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Author Topic: EV noise regulations being proposed  (Read 1337 times)

Richard230

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EV noise regulations being proposed
« on: January 09, 2013, 04:22:33 AM »

According to an article in my newspaper, written by the AP and datelined "Detroit", "A government safety agency wants electric and hybrid vehicles to make more noise when traveling at low speeds so pedestrians can hear them coming."  That agency would be the NHTSA and they want EVs to make more noise when traveling below 18 mph.  They say the vehicles make enough noise above that speed.  The rule is required by the "Pedestrian Safety Enhancement Act" that was passed by Congress in 2010.

The public has 60 days to comment on the proposed rule.  The Agency will use public input to craft a final rule. NHTSA estimates that the new noise rule would prevent 2,800 pedestrian and cyclist injuries during the life of each model year of electric and hybrid vans, trucks and cars (no mention of motorcycles in the article, but it seems likely they won't be left out). Automakers would be able to pick the sounds that the cars make from a range of choices. Similar vehicles would have to make the same sounds and be heard over background noises.
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

SolarWAguy

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Re: EV noise regulations being proposed
« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2013, 11:33:15 AM »

I hope that this doesn't happen.  I was hoping for it to be a little more quiet 40 years from now when I'm old and playing guitar on my front porch.  Plus I love the absence of noise while riding my Zero.

I too heard this on the Am radio though, along with video cameras being equipped with breathalyzers to start their vehicle, for people who have probationary periods after dui, and the cameras would ensure that they are the ones blowing into the breathalyser not someone else.  What is the world coming to?
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frodus

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Re: EV noise regulations being proposed
« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2013, 10:37:20 PM »

If it requires conversions to do it, mine is going to be the most annoying sound I can find.....

www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqJVlS37J74
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Travis

benswing

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Re: EV noise regulations being proposed
« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2013, 11:33:37 PM »

Has anyone heard of a slow moving EV actually making contact with a pedestrian? 

Then there's this:
Quiet Electric Cars 'Pose No Danger' To Visually Impaired
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/quiet-electric-cars-pose-no-danger-to-visually-impaired-2319557.html

At least Britain has a clue.
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Richard230

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Re: EV noise regulations being proposed
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2013, 12:58:18 AM »

So how do they plan to protect deaf people?  The mind boggles.  ::)
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manlytom

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Re: EV noise regulations being proposed
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2013, 04:17:29 AM »

So everything that makes barely a noise needs this then! Like this morning a push bike nearly run me over while walking... Or a lot of the new cars and scooters that are rather quiet while going slow.

Let's vote against such regulations. They will do more chaos then save people.
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Tom
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protomech

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Re: EV noise regulations being proposed
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2013, 05:56:50 AM »

Specifically calling out EVs and hybrids is backwards-thinking. If this is about a required minimum sound level, then encode in the FMVSS under what conditions a road-legal vehicle must generate what sound characteristics and be done with it. I wouldn't be surprised if a number of combustion engine cars would also fail those conditions; my mother's old Camry was virtually silent at idle except for accessory belt noise.

Otherwise this smells like a knee-jerk reaction, and maybe a money grab.

NoiseOff provides a good overview of the NFB's history of noise regulation lobbying. They also point to a 2008 NHTSA study titled "Incidence of Pedestrian and Bicyclist Crashes by Hybrid Electric Passenger Vehicles (PDF)". It's a pretty decent study, if limited by sample size, and points to a need for quiet vehicles to emit some type of audible alert when performing certain maneuvers. One major flaw pointed out below.

Quote
This study found that pedestrian and bicyclist crashes involving both HEVs and ICE vehicles commonly occurred on roadways, in zones with low speed limits, during daytime and in clear weather, with higher incidence rates for HEVs when compared to ICE vehicles. A variety of crash factors were examined to determine the relative incidence rates of HEVs versus ICE vehicles in a range of crash scenarios. For one group of scenarios, those in which a vehicle is slowing or stopping, backing up, or entering or leaving a parking space, a statistically significant effect was found due to engine type. The HEV was two times more likely to be involved in a pedestrian crash in these situations than was an ICE vehicle. Vehicle maneuvers such as slowing or stopping, backing up, or entering or leaving a parking space, were grouped in one category based on that these maneuvers are potentially have occurred at very low speeds where the difference between the sound levels produced by the hybrid versus ICE vehicle is the greatest. In future analysis with a larger sample size, it would be ideal to investigate each of these maneuvers individually. Incidence rate of pedestrian crashes in scenarios when vehicles make a turn was significantly higher for HEVs when compared to ICE vehicles. There was no statistically significant difference in incidence rate of pedestrian crashes involving HEVs when compared to ICE vehicles when both type of vehicles were going straight.

The small sample size greatly restricted the usefulness of the survey and undermines their conclusions above. For example, there was 1 recorded incident of an HEV/pedestrian crash when entering/leaving a parking space, 3 when starting in traffic, and 7 when braking.

One big issue with the study is that the data does not support the conclusion that HEVs crash with pedestrians/bicycles more frequently than ICE. Instead, they're saying that of the recorded crashes, pedestrians/bicyclists are over-represented in HEV crashes vs ICE crashes. In other words, when HEV DO crash, they are more likely to do so with pedestrians/bicyclists than the equivalent occurence for ICE. If HEV crashed with other cars more frequently but the pedestrian crash rate was unchanged, then the NHTSA report would view this as a "better" scenario.
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hamr1

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Re: EV noise regulations being proposed
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2013, 10:29:21 PM »

THEY WANTED ICE BIKES TO MAKE MORE NOISE TO AT ONE STAGE OBVIOUSLY NOT A OPEN EXHAUST HARLEY LOL
A HORN IS MANDATORY RIGHT?
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i am new to ev but have a lot of experience with race cars and bikes dating from  1950s to current
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