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[Red Clay]

I agree, that is a mystery of a sound. From my experience the belt can go a long way with cracks in the outer layer. Try this: New belts make a strange squeaking sound that can be remedied by applying 100% silicone liquid (treadmill lubricant) to the inside of the belt. The silence of silicone.

Ride On, Red Clay

[sharagan]

I keep the belt clean and checked the tension after every ride. I contacted the tech support of Gates and was told that the crackling noises are not normal. I passed this information to the dealer and still no change in attitude. I contacted Zero customer support, also no change.

After the second belt developed the same symptoms as the first one I started another round of emails to the dealer and also Zero Europe....no change yet.

Offtopic: And I am in the same situation with them regarding deformed tires causing vibrations when riding (after a year I changed them myself), an untrue front wheel affecting the front brake disc, the front wheel has a dent (which was apparently just painted over), squealing back brake and other issues. Either they claim it is within tolerance or normal or not observed.

[Crissa]

Sounds like you need a dealer that will listen to your problems.  Also that you're kinda picky

-Crissa

[sharagan]

what more can the dealer do than listen if the people above them say no. Either I am picky or just used to riding also other motorcycles
I had an electric KTM for 6 years before this Zero and had zero problems (pun intended)...just charging and riding it daily as a commuter with a smile on my face.

[NEW2elec]

Sharagan, your belt looks worse than my 2013 with 43k miles.  I see a thumb print sized scuff early in your video.  The fading looks like it's lived out in the weather which isn't good.

The sound on the video is doing a great imitation of bad bearings.  Take the whole belt off and turn the motor with the power off and see what it sounds like.

See if it's motor or belt.  You should be able to feel the grit in the pulley if it's the bearing by just hand turning.

As for my belt tension, when I pluck the middle section it makes a middle thud. Not spongy and not a guitar string higher pitch twang.
For what that's worth.

The one other thing I'd advise in the future is both have the belt so that it rides 1mm from the left sprocket edge, and get a good torque wrench and tighten that axial bolt down to exactly what they tell you in the manual.  My DS is 75 ft lbs not sure of the FXS's torque.

The tension adjustment bolts only keep the wheel from sliding forward and letting the belt droop off.  It's the tension of the axial nut that keeps it from sliding backward and tightening the belt further.

The gen 3 bikes have the adjusting bolts at the rear of the axial.  I wonder why?

[ZeroChrissy]

As already written in post #15, I have the same crackling.
As written, it seems it's the belt itself.

Cannot feel and hear any bearing damage with belt off.

Off topic, but by the way, the rear axis/tension adjustment is poor and bad by design, Zero should fire the mechanical engineers... :-)

Speacially on the right side, I have observed, the axis is moving inside the hole of the Tension adjustment block.
That hole is just at least 0.5mm too big! The axis has correct torque (100Nm). After adjusting the belt, pulling the axis (100Nm), and doing a first hard rear brake, the axis is moving inside the hole, caused by the force of the brake disc... and with that movement, at the end the belt is missaligned again.
(Also think, with hard accelerations and hard braking, the axis is moving always in the hole by +-0.5mm!)

Now, I am working on selfmade more accurate tension blocks...
Just frustrated with that on that expensive bike.

[sharagan]

Same here, there is no crackling sound on the motor pulley with no belt on it and the old belt does crackle even when moving around in my hands.

I have also noticed the gap on the adjuster, that perfectly explains the following situation:
I adjust the belt to be in the center of the wheel pulley. I torque it down to 100Nm it stays where it is, even when spinning the wheel or turning the bike on and spinning it with the motor on the back paddock stand, but after I ride it even for 5 minutes the belt is at the flange again.

Also it is strange that for the belt to leave a credit card wide gap (0.8mm) to the flange the wheel has to be misaligned in the swingarm (visible by the naked eye).

I completely share your frustration, for that money I would expect this basic bike with no extra features, crude suspension and weak brakes to be at least built properly.

[NEW2elec]

If the belt is moving to the flange on the rear sprocket then most likely the left side adjustment bolt is too far forward or the right side is too far back.
The markings on the side adjustment plates may not be exact but they are pretty close.  Once they are at the same notch approximately, then tighten your axial nut and ride it.
If it rides up the flange, the right side has to go forward (a tiny tiny turn) hold the adjustment bolt in place with one wrench while tightening the locking nut.
Torque the axial nut down and try it again.

Check the sprocket bolts to ensure they are equally tightened.  If the bike is lifted off the ground hold that stick you used to check the true of the wheel to the sprocket against the swing arm.

If you feel the rear is all true there is a less likely option that the motor is off center.

Bottom line is it should be able to be ridden with the 1mm gap to the sprocket flange.

[ZeroChrissy]

Hello,

As written, The thing is here, I can align the belt, but after a short ride the alignment gets lost cause of the axis movement.
So, exactly tweaking at the end helps nothing.

I have the same here, if I align the belt "CreditCard" from sprocket lip, the complete wheel is disaligned. Can see with only my eyes, too. And I can feel it during driving curves...

