Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[NEW2elec]

So maybe Sam's Energicar idea got this started, who knows, but how does an Energica Inside sound?

From the YouTube channel Transport Evolved:

[NEW2elec]

And also going to New Jersey.
From EV Rider:

[HoodRichOG]

I cannot say that I am a fan of this.

Past results are not an indicator of future performance, but this is far from the first time Ideanomics has tried putting many operations under one campus/roof. Just Google "ideanomics fintech village". I really hope they have learned from their mistakes.

Also, in a mid-market company like Energica, there is a major risk of loss of focus from multiple projects and initiatives.

I really hope they succeed on both fronts (obviously), and will be cautiously optimistic about this. Go Energica!

[Stonewolf]

So maybe Sam's Energicar idea got this started, who knows, but how does an Energica Inside sound?

Well Ducati's gotta get up to speed on electric bikes somehow ...

[NEW2elec]

Stonewolf, did you know that already?
Because that's basically all the MotoE Ducatis are, Energicas with new body work, no joke.

[HoodRichOG]

Stonewolf, did you know that already?
Because that's basically all the MotoE Ducatis are, Energicas with new body work, no joke.

I cannot imagine this being true.

[MVetter]

Stonewolf, did you know that already?
Because that's basically all the MotoE Ducatis are, Energicas with new body work, no joke.

What makes you think that?

[NEW2elec]

Well, it's been put out there.  Any one or all parties could be wrong or lying you just never know.

Here is an older interview from Motorsport dot com written by  Oriol Puigdemont.


https://www.motorsport.com/motoe/news/energica-ceo-ducati-not-entering-short-sighted/6724421/

Kind of the important part here:

"We have known Ducati for many years and we have a good relationship. We didn't talk about this MotoE thing because they wanted to keep it secret. I think I could have helped them a little bit, but not much. It won't be easy for Ducati because making an electric bike is very different from a petrol bike. It's good that they are going their own way, although I know they have bikes of mine in their factory, which they are studying."


Now this was from 2021 and in 2022 Energica has just announced their "Energica Inside" approach IOW putting their drive trains in other products.
Meanwhile Ducati's CEO says they won't have an electric bike ready for production until like 2030 and they want to look at bio fuels.

Make of it what you will.

[MVetter]

Yeah I don't get that vibe from it at all. Also I grabbed this still from the footage:

[PWM]

Totally agree Ducati prototype is vastly different in terms of rear suspension and motor layout cannot be confused w/ Energica.

Given their parent company, VW/Audi/Porsche group, Ducati has easy reach to EV technology.

[Sklith]

Interesting, the screenshot suggests an 800V system. That's a first.

[MVetter]

There's a ton of interesting stuff to glean from that picture. The 700+ volt system is definitely one. Another is that while the SoC reads 42%, the cells are listing 3.764vdc whereas the usual nominal (50%) is 3.65vdc.

Then, additionally, the cell temperature is listed as 33 degrees Celsius, as is the water temperature. Liquid cooled pack?

[PWM]

Liquid cooled pack?

"The focus of the project are, in addition to better performance, the containment of weight and the consistency of power delivery during the race, obtained thanks to the attention in the development of a cooling system suitable for the objective"

Immersion cooling is the most efficient and Quantumscape NCM solid-state cells are likely to be used given QS is an affiliated business unit?

https://www.ducati.com/ww/en/news/ducati-motoe-bike-takes-to-the-track-for-the-first-time-on-the-misano-circuit

[wavelet]

Well, it's been put out there.  Any one or all parties could be wrong or lying you just never know.

Here is an older interview from Motorsport dot com written by  Oriol Puigdemont.


https://www.motorsport.com/motoe/news/energica-ceo-ducati-not-entering-short-sighted/6724421/

Kind of the important part here:

"We have known Ducati for many years and we have a good relationship. We didn't talk about this MotoE thing because they wanted to keep it secret. I think I could have helped them a little bit, but not much. It won't be easy for Ducati because making an electric bike is very different from a petrol bike. It's good that they are going their own way, although I know they have bikes of mine in their factory, which they are studying."


Now this was from 2021 and in 2022 Energica has just announced their "Energica Inside" approach IOW putting their drive trains in other products.
Meanwhile Ducati's CEO says they won't have an electric bike ready for production until like 2030 and they want to look at bio fuels.

Make of it what you will.

Absolutely nothing there hints in the slightest that there's Energica IP, let alone parts in the upcoming Ducati MotoE. And they have lots of IP -- they wrote every single line of SW related to the bikes themselves, and designed all the parts in-house... Their original motivation for making e-motorcycles was as a a technology demonstration for their parent company's 3D printing tech. Cevolini was thinking of cars at first, but realized that would be much more complex.
No way that the new Ducati has an Energica drivetrain without them getting full credit for it.

All the interview shows is her need to spin being kicked out of MotoE. She could hardly say anything else.

I'm pretty sure Energica wasn't kicked out because there was anything weak in their bikes' performance or tech -- but because Enel (Italian energy conglomerate who are the major sponsor of MotoE) decided they needed better name recognition for the racing class.
It remains to be seen to what extent Ducati is committed -- I suspect not very much at this point.

[wavelet]

Interesting, the screenshot suggests an 800V system. That's a first.

There are tradeoffs using higher-voltage traction system, and I expect they are a bit different with bikes than with cars. If the inverter can still be sufficiently lightweight, they're probably saving weight on cable copper, and a few % in efficiency going from battery to motor (and need a little less cooling).
I suspect that going to liquid cooling allows using a more precise thermal model, just like with ICEs.