ElectricMotorcycleForum.com

  • November 24, 2024, 03:06:57 PM
  • Welcome, Guest
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Electric Motorcycle Forum is live!

Pages: 1 [2]

Author Topic: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion  (Read 2024 times)

BrianTRice@gmail.com

  • Unofficial Zero Manual Editor
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4014
  • Nerdy Adventurer
    • View Profile
    • Personal site
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2016, 12:16:31 AM »

I'm flying in to San Jose so I should be able to make it by 8 or 8:30 although I don't know what traffic will be like.

I work in Mountain View so it'll only take me a half hour to get there (lanesplitting that way makes a big difference). I'll try to show up early (7?) so others can show up and start chatting.
Logged
Current: 2020 DSR, 2012 Suzuki V-Strom
Former: 2016 DSR, 2013 DS

ZeroMark

  • 2014 Zero DS 11.4 Cruising in the Vegas Heat!
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 24
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #16 on: September 09, 2016, 01:08:35 PM »

I'n coming out from Las Vegas with my 2014 DS in the back of a pickup (to get it there), but it's a nice 8 hour drive from Las Vegas.  Any of you guys that are meeting for Pizza or staying overnight somewhere have any thoughts where us guys arriving at 4 a.m. in the morning can meet up?  I'm leaving approx 7 to 8 pm from Las Vegas putting me there around 4 am or so.  Long drive, but it will be a drive with some good company, and I can't wait to meet all of you other "good company" out there all day long. -Mark Hripko
Logged
Zero is my Hero...

EL S ONE

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 9
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #17 on: September 10, 2016, 04:14:41 AM »

The SR is repaired. See you there!
Logged
2015 SR

BrianTRice@gmail.com

  • Unofficial Zero Manual Editor
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4014
  • Nerdy Adventurer
    • View Profile
    • Personal site
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #18 on: September 10, 2016, 08:48:50 AM »

I'm flying in to San Jose so I should be able to make it by 8 or 8:30 although I don't know what traffic will be like.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

I have a table, and PM'd my phone number.

My Twitter profile has a picture just in case: http://twitter.com/BrianTRice
Logged
Current: 2020 DSR, 2012 Suzuki V-Strom
Former: 2016 DSR, 2013 DS

mrwilsn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 693
  • 2014 Zero S / 2017 Zero SR
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #19 on: September 10, 2016, 08:52:55 AM »

I just checked into my room and headed to the pizza place now... Google says 18 minutes... should definitely be there by 8:30 at the latest.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Logged
2014 Zero S

Shadow

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1085
  • 130,000mi electric since 2016
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2016, 11:28:39 PM »

I'm back.

The highlight for me was probably getting to meet some of the Farasis battery technology company folks - they're true scientist level. Between the factory tour and getting to meet some people behind the battery technology, I do get a reassuring sense that dumping $17k+ USD into a Zero motorcycle is voting with my dollars for something (sustainable transportation) that I care about. There is much excitement from riders over the Diginow Supercharger but no information direct from Brandon or Mike of Diginow as they weren't present;  if you want L2 charging, I can say that the factory looks to me like they are getting a lot better at doing Zero Charge Tank installs. It's not exactly ideal if you want to ride more than the time you spend charging, but worth considering if you want something serious and are going to buy a Zero soon. Hollywood Electrics was well represented and had some great first-look demo of this carbon fiber stuff and painting processes that I don't really know anything about but it got a lot of "That! I want that. When can I buy that?" type of interest.

Terry presented recounting stories and personalities in his history just before and since including the rise of Zero Motorcycles. As might be expected he did not disappoint. I hope there will be a video posted; the slideshow was not in-frame on the recording camera so I hope that gets matched up to slides later.

I met someone from Farasis who was absolutely brilliant, whom I will be intentionally vague about their name, and was glad to follow them around for my 2nd time on the Zero factory tour. Somewhere on that time around they gave a properly captivating lecture on how battery tech actually works. It was like some weird Carl Sagan moment, or family friend from my youth molecular biologist Jim Kramer telling how it is with the function of DNA... Usually I only concern myself with lunchtime (who? what? where? when?) but it was a real treat to break out of that for a few minutes and engage the deeper learning. It did however lead to missing out on the forum with John Flores' spot about retracing the first historical motorcycle cross-country trip. I'd caught only the first 10 words or so of John's presentation opening and would have liked to have also been present for the whole forum.

In forum the Zero CTO Abe was asked about vectrix throttle type and a few minor other things we've all wondered about at some point. The reply mentioned that new regulatory compliance for US market ate up a more significant slice of product development resources for MY2016 than anyone at Zero would have liked but it is just a necessary part of streamlining the build to get to a point where one bike built can be standard for worldwide sales. There's no denying that future model years are in the works and might have something more interesting because the dumb boring regulatory stuff is figured out, but no confirmation either. We're still early adopters (my opinion here purely) of a motorcycle that is already pretty amazing right now.

