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[MVetter]

Each brand has their strengths. Zero has traditionally excelled as a commuter that people ride to work, ride home, and plug in overnight to recharge. With the SR/F platform they're taking everything they've learned from the last decade and poured it into a refined sport bike that you can go for a ride, take a leisurely lunch while charging, and then go for another ride. The bikes are quiet, smooth, and all sorts of fun. Special mention to the FXS as one of the most entertaining urban commuter/toys made in recent memory. EVERYONE should test ride an FXS at some point.

Energicas were born as track bikes. The EGO is truly the flagship as a flashy beast that will go fast, charge fast, and never overheat. But then the Italians started to realize a lot of us wanted comfier, more upright riding which led to the SS9. It goes fast, it charges fast, and it never overheats. It's also exceptionally comfortable. Yes, the bike shines most when you have a solid DC Fast Charge network around you. Which I do. Ultimately this is why I sold my Zeroes for an SS9. There are things I miss about my Zeroes but I am happy with my decision overall.

The LiveWire is surprisingly well-made. It's geared lower than both the other bikes so they made it exceptionally peppy from 0-114 mph. They also made some interesting decisions about cooling the components, including some clever battery cooling. It, too, can ride hard all day and not overheat. The decision to omit level 2 charging and the ergonomic position of the bike will frustrate some people, as will the $30,000 price tag. But it's a very, very good bike.

It comes down to personal preference, your riding style, and what sort of infrastructure you have around you. I don't think there's a bad choice in the lineup.

[centra12]

The one thing I wished the Zeros had was a reverse function.  It really should be a easy issue on electric bikes.  I would think it is more of a software programming thing.  Have a switch to run engine in reverse and have a programmed safety limiter so you can only go a couple mph.  But I am not an engineer so maybe it is harder. I deal backing up without it but it would be nice.  Anytime I find myself complaining about backing it up into my garage I just look at my 650# ICE bike and I don't feel that the Zero is that bad.

These functions have been available for tens of years   

The Sevcon is already prepared for reverse gear! You only have to wire the input with a switch and program the max speed with the DVT software.

It also has a speed hold function -> cruise control but Sevcon does not recommend it

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

The one thing I wished the Zeros had was a reverse function.  It really should be a easy issue on electric bikes.  I would think it is more of a software programming thing.  Have a switch to run engine in reverse and have a programmed safety limiter so you can only go a couple mph.  But I am not an engineer so maybe it is harder. I deal backing up without it but it would be nice.  Anytime I find myself complaining about backing it up into my garage I just look at my 650# ICE bike and I don't feel that the Zero is that bad.

These functions have been available for tens of years   

The Sevcon is already prepared for reverse gear! You only have to wire the input with a switch and program the max speed with the DVT software.

It also has a speed hold function -> cruise control but Sevcon does not recommend it

Yes, I had this function installed on my 2016 DSR, and will likely re-install it on my 2020 DSR when I get a sizeable fairing put back on it.

Sevcon controllers are mostly targeted at electric forklifts and light trucks, so their features at low speed are well-supported (including inching that forklifts need for precision placement), but at high speeds their featureset is not that robust (speed control and traction control being the things SDS owners miss most).

[DonTom]

Yes, the bike shines most when you have a solid DC Fast Charge network around you. Which I do.

It's much more important to have them around 50 miles away, which I do for east and west, but not for north and south from Reno.

What I would like to see Energica do is somehow squeeze in a 6 kW charger for J-1772. Many places I go only have J-1772 or a 240 VAC outlet (Genoa, NV) and even with my smaller Energica  battery, I would like J-1772 charging to be faster. 6KW I would find to be reasonable. 

I modified a granny cable to be small so I carry it with me and I can charge from anywhere I can find AC voltage. 120 VAC, Tesla Destination chargers included. It all fits in  one side bag and uses an extension cord.

The HD Livewire I would never consider with its useless J-1772 charging. What would have helped a lot is if every HD shop had CCS instead of only those that sell the LW.

