Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[pacificcricket]

Why should it make any difference to the battery if it is plugged in at 100% or not? The contactor will then be open anyway, and charging is stopped, plugged in or not, right?

After sitting for a while, self-discharge drops the SOC below certain point where BMS re-activates the charger to top off what was lost.

[NEW2elec]

I 100% agree.  The app is the only way I can think of to even access it, as is, and even then I doubt they built in a way to talk to the BMS from the app.

But for now they want it unplugged for all the sub 2020 models.


+1 on your second statement to DonTom as well.

[NetPro]

"After each use, you should plug you motorcycle into an AC power source to recharge. Once it is charged, you should disconnect it from the AC power source. Leaving your motorcycle unplugged will maximize long-term power pack health."

So, they are recommending to recharge after each use
But, let's say you go out for a short ride (mostly my riding style) and there is plenty of juice left to do it again several times.
Does recharging after a ride where you used, say 10% of the full charge, counts the same as when charging from a deep discharge, as far as the "total number of recharges" that battery pack can withstand before going kaput?

They say the total number of recharge cycles for a given battery is predetermined so, are we shortening the battery's life by recharging when the SoC went down just a little bit and there is plenty of juice for the next trip or two?

[NEW2elec]

Well I'll tell you the way it was told to me four years ago when I asked. 
A "charge cycle" is from 0% to 100% or a combo of 10 times of 90% to 100%.  Zero estimates about 2500 charge cycles until you have 80% original capacity of the battery.  In theory over 250,000 miles.
 Of course your results may vary and you have a five year battery warrant if things should not go that well.

The other issue of charging a Zero is balancing the cells.  Again on the sub 2020 bikes this is done by the BMS at 100% SOC when charging.  I'm not sure if the SRF can do it at lower SOC or not.
  The range of cell unbalance is on your app listed in mVs  a sub 15mVs is what you want and if your drifting out of that range you should charge it all the way up and let it balance the cells.

You may have some issues along the way but I have two of them and will never have a gas bike at this point.  Enjoy it. 

[Auriga]

Lithium ion batteries degrade sitting at the top end or low end of the battery. This is usually considered to be ~80-100% and 0-20%. I'd recommend only charging to 80% and recharging once you get to 30% or so. The SR/F and carryover platforms can balance without the charge cord being attached, if left idle for long enough. I'd still charge it to 100% every couple weeks or so to help it along. If you need the range, there's nothing wrong with going to 100%.

I've got data from a population of li/ion powered autonomous robots, and the ones that were lightly used at 100% suffered far worse degradation than those used regularly in the usable range. 

Another reason Zero probably doesn't want you to leave it plugged in for long periods has to do with the chargers. If they fail, and you leave it plugged in for long enough, it can kill the battery. Firmware issues that prevent the bike from fully sleeping could also drain the battery faster than one might expect.

[NetPro]

Well I'll tell you the way it was told to me four years ago when I asked. 
A "charge cycle" is from 0% to 100% or a combo of 10 times of 90% to 100%.  Zero estimates about 2500 charge cycles until you have 80% original capacity of the battery.  In theory over 250,000 miles.
 Of course your results may vary and you have a five year battery warrant if things should not go that well.

The other issue of charging a Zero is balancing the cells.  Again on the sub 2020 bikes this is done by the BMS at 100% SOC when charging.  I'm not sure if the SRF can do it at lower SOC or not.
  The range of cell unbalance is on your app listed in mVs  a sub 15mVs is what you want and if your drifting out of that range you should charge it all the way up and let it balance the cells.

You may have some issues along the way but I have two of them and will never have a gas bike at this point.  Enjoy it. 

This is great news: I am glad to see that the system is computing the level of discharge every time the bike is plugged in and it "knows" when it is just a top off or a full charge as it relates to the number of cycles.
 
Thanks Bro!

[NetPro]

Lithium ion batteries degrade sitting at the top end or low end of the battery. This is usually considered to be ~80-100% and 0-20%. I'd recommend only charging to 80% and recharging once you get to 30% or so. The SR/F and carryover platforms can balance without the charge cord being attached, if left idle for long enough. I'd still charge it to 100% every couple weeks or so to help it along. If you need the range, there's nothing wrong with going to 100%.

I've got data from a population of li/ion powered autonomous robots, and the ones that were lightly used at 100% suffered far worse degradation than those used regularly in the usable range. 

Another reason Zero probably doesn't want you to leave it plugged in for long periods has to do with the chargers. If they fail, and you leave it plugged in for long enough, it can kill the battery. Firmware issues that prevent the bike from fully sleeping could also drain the battery faster than one might expect.

Yeah, them lithium batteries are finicky but at least we don't have to worry about memory effect as in years past.
These recommendations are not that hard to follow and I'll stick to them going forward.

Thanks!