I had a few personal objectives going out there:

1. Just show up. It's a historic event; no electric motorcycle company I've ever heard of has made it to 10 years remaining viable and growing, before now. It's just rare for a new independent motorcycle or vehicle manufacturer anyways to remain viable.

2. Meet Brandon / Diginow and find out if it was just my particular dealer I bought a Diginow Supercharger with who was having trouble with supply. I have $4k USD in for a deluxe package. Brandon was not present, but I think the sense of things is that we're all fanatically excited about the Father's Day orders and the demand was overwhelmingly more than expected. So much as I could figure out, nobody has taken delivery of their Father's Day Diginow Supercharger order yet from any authorized dealer.

I got to see Terry run several kW charge on his Supercharger and it is kind of shocking (uh.... that pun, let's roll with it) after a short conversation over the loud fan noise he unplugs and rolls the bike into one of the "all done charging" parking spots - that done in minutes what takes most of us several hours on stock charging!

I specifically did not hear anything to suggest that any Diginow secretary was owed pay nor any buying of islands or blowing everything on dope and escorts (ahem Skully AR-1). Let's not be too quick to presume being suckered for several $k like some shitty Kickstarter, okay? well... unless you pre-ordered an AR-1 then yeah you totally lost out...

3. Food and Fasteners

The food was awesome. I had two platefuls. Thanks, everybody at Zero!

The factory uses some kind of awesome CNC torque tools and the numerical outcome of every step in the assembly process is recorded in a history of that build. Super awesome.

I totally forgot to ask how torque specs are derived and if they are originated in Nm vs lb-ft. That unanswered I'm going to keep rolling with lb-ft.

4. Meet Brian T Rice and Terry, some other people here who have forum names that are less obvious for me to figure out in person

Hi.  You guys are all nuts.  Glad for it!  Hope to have the opportunity to hang out again soon.
Logged

mrwilsn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 693
  • 2014 Zero S / 2017 Zero SR
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2016, 03:30:27 AM »

I'm back.

The highlight for me was probably getting to meet some of the Farasis battery technology company folks - they're true scientist level. Between the factory tour and getting to meet some people behind the battery technology, I do get a reassuring sense that dumping $17k+ USD into a Zero motorcycle is voting with my dollars for something (sustainable transportation) that I care about. There is much excitement from riders over the Diginow Supercharger but no information direct from Brandon or Mike of Diginow as they weren't present;  if you want L2 charging, I can say that the factory looks to me like they are getting a lot better at doing Zero Charge Tank installs. It's not exactly ideal if you want to ride more than the time you spend charging, but worth considering if you want something serious and are going to buy a Zero soon. Hollywood Electrics was well represented and had some great first-look demo of this carbon fiber stuff and painting processes that I don't really know anything about but it got a lot of "That! I want that. When can I buy that?" type of interest.

Terry presented recounting stories and personalities in his history just before and since including the rise of Zero Motorcycles. As might be expected he did not disappoint. I hope there will be a video posted; the slideshow was not in-frame on the recording camera so I hope that gets matched up to slides later.

I met someone from Farasis who was absolutely brilliant, whom I will be intentionally vague about their name, and was glad to follow them around for my 2nd time on the Zero factory tour. Somewhere on that time around they gave a properly captivating lecture on how battery tech actually works. It was like some weird Carl Sagan moment, or family friend from my youth molecular biologist Jim Kramer telling how it is with the function of DNA... Usually I only concern myself with lunchtime (who? what? where? when?) but it was a real treat to break out of that for a few minutes and engage the deeper learning. It did however lead to missing out on the forum with John Flores' spot about retracing the first historical motorcycle cross-country trip. I'd caught only the first 10 words or so of John's presentation opening and would have liked to have also been present for the whole forum.

In forum the Zero CTO Abe was asked about vectrix throttle type and a few minor other things we've all wondered about at some point. The reply mentioned that new regulatory compliance for US market ate up a more significant slice of product development resources for MY2016 than anyone at Zero would have liked but it is just a necessary part of streamlining the build to get to a point where one bike built can be standard for worldwide sales. There's no denying that future model years are in the works and might have something more interesting because the dumb boring regulatory stuff is figured out, but no confirmation either. We're still early adopters (my opinion here purely) of a motorcycle that is already pretty amazing right now.

I had a few personal objectives going out there:

1. Just show up. It's a historic event; no electric motorcycle company I've ever heard of has made it to 10 years remaining viable and growing, before now. It's just rare for a new independent motorcycle or vehicle manufacturer anyways to remain viable.

