Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[AdamG]

Hi everyone, new member here! I joined this forum because I just got a 2011 Zero DS last week! The test ride before purchasing went great, but now that I’ve been using it for a week, I’ve found a few quirks that I could use help solving.

1. I can’t get a 100% charge. The charger never shows the green LED. I get the yellow 80% LED flashing, which supposedly means the charger and BMS are balancing, or that the BMS is cutting off the charge because 1 or more cells have reached capacity (at least, that’s what the manual says). I don’t understand why the BMS would cut off the charge if some cells are at capacity while others are not. Is it not the whole purpose of the BMS to balance the cells? How can it ever achieve full charge if it cuts off when 1 cell is fully charged but the rest aren’t?
Or is this just a sign of a failing battery pack?

2. I’m not sure how these twist throttles are meant to behave, but mine seems off. The total rotation range is 90 degrees, but I can only use about 15 degrees of rotation to go from a stop to full speed, then I have to try and find micro degrees between the extremes to cruise at a slower speed like 70kmh. Twisting all the way open doesn’t make the bike go any faster than twisting a tiny bit. Almost seems like my top speed is being limited. If I go up a slight incline the bike starts to struggle and slow down, but I can't give it any more juice because further twisting of the throttle doesn't give me more power or speed. I think the top speed is currently around 85kph, but I can’t be sure because of problem 3...

3. Speedometer seems way off. Either everyone around me in their vehicles has decided to go 100kph in an 80 zone, or my speedometer is incorrect. Sure didn’t feel like I was going 100. It looks like the speedometer resets itself during the start-up boot sequence, so I would think it's properly calibrated each time the bike is turned on, so what would throw this off?

Sorry for the long post. I'll likely have more questions about other issues too, but I'd like to find solutions to these larger issues first.

Any help is appreciated!

[DonTom]

Hi everyone, new member here! I joined this forum because I just got a 2011 Zero DS last week! The test ride before purchasing went great, but now that I’ve been using it for a week, I’ve found a few quirks that I could use help solving.

1. I can’t get a 100% charge.

My guess is that  your on-board  charger voltage is low.  If you can get your hands on an old external charger, it should then charge to full. The only difference should be the plug.

I assume you're somewhere in Europe or some other country because you used "km".

I assume the 2011 bikes in Europe are the 2012 models here in the USA. See if your external charge connector is the same color as on the above Q-charger. It's located just above the motor.

-Don-  Reno, NV, USA

[Crissa]

And #3 might explain #2.  The bike finds its speed by the rotation of the motor, and if it's reading high, then it's going to tamp down on the power to the motor thinking it's at maximum.

-Crissa

[Moto7575]

#3 are not sure this is not a km per hour to mile per hour problem ? if so look at the manual and chenge the unit setting

For the 1 you might look for an external charger. There are some on ebay, or look at AF1Racing

#2 is a potentiometer. You might mook for a new part on AF1racing or looking for a broken 2011 model

[TheRan]

It's not a unit issue, his speedo is reading high (100 at what he thinks is 80) but if it was in MPH it would be reading low (about 50mph travelling at the 80km/h limit). If it's running a chain (I found images of supposedly 2011 bike running both chains and belts) it could be that a previous owner changed the gearing. The Unofficial Manual only goes back to 2012 but those had a 4.64:1 ratio.

[AdamG]

Is there a simple way to test the charger before I just go buy a new one? It'll cost an arm and a leg to ship it here since it's heavy, so I need to be sure that'll fix the issue.

Not from Europe, I'm in Canada, just north of you 

This bike has the Agni 95R brushed motor with belt drive. There was an optional sprocket/chain you could purchase, but I'm pretty sure the previous owner didn't swap anything around. It looks like the gauges are Koso RX-1N and the speedometer works off a magnetic sensor mounted at the motor. Maybe the sensor is dirty and it's not getting a clear signal? The bike was pretty dirty when I got it. There's only a few settings I can play with in these instruments, and I'm positive I'm on the KPH setting, not the MPH. There's a submenu you can get into for calibrating the speed that I found at the unofficial manual
https://zeromanual.com/wiki/Instrument_Cluster
Thing is, it says the stock setting is "1972 28-132 2P", but in my menu I can only enter 4 numbers before the "-2P". I thought maybe this 4 digit number is supposed to be the circumference of the rear wheel in mm's, so I entered that. Then the speedo was way off. I was going 80kph when I was creeping along. The original setting was "0546-02P". I'm guessing I just fiddle with those numbers until I get something that feels right?

I've discovered the twist throttle is a Magura 5k ohm potentiometer type. I disconnected the wires to it and tested the resistance at different twist positions. I am getting around 0 when closed, and around 5k when fully open. I say "around" because wherever I hold the grip steady the ohms jump around. They don't stay completely set at a number for a held position.

