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[2014ZeroSR]

Question - Is a 5 pct loss normal over 16 hours?

Charging conditions:

[1] Provided slow charger was used, 1kw at 13a.
[2] Charged to 75 pct.
[3] Completed around 2400.
[4] Dash stated - Disconnect charger
[5] Charger disconnected 16 hours later.
[6] SOC now at 70 pct.

I became interested in this loss as I previously lost 3 pct from 80 to 77 pct over 8 hours a few days earlier.

I do understand after charging there will likely be some settling, but how much is considered normal?

Normal or not, I’ve concluded, now without fail, when charging is completed, to disconnect as soon as possible.

[BigPoppa]

I’ve noticed a drop in SoC if I leave the charger plugged in once the bike has reached my preset SoC limit. I don’t recall exactly how much but 3%-5% seems about what I recall losing. Like you, I just try to be diligent about unplugging the bike when it’s done.

I’m installing a level 2 charger this week so it won’t be as much of an issue since most of my recharges should be a couple of hours which is much more manageable on a nightly basis.

[yhafting]

Question - Is a 5 pct loss normal over 16 hours?

Charging conditions:

[1] Provided slow charger was used, 1kw at 13a.
[2] Charged to 75 pct.
[3] Completed around 2400.
[4] Dash stated - Disconnect charger
[5] Charger disconnected 16 hours later.
[6] SOC now at 70 pct.

I became interested in this loss as I previously lost 3 pct from 80 to 77 pct over 8 hours a few days earlier.

I do understand after charging there will likely be some settling, but how much is considered normal?

Normal or not, I’ve concluded, now without fail, when charging is completed, to disconnect as soon as possible.

That would be 25W dissipating continuously while idling if true (12kwh*0,05/24h =25W). An over zealous fan might come near this level, especially if you combine it with the headlight being on. For the battery alone i would find it unlikely that 25W would dissipate continuously.

Things that may affect the readout is if the battery temperature dropped in the same time interval, or if the battery was much out of balance when charging stopped, and the bike did try to manage that. I would guess someone who rarely charge full will see more effects due to cell imbalance more often than someone who goes to "100%" every day. However i do not know how this works with Energica. 

[BigPoppa]

By default, the headlight ring "spins" and the logo on the "tank" pulses while charging and then go steady on when finished. With the temps in my area being high, even in my garage at night, the fan definitely runs most of the time while charging although I'm pretty sure it stops when charging stops.

My guess is the headlight ring, "tank" logo, and dash remaining on (dash displays a message to unplug the bike) after the charge completes is the culprit since they don't turn off until you remove the plug. I've found the "tank" log gets really hot when charging off 110V since it's spending 6-8 hours doing it's thing. I just haven't bothered to disable it, especially since I'm getting my level 2 charger this week.

[DonTom]

By default, the headlight ring "spins" and the logo on the "tank" pulses while charging and then go steady on when finished. With the temps in my area being high, even in my garage at night, the fan definitely runs most of the time while charging although I'm pretty sure it stops when charging stops.

My guess is the headlight ring, "tank" logo, and dash remaining on (dash displays a message to unplug the bike) after the charge completes is the culprit since they don't turn off until you remove the plug. I've found the "tank" log gets really hot when charging off 110V since it's spending 6-8 hours doing it's thing. I just haven't bothered to disable it, especially since I'm getting my level 2 charger this week.

It will go off at  the end of  DC charging because that is when the voltage stops from the charger. This is handy from a distance to see when the charging is done.

But with Level 1 or 2 charging, the AC never goes off until you unplug. Therefore, the lights stay on as you're still applying the AC voltage into the bike's own  charger, unlike when using DC fast charging where the machine shuts off the supply for you, even if still plugged in.

-Don-  Reno, NV

[2014ZeroSR]

yhafting - Your post got me to thinking about a few other things to try out during the next seven (7) days.

What I can confirm when charging is complete with the provided L1 charger on my 17 EVA is:
[1] there are no sounds -and
[2] except the dash display, nothing else appears to be on.

[RFlashman]

By default, the headlight ring "spins" and the logo on the "tank" pulses while charging and then go steady on when finished. With the temps in my area being high, even in my garage at night, the fan definitely runs most of the time while charging although I'm pretty sure it stops when charging stops.

My guess is the headlight ring, "tank" logo, and dash remaining on (dash displays a message to unplug the bike) after the charge completes is the culprit since they don't turn off until you remove the plug. I've found the "tank" log gets really hot when charging off 110V since it's spending 6-8 hours doing it's thing. I just haven't bothered to disable it, especially since I'm getting my level 2 charger this week.

The headlight spinning effect of the EsseEsse9 is a 2020 (USA) model feature (where the headlight in connected to the CANBUS network). Not available in older models.

[2014ZeroSR]

yhafting - Here’s more info.
My conclusion is - The mystery exists, I have adjusted to the bikes behavior, there’s nothing else to do except enjoy the ride.

Last night, I attached the L1 charger to a timer.
I thought, maybe if the power gets completely disconnected, the SOC loss would cease.
I know for every SOC 1% increase (1kw @ 14a) , it takes 5.5 minutes (approx).
40% was needed to attain 70%, I set the timer for 4.25 hours.

Results this morning:
[1] L1 charger was completely off, i.e. no lights.
[2] No audible sounds, complete silence - e.g no fan running, no humming.
[3] Dash lights full on advising to disconnect the charger plug.
[4] SOC decrease = 2%, showed 68%.

Why there's a SOC loss occurring is still unknown, I now know the J-plug must be removed to prevent a discharge.

L2 and L3 charging - Likely a similar discharge will occur over time if the respective plug is not removed upon completion.

[BigPoppa]

The headlight spinning effect of the EsseEsse9 is a 2020 (USA) model feature (where the headlight in connected to the CANBUS network). Not available in older models.

Thanks for the clarification...I sometimes forget about the differences between models.

[yhafting]

yhafting - Here’s more info.
My conclusion is - The mystery exists, I have adjusted to the bikes behavior, there’s nothing else to do except enjoy the ride.

Last night, I attached the L1 charger to a timer.
I thought, maybe if the power gets completely disconnected, the SOC loss would cease.
I know for every SOC 1% increase (1kw @ 14a) , it takes 5.5 minutes (approx).
40% was needed to attain 70%, I set the timer for 4.25 hours.

Results this morning:
[1] L1 charger was completely off, i.e. no lights.
[2] No audible sounds, complete silence - e.g no fan running, no humming.
[3] Dash lights full on advising to disconnect the charger plug.
[4] SOC decrease = 2%, showed 68%.

Why there's a SOC loss occurring is still unknown, I now know the J-plug must be removed to prevent a discharge.

L2 and L3 charging - Likely a similar discharge will occur over time if the respective plug is not removed upon completion.

Hmm this is interesting. To make for a good physics experiment (to discern how the bike actually works), it would nice to see whether the SOC actually gets to the number calculated, and then see how it changes every hour. And possibly also using different charging levels. But that is much to ask for. As  you describe this attempt, some of it may dissipate while charging (thus bike never hitting the SOC target). .