2. Meet Brandon / Diginow and find out if it was just my particular dealer I bought a Diginow Supercharger with who was having trouble with supply. I have $4k USD in for a deluxe package. Brandon was not present, but I think the sense of things is that we're all fanatically excited about the Father's Day orders and the demand was overwhelmingly more than expected. So much as I could figure out, nobody has taken delivery of their Father's Day Diginow Supercharger order yet from any authorized dealer.

I got to see Terry run several kW charge on his Supercharger and it is kind of shocking (uh.... that pun, let's roll with it) after a short conversation over the loud fan noise he unplugs and rolls the bike into one of the "all done charging" parking spots - that done in minutes what takes most of us several hours on stock charging!

I specifically did not hear anything to suggest that any Diginow secretary was owed pay nor any buying of islands or blowing everything on dope and escorts (ahem Skully AR-1). Let's not be too quick to presume being suckered for several $k like some shitty Kickstarter, okay? well... unless you pre-ordered an AR-1 then yeah you totally lost out...

3. Food and Fasteners

The food was awesome. I had two platefuls. Thanks, everybody at Zero!

The factory uses some kind of awesome CNC torque tools and the numerical outcome of every step in the assembly process is recorded in a history of that build. Super awesome.

I totally forgot to ask how torque specs are derived and if they are originated in Nm vs lb-ft. That unanswered I'm going to keep rolling with lb-ft.

4. Meet Brian T Rice and Terry, some other people here who have forum names that are less obvious for me to figure out in person

Hi.  You guys are all nuts.  Glad for it!  Hope to have the opportunity to hang out again soon.
Glad you made it back home OK.  Hope your finger turns out OK.  I definitely hope we can hang out again some time.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Logged
2014 Zero S

Richard230

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9670
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2016, 04:40:29 AM »

Here is the summary of the information that I gleaned from my factory tour:

I learned that I was not going to learn when  the 2017 models would be announced.   :(

I learned that you could not take photos inside the factory.   ;)

I learned that there were 2017 models being assembly-tested somewhere in view in the factory, but I sure didn't notice anything that looked different than the 2016 models.   ???

I learned that the factory area was a lot larger and the testing equipment was a lot more sophisticated than what existed during my last tour in December 2012 - plus a new building has been added to the factory.

I learned that the standard factory Zero vehicle output is between 15 and 17 units a day, with 17 being the goal.

I learned that factory will be installing all of the wiring for the Power Tank units, so that that intricate work will not have to be performed by your dealer.  And I believe that I heard that the entire Charge Tank units would be installed at the factory. In both cases, you would be pre-ordering  the PT and CT models from your dealer and they would be built to order within a week and shipped to your dealer, upon quality testing. They would arrive in about a week, depending upon the distance from the factory to your dealer.

I learned that the factory uses a whole lot of Delta Q chargers to charge up the batteries for testing and for installation into the production bikes.  Also the batteries in the new bikes are sent out fully charged and will likely not be needed to be topped off by the retail dealer.  Also, the batteries will stay fully charged for a long period of time, without the on-board charger being needed to be plugged in.

I learned that a lot of attention is paid to waterproofing the battery cases and their individual BMS boards.  Each battery case is carefully sealed, the boards coated in waterproofing compound and every battery spends at least 10 minutes in a water shower tank to be sure that they are completely waterproof.

I learned that the swing arm must be removed to replace the drive belt, but that it is relatively easy to do, requiring only the disconnection of the rear shock from the swing arm and the removal of the swing arm from the frame.

I learned that the aluminum frame and swing arm assemblies are hand welded by a Chinese company who builds the components to Zero's specifications.  The frame only weighs 22 pounds.

I learned that there are 6 specific ABS programs in use, one for each of the Zero models, which were developed through collaboration by both Zero and Bosch. They are specifically designed for the bikes' weight, tire type, usage, etc.  If you modify your Zero, such as by changing the wheels or tires (as an example) the ABS may not function as intended.  Also two Zero factory engineers spent about 1.5 months in Germany getting the ABS programming just right for each model.

I learned that Zero continues to manufacture the mil-spec bikes (MMX?) and there was one that was being built for a foreign military service on a stand.  Interestingly it contained a switch that allows the battery packs to be fully drained by using the final 10% available in the battery pack in an emergency.  While this might kill the batteries, it is better than having the rider suffer a similar fate.   :o

Finally I learned that the factory has only 135 employees, world-wide.  Which to my mind is a pretty efficient operation.
Logged
Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

BrianTRice@gmail.com

  • Unofficial Zero Manual Editor
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4014
  • Nerdy Adventurer
    • View Profile
    • Personal site
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2016, 04:58:15 AM »

It was great to meet so many faces to put to forum handles: Shadow, mrwilson, Geoff, and SoundMusic at least. (And I've met plenty of others before.) It was also nice to meet Loz who makes such energetic electric motorcycle reviews for GizMagNewAtlas:

I missed some sections of the talks, so I hope they'll be online at some point (even if privately). The Facebook video covered an early segment, but there's plenty more.

