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[smithy]

Hi All,

My Experia has just gone past 10,000km, (~6k miles) over the weekend...no major mechanical issues at all....just some minor niggling electronic stuff like key not in range etc...

Chain, sprockets and tyres all wearing fine with no issues.

Anyone else approaching this sort of mileage on their Experia..?? Rick Flashman should be up there-ish, if not well past it..

Smithy. 

[most]

8,050km today, main terrain is Alps and German middle moutain range, less than 100km of the famous unlimited German Autobahn.

The handling got worse with the Pirelli‘s wearing and after 5,000km I should have replaced both front and rear - since I was on a longer trip to the Alps I only replaced them after 7,000km with Contintal RoadAttack 4. TWI front worn flat, extreme sawtooth profile on the rear. The bike had to be forced in corners.

Also, I had a battery failure after 2,000km. Bike stopped and had to be transported to dealer - Energica tech team drove from Italy and got me a new battery.

Besides above: No issues! BIG fun to ride it!!

[Motoproponent]

I'm coming up on the 1 month anniversary of having my Experia. A little more than 2000 miles at this point. Still getting the hang of traveling with it. I have another long trip in 2 weeks. I'm finding multi day trips to be super fun and not nearly as much of a PITA as I was expecting. I think I will hit 10,000 miles in about 8 months of ownership.

I just love riding it, but I do have a family and a job and a life that are all vying for time on my precious weekends.

[MD99]

Battery issue after such a short distance / time is a worry for me and a big issue. How much are Experia batteries if this happens out of warranty...? Did the Energica engineers say if it was an overheat issue or what ? Please keep us updated...as a prospective new Experia owner I was hoping that these sort of big early failures would be very few and far between. Anyone know how many Experia are on the road now, mid August 2023?

[most]

Please keep us updated...

Nothing to update you on as the story happened in May. Did not receive an in depth analysis as the battery was replaced.
These sorts of things can happen. Just happy that both dealer and Energica reacted super fast

[smithy]

Battery issue after such a short distance / time is a worry for me and a big issue. How much are Experia batteries if this happens out of warranty...? Did the Energica engineers say if it was an overheat issue or what ? Please keep us updated...as a prospective new Experia owner I was hoping that these sort of big early failures would be very few and far between. Anyone know how many Experia are on the road now, mid August 2023?

I suspect the battery failure on "Most's" bike it's a "one-off" thing.....no other Experias have suffered the same fate that we know of. I'm not totally sure but I suspect there's only maybe ~150 Experias world-wide out in the wild at present....many more to come I imagine. They are a good thing, they handle very well for their weight and size, brakes are excellent, battery range is better than I expected, I commute to work on mine and do ~55km (~34miles) each way and its mostly/95% motorway @ 100km (60mph) and I can easily get to work and back twice and have ~22% SOC remaining....so 220km+, (~136miles), of mostly motorway riding.

If just piddling around my local area at "modest" speeds, the range can be well over 340km, (~211 miles).

Smithy.

[Specter]

I don't see the battery thing really being a 'thing'.   I had a brand new XRF, paid 40G for the thing and 3 days later it died.  Their excuse was, well sometimes this just happens, they called it 'infant mortality'.  It was promptly fixed, but back to the battery, sometimes this kind of stuff just happens, you get a bad something out of the box.  The manufacturer sent them a bad battery, it conked and they had to replace it.

The fact that they immediately flew out to fix it, is mind boggling.  You would NEVER see a US company do that!  I don't think you are going to see many issues of this nature at all.

Aaron

[Motoproponent]

After taking a few road trips, I'll say I'm a little bummed at the battery thermal management.

I realize there are physics that can't really be changed...but

Even when riding in ambient temps in the mid 60's (Fahrenheit) and charging in the same temps, the battery gets the yellow.

Is there a condition where a DCFC doesn't heat the battery into the yellow?

I found in 60 degree weather it takes about 20-25 miles for the battery to get back in the green, but subsequent charges get into the heat zone and start to throttle the charge speeds.

I mean, maybe my expectations aren't realistic. I did 4 days in the last 7 with 4 or 5 DCFC charges a day (~400 miles). The first charge would max at 22 KW and then start to ramp down at 80%. Second, third and fourth charges would start at 20 or 18 kw and start to ramp down after like 10 minutes. Even when I limited the charge current (to 50 amps) on the first charge of the day the subsequent charges start low and get lower pretty quickly.

Is this what you all are experiencing on the Experia? Is it better than the legacy models with regards to thermal management?

[DonTom]

After taking a few road trips, I'll say I'm a little bummed at the battery thermal management.

I realize there are physics that can't really be changed...but

Even when riding in ambient temps in the mid 60's (Fahrenheit) and charging in the same temps, the battery gets the yellow.

Is there a condition where a DCFC doesn't heat the battery into the yellow?

