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Author Topic: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights  (Read 720 times)

NEW2elec

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12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« on: September 09, 2018, 11:23:53 AM »

So I saw my 13 dash with it's charge bars and analog RPM gauge reboot while riding down the road.  It happened so quick I thought it was odd but no harm done and it didn't happen again, that day.
Today I saw it happen again and again with it going out for about 20 secs before coming back on.
This happened about six times and the second to last time I thought I just wouldn't get it back, but a good hard bump in the road and it sprang back to life until the last mile back home.

I saw old posts and the Wiki showing the trouble shooting and so far I have only checked the 4 small amp fuses and they are fine.  I'll try to check for maybe a loose number three high amp fuse when I can get the bike up.

I know it could be the DC/DC controller but would the on off symptoms be the controller on it's last leg or more likely something loose?  I don't know how these things die.

And just to be clear with those of you who know the 13s,  I lost all of the liquid crystal display, the run light and tail light and all signals.  The bike rode fine and the kick stand down warning light would come on and off as always and the green main light on the right worked as well but not the turn arrows or the tach.

I did see it is likely the ground wire under the tank is in contact with the rear front fender (I lowered the forks years ago) but seems to still be screwed tightly and no wear on the insulation.

Any tips are helpful, thanks.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2018, 11:26:56 AM by NEW2elec »
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DonTom

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2018, 12:03:58 PM »

I know it could be the DC/DC controller but would the on off symptoms be the controller on it's last leg or more likely something loose? 
It sure sounds like a poor connection somewhere, but it's also possible for that loose connection to be in the DC to DC converter.

I take it when it fails, you lose all of your 13.8  volts, headlight and all?

And make sure that ground wire is okay, as the loss of your 13.8 volts can be the ground or the hot side.

But to find the problem, you first will want to keep the bike in the failed mode (if possible) key on "on" , and see if you have voltage coming out of the DC to DC converter.

If you cannot duplicate the problem, it could be a lot more difficult to troubleshoot. Wiggle things around and even tap on the DC to DC converter to see if anything will go into the failed state.

-Don-  Reno, NV
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CScalpeL

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2018, 08:08:55 PM »

When my DC2DC died, it was on and off (drove me nuts) for a couple of days until it was just off...

Replaced the DC2DC and walla problem solved.
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NEW2elec

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2018, 01:05:59 AM »

Thanks CScalpet that was what I was thinking/worried about.  I'll plan on changing it out.

On the Wiki there is a link to Thunderstruck for the 13-14 300W controller but it's the 500W unit so does it work in the 13's in place of the 300W one?
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clockfort

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2018, 04:26:21 AM »

(I recently replaced my 2015 SR DC-DC 12V converter in this thread http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=7981 )

Yes, you can use the higher spec'd unit as a drop-in. Your bike doesn't need the higher wattage, as it doesn't have peak-power-hungry ABS pumps that later bikes have, but you won't hurt anything and the individual circuits will remain correctly fused at their own amperages.

If you can, testing the DC-DC converter on a bench power supply and multimeter is informative, at least for my own case; I'm pretty sure most of my own issue turned out to be moisture ingress causing intermittent shorts in the 12V system.

Good luck in general, the 12V converter is smack-dab in the middle of the bike and is annoying to deal with.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2018, 04:28:42 AM by clockfort »
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NEW2elec

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2018, 05:13:44 AM »

Thanks Clockfort I got my new controller yesterday and after digging into the bike a bit I threw in the towel and I'm going to let the dealer play with it.  Just too many wire connectors tiny zip ties and plastic push pin fasteners for my nerves to deal with.
My dealer agreed to just swap it out but told me they go through Zero most of the time.  I told them if the new one didn't fix it then it was on me.

On a quick side note these parts going out are so dangerous to any night riding (which is what I mostly do) having two units wired together so one instantly backs up a failed one and then sends an error code but keeps the lights on would be worth looking into.
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clockfort

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2018, 06:06:22 AM »

Thanks Clockfort I got my new controller yesterday and after digging into the bike a bit I threw in the towel and I'm going to let the dealer play with it.  Just too many wire connectors tiny zip ties and plastic push pin fasteners for my nerves to deal with.
My dealer agreed to just swap it out but told me they go through Zero most of the time.  I told them if the new one didn't fix it then it was on me.
Yeah, I only had the patience and nerve to do it because I'm dangerous with a label maker and now the inside of my bike is lit up like a christmas tree full of labels on every connector and terminal. (see photos)

Quote
On a quick side note these parts going out are so dangerous to any night riding (which is what I mostly do) having two units wired together so one instantly backs up a failed one and then sends an error code but keeps the lights on would be worth looking into.

I considered something more or less the same as your bonus-12V idea, but at least in the manner I believe that my bike failed (moisture shorts the 12V system --> DC-DC converter goes into overcurrent protection mode and turns off) the backup would also fail.

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NEW2elec

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2018, 06:27:46 AM »

Niccccce!

I got a few of the connectors loose but they all have some other little way of locking and unlocking and I could see my future self very angry at pulling wires apart and racking up higher and higher repair costs so I excepted my limitations.

I see future designs housing everything much more securely and almost element proof.  Like a safe little component womb.
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NEW2elec

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Re: 12V loss of most of dash functions and all lights
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2018, 08:56:21 AM »

So my dealer got the Sevcon replaced.  All back to normal.  Thanks for all the help and tips guys.
After adding up all costs I wish I'd paid more attention in my electronics class, I'd be a wealthy man.  Hopefully it will last another 25k miles or more.
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