I did kind of not so sneakily eyeball some stuff at the factory and got an idea of what 2017 is bringing, and what I've inferred certainly makes a lot of sense for Zero. Abe also provided some insights in his talk, which certainly highlighted their practical challenges. I won't speak to them unless/until they post something.

I had already chatted up the Farasis engineers (Farasis factory really is close where I live, making the 2013 battery recall delay kind of amusing), and definitely like their approach to things and willingness to tinker with Zeros, too.

I guess I mostly was glad that others appreciate my modifications and technical writing efforts. Everyone notices the front wheel cover but I want to talk about the windscreen! I do think there's still a gap between people who are comfortable figuring out fairing mounts and those who haven't done it before. I'm now on the verge of just throwing an Airtech fairing on for a while just to get some more saddle time and comfort.

I was also taken aback to realize how many engineers and designers read the forums, and seem to know threads I referred to readily! I didn't get any flack for the wiki, which sounds like it's kind of tacitly okay the way it's going where we just point out things we observe and put together practices. But they do have to keep from commenting about a lot of things, so we're not going to get a direct feedback loop. It does seem like the hiring that happened after the 2013-2014 sales started to solidify is starting to pay off, and that Zero will start showing some larger scale savvy pretty soon.

I got to see Harlan's new carbon fiber accessories in person, and got a hinged carbon fiber tank lid to try to use. It will require a little DIY work right now but looks really nice. The replacement front sport fender and tail cover look like plug-and-play, so to speak, though.

I think DigiNow was the absent star of the show, though, with Terry and my chargers both performing fine and getting good attention (and Luke's, but his SR doing insane wheelies kind of eclipses charger discussion), and other customers having shown up with questions and enthusiasm.
Logged
Current: 2020 DSR, 2012 Suzuki V-Strom
Former: 2016 DSR, 2013 DS

mrwilsn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 693
  • 2014 Zero S / 2017 Zero SR
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2016, 07:34:54 AM »



I learned that there were 2017 models being assembly-tested somewhere in view in the factory, but I sure didn't notice anything that looked different than the 2016 models.   ???

You didn't look close enough...

Every bike on the assembly line had a blue tag hanging from it.  The blue tags all had a 17 on them.  There was other information that could be gleaned from the blue tags and from a closer look at the bikes themselves.  I won't say what exactly I saw because I don't want to spoil the surprise for the big reveal which will happen before the end of the year... even though Zero had to realize what they were doing when they left the bikes in plain view and then gave us tours of the factory.

The bikes haven't really changed visually since 2013 so it's not that surprising they look the same without close scrutiny.


Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Logged
2014 Zero S

mrwilsn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 693
  • 2014 Zero S / 2017 Zero SR
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #25 on: September 12, 2016, 07:41:36 AM »



It was great to meet so many faces to put to forum handles: Shadow, mrwilson, Geoff, and SoundMusic at least. (And I've met plenty of others before.)

It was great to talk and check out your bike.  I definitely still owe you a beer!


Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

Logged
2014 Zero S

togo

  • It's like flying. But with more traction.
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1638
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #26 on: September 12, 2016, 10:22:00 AM »



I learned that there were 2017 models being assembly-tested somewhere in view in the factory, but I sure didn't notice anything that looked different than the 2016 models.   ???

You didn't look close enough...

Every bike on the assembly line had a blue tag hanging from it.  The blue tags all had a 17 on them.  There was other information that could be gleaned from the blue tags and from a closer look at the bikes themselves.  I won't say what exactly I saw because I don't want to spoil the surprise for the big reveal which will happen before the end of the year... even though Zero had to realize what they were doing when they left the bikes in plain view and then gave us tours of the factory.

The bikes haven't really changed visually since 2013 so it's not that surprising they look the same without close scrutiny.


Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

The plastics have changed a little, but yes refinement of a look, not a lot of change. ABS now standard on all models. Quite a hydraulics testing machine.

Logged
our knowledge about Zeros collects here: https://zeromanual.com/

Richard230

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9670
    • View Profile
Re: Zero 10th Anniversary Reunion
« Reply #27 on: September 12, 2016, 08:26:46 PM »

Well, it is true that I wasn't wearing my reading glasses and that is likely why I didn't see the 2017 tags. Still, it doesn't look like there will be any aero fairings on the 2017 models.   ;)

One other thing I learned during the tour is that the new bikes are shipped full assembled in heavy cardboard boxes.
Logged
Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.
Pages: 1 [2]