I found in 60 degree weather it takes about 20-25 miles for the battery to get back in the green, but subsequent charges get into the heat zone and start to throttle the charge speeds.

I mean, maybe my expectations aren't realistic. I did 4 days in the last 7 with 4 or 5 DCFC charges a day (~400 miles). The first charge would max at 22 KW and then start to ramp down at 80%. Second, third and fourth charges would start at 20 or 18 kw and start to ramp down after like 10 minutes. Even when I limited the charge current (to 50 amps) on the first charge of the day the subsequent charges start low and get lower pretty quickly.

Is this what you all are experiencing on the Experia? Is it better than the legacy models with regards to thermal management?

On either of my Energicas, yellow after a fast charge runs about 50-50 for me during the summer months. The 2020 SS9- is supposed to have a better battery cooling system than the later models, but I cannot say I have noticed any difference at all. I have seen them both stay yellow after 50 miles downhill with regen off. Yellow from one charge to the next. Slows down the charge rate, but not by a lot.


I think of "yellow" as being the high range of normal, but still within the normal range.


I know of one guy who went into the red on his Ribelle on a 110° F. day near Palm Springs. Bike went to limp mode, but back to yellow after a short while. Red is what you do not want to see. I assume the bike will not charge at all when in the red.


If you do not charge all the way to full, you will be much less likely to see the yellow after the charge. But IMO, don't be overly concerned with the battery in the yellow, just expect a slightly longer charge times.


-Don-  Reno, NV

[Specter]

Don't fret the yellow, it's really a non issue.  If they moved the setpoint 10 degrees you'd probably never see it, and it does not affect performance any either I have been told.

Think of the yellow as a reminder.  It's reminding you, yah it's hot out, yes your stuff IS working properly, your battery is warm, but we got this one!!  TBH when you look at battery chemistries, being very warm, you probably are getting a little bit more juice out of it!  With that mindset, yellow is a GOOD thing!

Aaron

[most]

That’s probably one more reason why Energica moved the threshold 5° up on the Experia. The ExPee turns yellow at 45°C, the older platform already at 40°C.
I made a 3800km trip through the alps recently. Always started the days with 100%SOC over night on AC, lower average speeds but 2-3x DCFC throughout the day. After the first DCFC charge, I rarely saw yellow - but occasionally it happened. In such cases pure riding already spreads out the thermal energy in the block away from the hot spots more evenly through the complete block (plus that bit of air cooling) and the sensors were indicating green after a short while. The second DCFC has always put in that bit more heat and the indicator stayed yellow, along with throttled charge speed. I nether saw red, also not on my way to and back from the alps (700km each) with considerably higher average speeds.

[Specter]

You say throttled charge speed in the yellow?

How much?

How much would it allow you to fast charge in Amps, in the Green .vs. in the Yellow ?

From what I have seen on my Ribelle, it'll allow me 75 Amps fast charge, which is 22 - 23 KW coming in.  At that rate, unless it throttled significantly, like 10 amps or more, the slowdown would be literally a few minutes at most, and it's going to slow anyways as it tops off.

What temp does it go Red anyways? and what temp does this clear?

Aaron

[Motoproponent]

You say throttled charge speed in the yellow?

How much?

How much would it allow you to fast charge in Amps, in the Green .vs. in the Yellow ?

Aaron

My experience has been if it was still yellow when I plugged in it would start at 16 to 18kw.

I had it start as low as 11kw (ambient temp was 92 degrees F and it was the 4th DCFC of the day) and ramped down from there. It took 75 minutes to go from 13% to 80%.

Having it throttled a bit and taking 35 minutes instead of 20 minutes is no big deal. But if you're going 450 miles in a day, having 4 charge stops add about 3.5 hours to the travel day feels significant. Plus this happens at high ambient temps and most DCFC chargers are in the back of the parking lot with no shade or anywhere to sit. It feels like a real drag in the moment.

[Specter]

If it's your 4th charge of the day then yah, I bet that battery is warm, it has had really NO time to cool down.  Air cooling is pretty negligible really, it's not like it has a super fin setup or air radiator on the pack.  I wonder how hard it would be for them to put the battery motor inverter all on one liquid cooling loop?  the pump is already there for the motor/inv  just run some lines to the battery and run cooling thru it as well, swap everything to the same coolant and be done with it.  This could be reversed in the winter to take the heat generated from the motor/inverter to help heat the batteries on very cold days too that way you are not sucking them down with internal watt heaters.

just an idea

Aaron

[flynnstig82r]

Thanks for that feedback, Motoproponent! I had been wondering how much the Experia's thermal performance had improved. Sounds like substantially but not a total cure. My 2020 SS9 13.4 had terrible thermal throttling down to 12 kW and even as low as 8 kW in the Sacramento area (temps of 105+ deg F to be fair), and I've heard the 21.5 bikes could be even worse.