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Author Topic: H2 gas bags have arrived  (Read 554 times)

Richard230

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H2 gas bags have arrived
« on: July 30, 2016, 04:01:16 AM »

Last night on the local SF TV news was a discussion about the first Hydrogen-powered car.  There is only one and it is running around San Francisco right now.  I think it is a Toyota and it looks pretty futuristic, all white with odd slitted headlights. Range is claimed to be as much as 300 miles powered by two compressed H2 cylinders in the trunk (which was not shown, because if it was the viewer would have likely observed that there was no usable space in the trunk). The manufacturer's rep was lamenting about the lack of H2 fueling stations in the U.S. He mentioned that there are 22 in California and none in any other state.

What I found interesting is that the reporter (who got to drive the car around the block) mentioned that the hydrogen is manufactured at the refueling stations using natural gas (that has got to use a decent amount of electricity), then the gas is compressed (more electricity) and stuffed into the car's two fuel tanks during a 5-minute refueling stop.  Finally the gas is sent to the fuel cell, that converts it back into electricity to drive the electric motor. The only waste product exiting the "tail pipe" is (distilled?) water. All that doesn't sound very efficient to me. So I am not really seeing the advantage to the concept, especially as the government, or a government utility, are apparently the only ones building the hydrogen stations. I kind of doubt that any private company is going to take up building H2 stations and selling the gas as a way to make money.

Right now there is a hydrogen refueling station being built at the intersection of State Highways 35, Skyline Boulevard, and 84, Woodside Road, across from Alice's Restaurant, in the Santa Cruz Mountains. (Interesting this is the location of a gasoline station that has been closed for many years, although the pumps are still there and are being run by the adjacent local market.) Not the most easily accessible location for someone with one of these new cars.

At the moment, after about a month of construction, the station consists of a large hole in the ground, surrounded by a fabric-screened chain link fence. My recollection of the billboard celebrating the arrival of the hydrogen refueling station is that it is being built by Pacific, Gas and Electric, our northern California electrical and gas utility.  I guess that makes sense as they can supply both the natural gas and the electricity to manufacture the hydrogen.  All they will need to do after the station is built is to find someone with and H2 powered vehicle to buy the gas.  Doesn't sound like a winning plan to me.  ::) As long as they are making such a huge investment in infrastructure perhaps they could install a few electrical EV stations, while they are at it.  They might actually get some customers by doing that.  ;)
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2020 KTM 390 Duke, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

Killroy

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Re: H2 gas bags have arrived
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2016, 11:35:25 AM »

There is a Toyota Mirai near me and a H2 station.  I saw it parked and IMHO Toyota needs to get better styling.

I have been meaning to check out the H2 station near buy.

Really they should make more plug in HFCV because it is a lot easier to plug in at home than go to the H2 station.

Autoblog has been posting about a lot of problems with the first crops of H2 stations and some have been down for a month.  I think 300 miles on a H2 charge is a stretch, it really depends on the station.  Also, some people have had 10 min fill up times.  I think the physics of temperature and pressure come into play.

A friend had  CNG car and he said that sometimes he would go to a CNG station and the best that the station could do was ~100 miles of range.

Might as well have a EV.
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KrazyEd

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Re: H2 gas bags have arrived
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2016, 01:43:47 PM »

In MHO, manufacturers are pushing hydrogen for the sole purpose of extracting all of the grant money that they can.
Companies have been producing FCVs ( Fuel Cell Vehicles ) for at least a decade. Honda Clarity, Ford Focus FCV, I believe
ford also has / had a Fusion FCV. Hyundai has one.  Unless you are powering your vehicle using PATRÓN, pretty much anything
that you use will be cheaper, easier, and better for the environment than hydrogen. If anyone is interested, I can provide a link
to a PATRÓN powered motorcycle.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_vehicle#Automobiles

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/ford/ford-focus-fcv-2007-review/

http://www.hydrogen-motors.com/

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