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[themonsterit]

I made some reverse engineering about driving modes on my SR/F 2020 premium MBB firmware v27
you can set values from application and this is ok, but results...

attached snippet of current driving modes dumped from MBB firmware
my TEST preset sliders are all at 100%, application write 100% to the MBB (i made canbus trace to confirm), and MBB convert it to:

Mode  Name      Fwd   Fwd   Cst   Brk   TCS   ABS   Max   Color Zero  Zero 
                 Pwr   Trq   Rgn   Rgn   mode  mode  RPM         ppm/  pt   
                             Trq   Trq                           rpm   %x10 
  0    RAIN      50    550   -250  -250  2     0     5888  2     20    80   
  1    ECO       30    625   -600  -800  0     0     4416  1     20    80   
  2    STANDARD  50    875   -260  -400  0     0     6475  4     20    80   
  3    SPORT     200   1000  -280  -280  1     0     7500  3     1     50   
  4    TEST      120   1000  -600  -800  1     0     7298  5     20    80   



max rpm is limited for sure in the custom preset,so max speed can be archieved only in SPORT mode
max torque is set to 1000 properly
power... 200 vs 120.. lower power at high rpm?
ppm/rpm and pt%x10, something related how power and torque are applied, no way to change them from app.

as result you must drive this bike in SPORT mode to have the correct power and max speed, but in this way you cannot have high regen torque.


to build this table you can convert mime encoded debug messages from diagnostic port (when you modify a preset in the app)
DEBUG:   01/01/1970 00:05:14.654  ../src/Application/zero_mbb_ridemode.c          : line   336 - Encoded to RUNPAAAAAAAAAAAecQKo/eD8AABAEQEUUAAAAAAA

in a readable form using a small app i made.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Ae3_U5wZf3CphRpyB0PCHHHEzJ60kqDI/view?usp=sharing


what do you think? what preset do you use normally?

[2020_SRS_Commuter]

Im not at your level, just to let you know. I bought the thing and use it to go to work.
But I can read a chart. I made a custom mode and turned up torque and power all the way. The reason I made a custom mode was to have higher regen value than sport. If I'm understanding your results correctly, this means my power is "120" when I could have "200"? What are those units I wonder. I also see the RPM is lower, which may explain why I only ever get to about 115. I assumed its because Im a big windsock in all my gear, and it has the side and top cases. Maybe not. This may explain why I used to be able to go 127mph... it never was quite the same after some firmware update trouble i had.

At work now and will switch to SPORT for the ride home to see what happens. Thanks for sharing!

[lunarx]

Great Info!

After past FW Power/Torque loss issues, I switched to Sport to minimize the losses.
I stayed w/ Sport, after the issues got resolved in latest FW.
Lately been playing with Custom to get Less Regen (setting to 18% in app) as I prefer to slow via brakes.

[2020_SRS_Commuter]

OTW home tonight I used sport.
The high speed turnpike route I use is full of construction so there was only one place to try top speed, right at the end. With motor and battery at low temp, 50% SOC tried maximum speed starting from a base of 90mph. It was at 115 at the end of that run. Subjectively it felt exactly the same, and objectively the top speed was the same. Not science, just observations.

[lunarx]

OTW home tonight I used sport.
The high speed turnpike route I use is full of construction so there was only one place to try top speed, right at the end. With motor and battery at low temp, 50% SOC tried maximum speed starting from a base of 90mph. It was at 115 at the end of that run. Subjectively it felt exactly the same, and objectively the top speed was the same. Not science, just observations.

You might be the only guy on here pushing Top Speed.
Have you ever done a GPS App verification, to compare against the Speedometer reading?
I'll do same, next time I'm on highway (but not all the way to top speed ; )

[2020_SRS_Commuter]

Ill try that. BTW my situation is different than most people, its a wide, fast new beltway down to work where most people are going 80-90mph. On the way home its midnight, and I may pass 10 cars on the whole trip. A wide, open highway with no traffic. I prefer to go about 100 but usually keep it to 90 because if I go 100 the whole way the thermal limiter will kick in near the end of the trip and slow me to 80. Thats one thing an Srs does poorly.. sustained high speeds. Ill hunt around in google play and give it a look. With luck some zero head can explain to us what those numbers might mean in the chart.

