discs, even if you stay in a quiet driving mode. It uses the Z-Force 75-7 motor with a 550 A controller.
I am surprised by some comments in forums or FB, where some S riders find their regenerative braking too strong and have to reduce it using the custom mode.
There are probably some MBB parameters that could be set by a Zero dealer, or by entering the MBB with a higher level than the default one: https://zeromanual.com/wiki/Gen2/Regen . But since the bike is new, I prefer not to change anything myself. Note that the MBB logs with the default Login Level 0 do not give any information about these settings. Moreover there is no competent Zero dealer where I live...

In order to get a quantitative measure of this regenerative braking, I have used the following procedure, that should work with any Gen2 Zero:
- Set the bike in custom mode, with throttle regen to 0% and brake regen to 100%
- Use the ZeroSpy Android application to record the bike data every second
- Go as fast as you can on an empty road and brake using the regenerative brake (and preferably not using the disk, since it would shorten the stopping sequence and you would get less data points on it)
- Do it several times in order to check the repeatability.
- Extract the data from your phone and open the file with a spreadsheet
- Make a column where you multiply the battery voltage by the battery amps, in order to get the battery power
- Make graphs of this battery power versus the bike speed during the regenerative braking sequences
I attach an example. For the FXS I was in town and it was difficult to go faster...
Anyway, it is easily seen that the FXS regenerative braking is more than two times greater than the S one. And the bike is lighter.

If some of you are interested, it would be interesting to draw the same kind of curves in order to see if the regenerative braking differs between bikes and models.
 
And finally the main question is to know if the regenerative braking can be increased by a Zero dealer.

[JaimeC]

I'd noticed when I went from the 2016 S to the 2018 S that "100%" regen on the later model felt far weaker than the older model.  Same goes for the 2021 SR I'm riding now.  Compared to the regen I felt on the BMW Scooter (which felt like STOMPING on the rear brake by comparison) I wish there were a way to increase it beyond 100%.

[rgutt]

Stock regen on any Zero is basically a joke. If you ride ICE, engine braking is orders of magnitude better.

No, the dealers cannot increase your regen -- or rather, won't.

On the Gen 2 bikes with Sevcon controllers, you can increase your regen by getting an IXXAT cable and software and reprogramming your controller. You'll only be able to do so on the Sport and Eco modes though because the MBB overwrites the maximum regen values via the SDO protocol that you basically cannot block. You'd have to be plugged into the controller and change the values manually every time you went into Custom if you wanted to increase the values in Custom. Several people have implemented various techniques for variable regen. You can search them on this forum.

[gt13013]

According to
https://zeromanual.com/wiki/Gen2/Regen
and
https://zeromanual.com/wiki/MBB_Console#Settings
it seems that it could be possible to increase the regen.

See for instance the MBB parameter:
maxcustregbrtq  - Max Custom Regen Brake Torque :  10 ( 100 % of allowed )
Custom Mode maximum brake regen setting as a percentage of allowed by the Sevcon controller.

By the way, if somebody has extracted the result of the "set" command from the MBB on a recent Gen2 Zero, with a Login Level greater than the default (0), and listing all the parameters that could be changed, I am really interested by this listing.
 

[ZeroChrissy]

Tataaaaaa
more Menu, more set...

*************************************************************

  help            - Display this Help screen
  login           - Show login level, or login with password
  logout          - Log out of MBB
  version         - Display board and firmware revision
  status          - Show the status of the Main Bike Board
  stats           - Display All statistics
  runtime         - Show Total Run Time
  statsrst        - Reset All statistics
  set             - Show all settings, or edit a specific setting
  settingsrst     - Reset all settings to defaults
  bms             - Display BMS data
  force_all_storage_mode - Attempt to force all Modules into storage mode, must be keyed off or charging
  bluetooth       - Display/modify Bluetooth connection
  sevcon          - Display Sevcon Motor Controller Data
  sevcon faults   - Display all Sevcon Faults
  sevcon preop    - Toggles Preop Mode
  chargers        - Show info for all charger ports
  inputs          - Show all inputs
  outputs         - Show all outputs
  dash            - Show all dash info
  obd             - Show all obd info
  dtc_clear       - Clear all DTCs
  eventlogdump    - Display the contents of the event log
  eventlogclear   - Clears the Event log  Destroys all existing log entries.
  errorlogdump    - Display the contents of the error log
  errorlogclear   - Clears the Event log  Destroys all existing log entries.
  eeprom          - Show EEPROM usage
  format eeprom   - Reset All To Factory Defaults (Reformat EEPROM)
  reset           - Reset CPU with SW reset
  exit_to_bl      - Exit main app and start bootloader
  blcmds          - print bootloader command block
  test            - Run Specific Test, or show test options menu
  dumpall         - Dump all data (stats, inputs, settings, and logs
  burn            - bluetooth bms updater test code


