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[Oilcan]

Well I bought the Zero for several reasons instead of the Energica.
1. Price
2. Availability
3. 200 miles to the nearest Zero dealership and 600 miles to the nearest Energica dealership.
4. Faster level 2 charging. Where I live there are not that many CCS chargers and there are a lot more level 2. One of my favorite local destinations is 120 miles away and there are no CCS chargers there or on the way and there are level 2. I plan to add the option charging that will allow the bike to take advantage of the full 11 kw of the Tesla destination chargers.
5. The phone app gives you some geek things that I like too such as over the air firmware updates. With no local support for Energica a firmware update is a 1,200 mile trip.

I picked it up Monday and have ridden it for about 500 miles . So far I am happy with my decision.

[TheRan]

I do wonder, why bother with a DSR/X when you already have an Experia? Less performance, less range, slower charging, more likely to have some sort of software fault, probably worse dealer support.

Faster charging when in the Reno area where there are J-plugs all over (and most are free) that can handle 7KW. Neither of my Energicas are here in Reno right now. They are both at my Auburn house. Energica can only do 3 KW on AC.

Really? I don't know the ins and outs of public charging, only ever done it on AC once, but Plugshare shows a fair amount of Tesla chargers in the area and a few CCS. Do you really AC charge at 7kW that often anyway? I'd imagine if you're riding far enough to run down the DSR/X then having to wait 2+ hours to charge is gonna suck.

[DonTom]

Really? I don't know the ins and outs of public charging, only ever done it on AC once, but Plugshare shows a fair amount of Tesla chargers in the area and a few CCS. Do you really AC charge at 7kW that often anyway? I'd imagine if you're riding far enough to run down the DSR/X then having to wait 2+ hours to charge is gonna suck.

I use Tesla destination charge stations and J-plugs  quite often. Places such as here, and here and here where they have nothing else. And many places only have J-plugs and no CCS fast chargers for countless miles. Places such as Susanville, CA.  Yes, a lot of these places have Tesla SuperChargers and nothing else.


I need to recharge almost every time I ride an electric motorcycle. Very rare on my EV cars. I do my longer rides on motorcycles.



I don't ever let it get down that far, I try to stay between 20-85% SOC or so and makes stops about as often as I can find a J-plug.


3KW is a pain.  Six KW I can hack. I like to take several breaks while I am riding. I often even get on this forum when I am AC charging or having lunch or whatever in a place such as Fallon, NV (the only fast charger there is permanently out of service).


Likewise, there are also many places that have CCS and no J-plugs.  Such as BridgePort, CA.  But I see a new Tesla Destination charge station at the Bar & Grill that was not there last month. I don't know if they will let anybody use it. It does say "Tesla only", not sure if that really means what it says as I know it will work with any of my bikes. The 12KW units always work. I have trouble with the older 14KW TDSs. They often work for five minutes and go into alarm.


Where I am going can make me take a different electric bike.


It's the ICE bikes I want to reduce my numbers on, not the electrics, I ride the electrics the most of all.


-Don-  Reno, NV

[Oilcan]

Don.
As an owner of both the Zero DSR/X and the Energica Experia you should have a special insight into the comparison of these two bike. Outside of the charging and range differences how do the bikes compare in comfort, performance, handling, and overall riding enjoyment ?  Do you prefer one over the other as a daily rider ?

[DonTom]

Don.
As an owner of both the Zero DSR/X and the Energica Experia you should have a special insight into the comparison of these two bike. Outside of the charging and range differences how do the bikes compare in comfort, performance, handling, and overall riding enjoyment ?  Do you prefer one over the other as a daily rider ?

They are difficult to compare. I really enjoy them both equally but for different reasons. Between the two, which I take will be decided on the type of charge stations on the way and that is the main if not only reason for me to prefer one bike over the other.


Comfort is about the same, maybe just slightly better on the Experia--at least to me. I have not yet tried either bike in the Sport mode, I see no real need for it, so I am not the right person to ask for that type of performance. I enjoy the ride on each equally.



I can charge my 2017 Zero SR at 7.9 KW (with my external chargers) with AC and can charge my 2020 SS9- at around 24 KW with DC.  I keep both of those bikes at my Auburn house.


I keep the Zero DSR/X and my Energica Experia here in Reno.  So at either place, I can decide which to take by the type of charge stations in route. Seems to me we are getting more J-1772 stations, more Tesla destination charge stations as we have less CCS, mainly because they often do not work and are never repaired from what I can see. More of a problem in Nevada. Broken CCS stations include Incline Village, Hawthorne, Rye Patch, Middlegate. All of these have been broken for more than six months. But all of these places have an AC charge station there or reasonably close.