[AdamG]

Here's the gauges

[AdamG]

The throttle potentiometer

[TheRan]

Those numbers are the sprocket sizes, although this table doesn't have the 28:132 combination but that could be what the 2011 had.

https://zeromanual.com/wiki/Sprocket_Specifications

[Crissa]

The only real way to test the charger or battery is to plug it into different equipment.  You'd need another charger at least.

-Crissa

[DonTom]

Is there a simple way to test the charger before I just go buy a new one? It'll cost an arm and a leg to ship it here since it's heavy, so I need to be sure that'll fix the issue.

You probably can measure the charging battery voltage on the external battery connector when keyed on.  I am not sure what the 2011 battery voltage is, but the battery voltage should always be higher when charging than when not charging. If you find the battery voltage lower than it should be when charged as much as possible and very little  increase in voltage when the charger is added in the circuit compared to it not being added in, it's a good indication that your charger voltage will not go high enough to do any further charging. When charged much less, you will see a greater difference. So first check when not near fully charged and see if you notice a much less of a difference than that near the end of the charge (as high as you can get the SOC).

Remember that you're dealing with high voltage, so be careful.

But you can  bet your on-board charger (OBC) is the problem. It's a rather common problem. That AF1 charger is extra cheap and I would go that route first before buying a new OBC. And then you can still use the AF1 charger along with the OBC and is also a good backup as well as good for troubleshooting your problem. And it should charge to full when  both chargers are used, and will still be a much faster charge than only using the OBC.

They were asking much more for that same charger just a few months ago. They must have had it in stock a while and dropped the price. I doubt you will ever find one at that price again, even with the shipping to Canada added in.

I say "around" because wherever I hold the grip steady the ohms jump around. They don't stay completely set at a number for a held position.

Are you using an analog meter? They don't jump around nearly as much when things are not perfectly steady. I find digital meters to be a poor choice for MOST troubleshooting.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[AdamG]

According to the manual, this bike came with a 28 : 200 tooth belt sprockets. If the sprocket sizes are what I'm supposed to enter into the speedometer menu, then I would need one more space for a 5th digit. I only have space for 4 digits, so not sure how that would work. I've resorted to playing with the numbers and judging how traffic is reacting around me. I think I have it close. I should probably get a friend to drive beside me to confirm with the speedo in their vehicle.

Don, I'll try taking some readings from the charger and battery and see what it's spitting out. I don't really have the need to charge it any faster than the standard 4 hours, but if my readings are off I'll be sure to get a new charger. Thanks for the tip about AF1!

I was using a digital multimeter for testing the throttle potentiometer resistance. I do have an old timers analog one, but it's a confusing mess to use. I ended up using some Deoxit spray, and gave the pot a squirt and rotated it back and forth a zillion times. The readings are waaaay better now, and the throttle has better response. It might be fixed? Before, when I was driving and trying to hold a speed, the bike would kind of surge or lurch. It's better now, but still does it. I have to really pay attention to notice it though, so it's much more subtle. I should probably just get a new throttle to be safe, but I'll see how it goes.

A new developement regarding my top speed; I contacted the previous owner and asked him about how the bike seemed to limit my top speed. He told me that he had to replace the Alltrax motor controller last year and he programmed it to have reduced max amps so that it wouldn't burn out this controller like it did the last. So that explains that! I just need to get me a serial to USB cable, download the software, change that back to stock settings and everything should be tickity-boo!

[TheRan]

For the sprocket number you could try dividing both by 4 to get 7:50 (so enter 0750). That would make sense with the 0546 that it was previously, 5:46 is kind of close but still off. It thinks you have a higher gear than you actually have so it thinks you're going faster than you are, assuming you do actually have 28:200 sprockets.

[AdamG]

There's been a recent development; I got the green LED 100% charge! I think driving the bike all week cycled the batteries enough times to balance out the cells. So glad that issue took care of itself.

Thanks for all the help and suggestions everyone! Not sure if I'll get any more riding in this year. Temperatures are dropping to the unpleasant level for motorcycles. I might do a few test runs after playing with the Alltrax programming, but other than that I'll just be tucking the bike away for the winter.

Actually, I might be pulling the bike apart to make some modifications, so I'll likely have some more questions that I'll put in a new thread.

Thanks again!

[AdamG]

More recent developments.

I got the serial to USB cable and connected to my Alltrax controller to adjust the max amp output. When I got into the menu's I found that it was set at 90%, but after doing some searching on this site, I found that the stock setting is supposed to be 90%. I also learned that it doesn't really matter what the settings are in the controller because it's all actually controlled by the MBB. Now I need to build a cable to plug into that and try to learn what to do to alter those settings because I'm still only getting a top speed of about 90km/h.

I tried adjusting the speedometer to the 0750 figure that was suggested and the result was when I was traveling at what felt like 80km/h, the gauges were maxed out at 120km/h and blinking at me. Clearly not the right setting. I put it back to the 0515 setting I had previously set.

And my throttle is still out of wack. Twisting it from 0 to halfway does the whole speed range, and anything over halfway does nothing. Again, this might be something I can fix in the MBB settings, or maybe I just need to try another twist throttle.