[themonsterit]

After the previous posts i made some tests to verify max speed, since is the easiest parameter to verify without a dynometer..
i lifted rear wheel and adjusted riding modes, in this way wind and road do not affect results, and i made a video to see rpm and max speed on dash

results:
TWlua2lvbmUAALx46AOo/eD8AQCCHAUUUAAAAAAA - custom mode 124mph (speed limiter slider at max)
rpm limiter set to 7298
max rpm on dash 7794
max speed on dash 198 km/h

TWlua2lvbmUAALx46AOo/eD8AQBIHAUUUAAAAAAA - custom mode 123mph
set rpm 7240 
measured rpm 7730
max speed 196 km/h

TWlua2lvbmUAALx46AOo/eD8AQAMHAUUUAAAAAAA - custom mode 122mph
set rpm 7180
measured rpm 7681
max speed 195 km/h

U1BPUlQAAAAAAAHI6APo/uj+AQBMHQMBMgAAAAAA - sport mode
set rpm 7500
measured rpm 8034 
max speed 207km/h

so, bike add +500 to the rpm limiter set in driving modes and that's it... sport mode definitively have higher rpm.

about max power...
no idea about 200 vs 120 values.. and no idea if MBB reduce power or not..
for this test a dynometer is required.

[2020_SRS_Commuter]

Yep I think I remember in previous versions of the app I could select up to 127mph for a custom mode. And I have in the past reached the full speed, even if Im remembering wrong and it was always 124.
I bet those tests sounded awesome.
This would explain perhaps why a higher speed is possible, but I couldnt achieve it. 190 lb guy in full gear, full luggage, also carrying about 50 lbs of stuff in the trunks. Just not enough horsepower. Another thing is its been cooler lately, and it works best when thr weather is 70 or above.

[Specter]

Im not a programming guru, but do have some knowledge on VFD's and inverters, chargers, servo's etc etc.

Maybe the regen is limited in higher speeds because of what the hardware can handle?  when regenning, does the power have to route thru the 'battery charger' part of the circuitry any?  Id imagine you are getting AC off the wheels, which has to be turned back into DC to charge the battery, which is where the charger comes in.  it don't care where the AC comes from,  Wall / Bike / Etc, it just has to convert to DC and put in battery.

At higher speeds you may be exceeding some volt / hz limitations or watt limitations to what the charger can safely clamp down on.  A motor is an inductive device, and when you start playing with current flow, it makes up by kicking voltage, in inductive circuits.  Maybe limiting it to low values is how they keep you from blowing the scr's off the charging board at higher speeds ??     Just theorizing here.

Aaron

[Zelidar]

what do you think? what preset do you use normally?

At the beginning I played a bit with these modes, but I quickly switched to a custom mode where I have maxed out everything (torque, speed, regen, etc.). By controlling myself the throttle I have noticed I can get the benefits of all these built-in modes without the halse of changing modes. I use the ECO mode when I lend or have my bike serviced.

[themonsterit]

I agree with Zelidar,
i drive with all sliders to max to have a good regen (and save some brake pads).
the reason why you can't have more regen is because rear brake light do not turn on automatically...

for Specter,
torque limiters are hard-coded in the MBB, acutally i have

Point rpm     forward scale              regen scale
             (ppm/pctX10)               (ppm/pctX10)
 0    -1000       0                      0
 1        0    1000                      0
 2      500    1000                     25
 3     1000    1000                    250
 4     6500    1000                    250
 5     7500    1000                      0
 6     8500    1000                      0

so regen is disabled after 7500 rpm and limited to 25% instead of 100%
forward torque have no limitations.

[karlh]

I'm wondering what some of the column heading abbreviations mean.  Specifically, ppm/rpm and ppm%x10 in post 1, and ppm/pctX10 in the latest post.

[Zelidar]

... the reason why you can't have more regen is because rear brake light do not turn on automatically...

That's interesting! I think the LiveWire has it coupled, but didn't find any comparison with Zero about regen braking.

I tried the max regen on the DSR/X (had to use the ECO mode for that) and found out it was no greater than on the SR/F. I was also told by Hans (Hans2183) that it felt the same on the Energica (he had a SR/F before). In fact, I wouldn't mind a 10-20% stronger regenerative breaking, I love it so much. Back in 2019 when I drove through the Alps with a faulty battery, at times I was forced to use the brakes, and it felt like I was back on my old Yamaha from 1992.