Sprockt is checked, bolts are new, Pulley is also new.

What does it mean the "motor is off center" ? Is there any chance to adjust the motor better? It seems the motor has a fixed position, given by the 4 screws on the left side!?
Thanks for any help here...

[NEW2elec]

Like I said it much less likely but there are the 4 bolts on the right side of the motor.  There isn't much play on those short threads but it's possible to be off.

Going off my DS, when the belt is setup correctly, and the axial nut is torqued to 75 ft lbs, and the spacers are in and the left side axial stop is flush up against the adjustment plate, then the axial does not move.

Look to see that both of your adjustment plate notches are the same on both sides compared to the swing arm notch.  they might be off a tiny bit but again they should be close.

[sharagan]

Thanks for the hints.

The sprocket is torqued down to the wheel with 35Nm, so ok.
The sprocket is completely true, no issue there.

The spacers on the right side of the motor all have 3,2mm between the adjusting nut and the round shaft touching the motor (the space where the thread is visible).

I am not sure how I could measure the motor sprocket/pulley alignment to the belt as there is no space due to the swingarm....will look for a way.

[ESokoloff]

The gen 3 bikes have the adjusting bolts at the rear of the axial.  I wonder why?

My guess is to counteract the axles tendency to rotate clockwise as the belt only exerts torque to the left side.

Here’s my belt notes that have come from ownership/servicing of a 2016 DSR..

2016 DSR (thin belt) 20/30kg tension  (using Krikit belt tension gauge).

Jacking left screw(bolt) out (adding tension) moves the belt to the right on the rear sheave/sprocket.
Jacking right screw(bolt) out moves the belt to the left. 

NOTE: Position belt with a right side bias as it will shift to the left when the axle bolt is tightened.
This movement to the left is approx 1/16”-1/8” on my bike (yours might vary).

After making an adjustment to a jack screw, must pry right side of wheel forward (or smack it to the right from the back side) to “set” the adjustment as the belt tension on the sheave will pivot the axle ClockWise...........
(In my opinion, the right jack screw SHOULD be located 180° &  push the axle CCW thus countering the Left jack screw CW effect on the Sheave/Belt/Axle. )



NOTE: 1/6 turn of Left jack screw causes a 10KG difference to belt tension.

Best to get the belt/sheave alignment sorted first, then go for proper tension.
I shoot for the greatest tension (30kg).

If you don’t have the correct Metric socket (like me), use a 1-1/16” to tension the axle nut to 102NM (75#’).
Recommend first removing the jack bolts & grinding or filing off the markings so it’s smooth & will not gouge the soft aluminum swing arm.
Put a dab of Anti-seize or heavy grease on the jack bolt threads while your at it.

A few other thoughts.....

Excessive belt tension is not good on bearings & the thicker belt has a higher tension spec then the thin one.
I’m not sure where the best tension point would be on the thick belt, but I would stay towards the lower end yielding about the same as the max thin belt (30kg) unless the bearings were upgraded & can withstand greater belt tension. 

I use a mechanical tension checking device (Gates 91107 Belt Tension Tester) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000MUTAGS/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glc_fabc_23M6C0PXQW8W3RV5GE9W and check several locations of the rear sheave/sprocket in case it’s slightly out of round (different run outs will yield different belt tension readings).

A hexagon fastener has 6 sides so one flat (1/6 full turn) of the LEFT bolt will yield a 10kg change in belt tension.

Must make sure there is a gap (credit card or greater) between the belt & the left hand lip on the sheave/sprocket).

[sharagan]

I got myself a belt alignment laser tool and after extensive fiddling around I have the following findings.

When aligning the wheel with the swingarm the back pulley is aligned with the belt, this is good news.

The motor pulley is also aligned with the belt perfectly and the belt is in the middle of the motor pulley.

BUT the belt is completely shifted to the left, so at the lip.

When I adjust everything to have the credit card gap to the lip, then the wheel is misaligned with the swingarm (1.6mm difference between the adjusting blocks) and also the back pulley is severely out of alignment with the belt according to the tool.

One observation that I made with this setting: when accelerating, the belt will travel to the right and when going off the "gas" and the wheel starts slowing down again it will go back to its original position (1mm of the lip). This does not happen when the pulley and belt are aligned.

Summary: when pulley and belt are aligned, the belt is at the lip. With the 1mm gap, everything is out of alignment.

Is maybe the wheel wrongly positioned on the axle?

Could somebody please measure their spacer between the wheel and the swingarm on the pulley side if by any chance a wrong part was fitted during production on my bike?

Thanks in advance.

[sharagan]

adding photos

the left side has 4.6mm between the wheel and the swingarm

this is the right side

Does everything look ok or is maybe something missing or wrongly fitted?

Thanks.

[Red Clay]

I'm diving into the pool to try to help.

Sharagan, concerning the "out of alignment", have you adjusted the motor mount bolts? This centers the belt on the front (motor) sprocket. If not, are the motor mount bolts snug?