ZERO MBB> set

*************************************************************
*                       MBB Settings                        *
*************************************************************
  To change settings, type:
    "set <setting name> <value1> <value2> ..."
     0x preceding the value may be used to indicate a hex number



 ************
 Psudo Settings
 ************
  Variable        Description              Value
 +---------------+------------------------+--------------------

  runtime         Total Run Time           00002:xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx



 **************
 Settings
 **************
 NV writes: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 Setting Name         Setting Desc                            Value        Units
+--------------------+---------------------------------------+------------+-----
 model_year           Model Year                                      2017
 serial               MBB Serial Number                      xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
 vin                  Bike VIN                           xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
 firmware_rev         Firmware Revision                                 33
 board_id             Board ID                                           7
 model                Bike Model                                        SR
 spfront              Sprocket Teeth Front                              20
 sprear               Sprocket Teeth Rear                               90
 rwhcirc              Rear Wheel Circum                               1972 mm
 kill                 Kill Switch Polarity                               1
 secidle              Seconds Idle Before Turn Off                    3600 S
 drive_mode           Pres Drv Mode 123 norm 456 overide                 3
 maxcustsprpm         Max Custom Speed                                6484 RPM
 maxcustspmph         Max Custom Speed                                 106 MPH
 maxcustspkph         Max Custom Speed                                 170 KPH
 maxcusttqx10         Max Custom Torque x10                            604 %x10
 maxcusttq_allowed    Max Custom Torque Percent of Allowed              40 %
 maxcustregcotqx10    Max Custom Regen Coast Torque x10                 40 %x10
 maxcustregcotq_allow Max Cust Regen Coast Torque % of Allowe           50 %
 maxcustregbrtqx10    Max Custom Regen Brake Torque x10                 72 %x10
 maxcustregbrtq_allow Max Cust Regen Brake Torque % of Allowe           90 %
 is_dnr_board         Is D&R board                                       0


ZERO MBB> test


*************************************************************
*                        Test Menu                          *
*************************************************************

  all             - Run All Tests

  eeprom_full     - Test entire EEPROM (contents not preserved)
  logs            - Test Logs
  neutral         - Test Sevcon Neutral Logic
  footbrake       - Test Sevcon Footbrake Regen Logic
  system          - Run a full in-system test
  fuelout         - Test fuel gauge output
  dash            - Test all dash functions
  odo             - Test odometer and trip odos
  range           - Test remaining range calculations
  filter16 <x> <y> <z>  - Test 16 bit filter response( val1, val2, coef )
  filter32 <x> <y> <z>  - Test 32 bit filter response( val1, val2, coef )
  chgdis <x> <y>  - Test charger x disable for y seconds
  iso_inhibit <y> - Test inhibiting isolation tests on all BMSes for <y> seconds (1-3600)
  bluetooth_module- Test connectivity of the Bluetooth module
  pessimism <x>   - Test fuel gauge pessimism calculation using <x>50008000essimism.
  dcdc_switch <x> <y> <z>  - Test dcdc switch function ( on_sec, off_sec, iterations (-1 = indefinite).
  enter_chg_stby  - Immediately enter charge standby mode.
  term_chg_stby   - Terminate charge standby mode.
  custom_settings - Tests setting all custom settings
  settings        - Test settings storage

[ZeroChrissy]

I think, If regen is too high, may Rear wheel is not good to control, can blocking... on bad rainy roads!?
In general, by using the Front brake, cause of regen there is always a break force on rear wheel, too! That's what I like. No reason to use the rear break by foot (excluding emergency break...).

[gt13013]

Thanks ZeroChrissy. It is exactly what I expected!
So, it seems that the regen can be modified.
But the signification and the values of all the variables related with torque are absolutely not clear!
I am presently on holidays and I cannot extract my logs, but I will check my SET parameters with a higher login level when I will be back at home.

Yes, too much regen braking could lock the rear wheel on slippy roads.
But I am very far from that, and on slippy roads, I use the Eco mode.