IMO, reasonable charge rates on a trip start at six KW.


And say if I want to go to say Chico, CA from here, it is 165 miles. My Experia can only make it with slow AC charging. My DSR/X can charge twice as fast on the way there. No CCS on the way.


Both bikes handle great, IMO. The Experia has better range than the DSR/X even when charged to 120%, but even the DSR/X can go farther than I want to take my breaks.


Charging to 120% takes forever, of course, so that is somewhat useless during most trips, but helps a lot when you leave from home for a long trip.


I have the sidecases, travel trunk, centerstand and crash bars on order for the DSR/X, so that could reduce my range a little. The Experia has better range than the DSR/X even with all the luggage on the Experia.


-Don-  Reno, NV

[Oilcan]

Thanks for your insight. So it still just boils down to charging. Like you, where I live there are a lot more AC chargers. I plan on adding the additional charger to my DSR/X this winter to increase the charging speed.

[DonTom]

Thanks for your insight. So it still just boils down to charging. Like you, where I live there are a lot more AC chargers. I plan on adding the additional charger to my DSR/X this winter to increase the charging speed.

I have mixed feelings about doing that, based on the low number J-plugs that can do more than seven KW in this area, I will often be charging at 6.6 KW anyway. But there are some 70-amp (16,800 watts) J-charge stations around northern Lake Tahoe as well as an 80-Amp (19,200 watts) J-plug charging station at Bridgeport,CA and a few other J-plugs that can do 12KW AC or more, especially when Tesla destinations charge stations are included.


I also do not want to give up the extra storage space of the "tank". But if I could always charge at the 13.2 KW, I would go for it.


I looked online and I see the extra 6.6 KW charger for the DSR/X costs 3K$. More if a dealer installs it. I do not know if it requires a dealer installation or not.


There is also the issue of how the AC charging will lower on hot days. If extra hot, bike cannot be charged at all. I was stuck in Carson City for several hours last year on my 2017 Zero SR with a bike that would not charge at all when it was around 102°F outside. BTW, the very first symptom that this will happen is when the bike's BMS turns off all regen while riding. I could charge enough to get home when it started to get dark and cooled off a bit.


-Don-  Reno, NV

[Oilcan]

Yes I don’t want to give up the storage either but I have a top box for my gear. Around here I have more 11 to 16 kw chargers than the 7 kw ones so I am good there. I am also in a mild climate area so over heating is not a big problem and the winter is not to bad either as long as it not raining.

[DonTom]

Yes I don’t want to give up the storage either but I have a top box for my gear. Around here I have more 11 to 16 kw chargers than the 7 kw ones so I am good there. I am also in a mild climate area so over heating is not a big problem and the winter is not to bad either as long as it not raining.

Do you plan on installing the extra charger yourself or are you going to have a dealer do it?


BTW, where are you located?


-Don-  Reno, NV

[Oilcan]

I am going to have the dealer install it. Max Motorsports in Birmingham Alabama. I live in Mississippi and they are the closest dealer. Probably do in in January once the temperatures drop.

[DonTom]

I am going to have the dealer install it. Max Motorsports in Birmingham Alabama. I live in Mississippi and they are the closest dealer. Probably do in in January once the temperatures drop.

I think I will also get another charger, mainly because of the high current Telsa Destination chargers around. I just discovered the one I am using now while charging my DSR/X here is 80-amps. And I use this one a lot. But I still have some mixed feelings because I enjoy these long breaks as I always find something to do, such as use this computer I always take with me. I am now sitting under a shady tree.


I want to know if it is possible for me to install it myself or if special dealer equipment is required. Does anybody here know?  I prefer to do it myself, if possible.



-Don-  Portola, CA

[Oilcan]

On the Zero website you can download the installation instructions. I have looked at them but didn’t read them thoroughly. I can’t imagine that there isn’t a dealer only firmware update needed. I will take another look.

[Oilcan]

Looks like you need DIAG4Zero software on your computer and an OBD II adapter to program the chargers.

[LeverCommaJohn]

So, effectively, no. We can't install it ourselves. Until such time as the charge curve improves on the upper end of 60+% SOC, then I find its effectiveness rather limited for the cost. Give me the storage, a large cup of coffee, croissant, and my sudoku puzzle book any day. I can wait.

[Oilcan]

There is a post on Facebook of the charging curve of the rapid charge on the DSR/X and it took  an hour and six minutes to change from 0 to 95%. It was still charging at 7 kWh at 95% too so not bad in my opinion.