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[TheRan]

You mean stuff like frame sliders or crash bars? I'm thinking more about head on collisions that would usually bend and crack the headstock area of a regular frame. With Can-am going with a separate bolt on piece it will probably be stiffer than a regular frame, which means it transfers more force into the battery casing.

[Richard230]

You could mitigate this with secondary protection. But let's face it, insurance premiums are going to be sky high, until batteries become commodity items.

Cas

That is a good point. The third-party liability-only insurance for my Zero is about 25% more than it was for my BMW R1200RS. (I never wanted to pay for collision insurance.)

[Stonewolf]

I think the big issue with insurance and repairability is getting shops and manufacturers to stop clutching their pearls and start cracking open battery boxes to work on the guts inside.

The current situation is like saying "oh no you have a bad exhaust seal, guess we'll just throw the engine away".

[Specter]

I can pretty much tell you right now, any battery that was in an accident, you are probably NOT going to find anywhere in any secondary market.  They don't want the liability attached to that.

With the boogey man mentality with Lith batteries, AND insurance companies, I  don't see them letting many people crack it open and see what makes it tick.  There isn't a whole hell of a lot to 'fix' in a battery case.  Failed BMS, bad cell, replace both is about all to do, or maybe a bad weld lets loose or something.   Correct me if I am wrong but I believe Energica will already do that for their battery packs, they are not afraid to open their own packs up to conduct repairs etc.

Aaron

[TheRan]

There have been plenty of batteries from totalled Zeros that have been sold on. Same with all the electric car batteries out there on the used market, they're just sold as seen with no guarantee.

[Specter]

and the insurance companies are good with you putting one of those in your vehicle?
They tend to get real squirrely with the batteries, especially when every time a fire happens everyone goes apeshit over it.

Aaron

[TheRan]

Insurance have no need to know that the battery has been replaced, never mind where it came from. You don't notify insurance when you replace any part of a vehicle, gas or electric, as long as it's a near identical part and doesn't effect performance or value.

[Stonewolf]

Energica are indeed more than happy to have your dealer get all in there and work on the battery but elsewhere it's a different story, especially in the car world.

There's a guy around the corner from here who runs a Prius battery shop out of his garage, regularly see him hanging out with the door open testing cells from some taxi that's pulled up on the drive.

[hotsauce]

From the linked July 24th Advpulse article:

"Looking closely at BRP’s patents, the battery is a load bearing structure in the chassis and is suspected to be made up of a total of 490 cells. Featuring a liquid-cooled power storage, the battery is expected to have a range of over 100 kilometers (~62 miles)"

Those details make me think it'll be around $10K at least and not do much that an Ebike wouldn't do for $1500 and no licensing requirement

[Nairb]

CanAmMotorcycles Youtube homepage now has a livestream scheduled for August 19th at 7:30pm:

"The World Premiere of Can-Am Motorcycles
Scheduled for 8/19/24, 7:30?PM
Join us on August 19, 2024, at 9:30 p.m. EDT for the long-awaited reveal of the new Can-Am electric motorcycles! Get a glimpse of the future of two-wheel riding with our groundbreaking electric models and their cutting-edge features."

https://www.youtube.com/@CanAmMotorcycles

[Fran K]

34 minutes and counting down to their youtube presentation for the date Aug 19.

I stopped by a Can Am dealership in Palmer Ma. today and asked how many of the electric bikes they were getting in.  Guy says essentially quite likely none.  They would need to buy equipment and are expecting to be pressured into putting in chargers in the future.  Have not decided but I get the sentiment.  We will see in the presentation if they say how many dealers have signed on.  Very similar to asking New Holland tractor dealerships if they will be carrying the 65 hp electric T4 tractor that computes out to holding 8 gallons of diesel in energy.

[TheRan]

A video from Fortnine



While the Origin seems great and the short range would work for me (my 7.2 DS works well for me, living near the countryside I don't have far to go to go off-road) it's just hard to justify that price of £15.4k when a new DS is only £800 more. Of course they're not comparable in terms of capability, the Origin is 50kg lighter while the DS has a fair bit more power and range so it's like comparing a dual sport to an adventure bike, but for the money you're getting a lot more battery and better components with the Zero.

[Nairb]

8.9kwh battery with liquid cooling for both it and the motor.  Fully encased, tensioned chain in oil.  50 min level 2, 6.6kw charge time for 20-80% via j1772.  Origin has 115km range on knobby tires, weighs 400lbs, $18999 CAD. Pulse weighs less, maybe 370ish lbs iirc...

Kinda rather have for 12-15kwh battery and faster j3400 nacs charging @450-475 lbs (but can understand also they probably wanted to keep it under 400 for essentially mainly commuter purposes), even if only 12kw level II (more 20kw L2 Flo chargers are being installed recently in Canada now that Flo makes one, and Tesla destination chargers are often  11-16kw if I recall)

Fortnine's take:





Can-Am's walk a round vid of the Origin (more videos on their channel)

[TheRan]

It's the battery and charger that are liquid cooled, not the motor (or at least I've not seen any mention of it). I don't know if it's actually that necessary with that sort of power output and charging speed (I assume about 6kW).

[Nairb]

At the 3:30 point of the second vid I linked, they mention the motor is liquid cooled, and a bit later I think they mention the charger, battery, and motor are cooled in the same system.

Edit - it's actually earlier, at 2:40 ish where they say all four components are liquid cooled (battery, motor, inverter, charger)