BTW, the casino parking lots are closed here in Reno so that means no J-1772 charging from many locations that I used to use. Especially the Tammerack Casino in the very southern part of Reno.

But the chargers at the very top of VA City at the courthouse  parking lot (Tesla and J-1772) are still usable.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[centra12]

There are reasons enough to go for Zero instead of Energica. Picking a bike isn't only based on battery capacity and charging speed.

Just a few (not all important to me but some are)

- price

Zero chanceless 

The basic model of the SR/F costs with us 20.790€

The Eva EsseEsse9 with the small battery 13,4KWH has 180Nm (Zero 190Nm) and a continuous power of 108PS (Zero 54PS) costs 19.500€ with tax

[TheRan]

There are reasons enough to go for Zero instead of Energica. Picking a bike isn't only based on battery capacity and charging speed.

Just a few (not all important to me but some are)

- price

Zero chanceless 

The basic model of the SR/F costs with us 20.790€

The Eva EsseEsse9 with the small battery 13,4KWH has 180Nm (Zero 190Nm) and a continuous power of 108PS (Zero 54PS) costs 19.500€ with tax

Are you not aware that Zero makes bikes other than the SR/F? Energica has nothing close to the price of a 7.2kW/h S/DS/FX/S, or as light, or as capable off road as the DS/FX.

[centra12]

Yes, the bike shines most when you have a solid DC Fast Charge network around you. Which I do.

It's much more important to have them around 50 miles away, which I do for east and west, but not for north and south from Reno.

What I would like to see Energica do is somehow squeeze in a 6 kW charger for J-1772.

Theoretically it would be possible to charge the Energica with a TC Charger and a control unit for CCS.

But that's bullshit too much weight and cable

In 3 years we will be drowning in CCS charging stations in Europe

[centra12]

Are you not aware that Zero makes bikes other than the SR/F? Energica has nothing close to the price of a 7.2kW/h S/DS/FX/S, or as light, or as capable off road as the DS/FX.

These are not motorcycles but scooters/pocketbike   

[MVetter]

The FXS is absolutely a motorcycle. A ridiculously fun one at that.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

Are you not aware that Zero makes bikes other than the SR/F? Energica has nothing close to the price of a 7.2kW/h S/DS/FX/S, or as light, or as capable off road as the DS/FX.

These are not motorcycles but scooters/pocketbike   

This attitude is shared by a segment of riders for whom the Energica is the right choice.

Even the weakest Zero is absolutely more capable, in terms of power and torque, than the 500cc offerings on the market (2-stroke models aside), and none of those are pocketbikes and I'm not including scooters.

I would (like Crissa) prefer that such comparisons stay out of the Zero section of the forums. There are vendor-neutral subforums where you can posture about what you consider to be a real motorcycle or not, and this type of opinion belongs there.

[centra12]

Even the weakest Zero is absolutely more capable, in terms of power and torque, than the 500cc offerings on the market (2-stroke models aside), and none of those are pocketbikes and I'm not including scooters.

I would (like Crissa) prefer that such comparisons stay out of the Zero section of the forums. There are vendor-neutral subforums where you can posture about what you consider to be a real motorcycle or not, and this type of opinion belongs there.

If I look at the permanent line of a SR/DSR, 250-cm3 would easily be enough to make Zero drivers cry.

[TheRan]

You obviously have no clue what you're talking about when it comes to Zeros, you should just leave this section and go back to the Energica boards. Even a non-R S/DS is faster than many A2 bikes, those are in the 40-47hp range and 300-400cc. The R models are faster than any A2 bikes and up there with the 65-70hp 500-650cc bikes.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

This thread is only contributing to my perception that Energica has a marketing problem, in that their owner community is attracting and retaining too many jerks and snobs.

[centra12]

I rather think that Zero drivers can't distinguish between top performance and continuous power.

[BrianTRice@gmail.com]

I rather think that Zero drivers can't distinguish between top performance and continuous power.

We don't care and you do. That's all.

But you created this thread to insult us, and you're teaching us more about your attitude than about the bikes themselves. It's not a good look, and I advise you take a step back and wonder what you think you're accomplishing.