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[princec]

Note that our Zeros use NMC chemistry.

Cas

[Specter]

Lithium Iron Phosphate    LFP.  the F is silent.       or  Lithium Ferro Phosphate,  ferro- iron

I believe the energica is Cobalt -  so this one would apply


Aaron

[MVetter]

uhhhhhhh batteries

[Specter]

Now, if this commercial  was made in 2024  instead of 1974  he'd be wanting the batteries and cotton balls to make his meth,  and about the same intellect too 

Aaron

[MVetter]

Lighthearted commentary of a classic funny commercial takes a dark turn

[Specter]

So, this makes me wonder,  maybe I should be running my race bike between 65 and 85 ish percent instead of taking it up to 95 every recharge?


granted the few volts extra at top give it a little extra zing but if I am not in a competition, is it worth it to cook off the battery.  I may keep the levels down now on the racer and keep the street bike well shit, i can easily do like 40 to 70 no problem.  the monthly 100 percent is ONLY for you to have a warm fuzzy that your range is correct, or maybe I should say, battery charge percent left is correct, but really does nothing positive for the battery, so unless you are running a long trip, maybe only every 2 or 3 months since that amount of accuracy is not needed.in all reality you could pull up your engineering screen and watch the voltage and see when it hits the beginning of the plateau and know where your battery is at, regardless of the calculated percentage and  only need a top off every 6 months.

very interesting but except for running in the extremes, is the degradation THAT severe for a normal person running in the middle, not hitting it hard, etc etc?  This report seems to suggest it is, making me wonder what damage i done already to my batts.

Aaron

[princec]

Degradation is ... slow. So slow you probably don't notice it for years.

FWIW, I charge my SR/F 15.5 to 100% (ok 98% well done Zero, still can't get that right eh) every time I use it. It sits there at 100% for about 5 hours in the morning before I get on it, then I do a 56 mile round trip on it at moderate-to-quick road speeds, returning with 57% SOC (every. single. time. Amazes me how consistent it is). I've now done about 4k miles I think, absolutely no change I can determine day-to-day.

I think the 15.5 warranty upgrade on the SR/F has a huge headroom ... suspect that I'm actually only really charging it to 85% of its capacity in reality.

Cas

[Richard230]

Degradation is ... slow. So slow you probably don't notice it for years.

FWIW, I charge my SR/F 15.5 to 100% (ok 98% well done Zero, still can't get that right eh) every time I use it. It sits there at 100% for about 5 hours in the morning before I get on it, then I do a 56 mile round trip on it at moderate-to-quick road speeds, returning with 57% SOC (every. single. time. Amazes me how consistent it is). I've now done about 4k miles I think, absolutely no change I can determine day-to-day.

I think the 15.5 warranty upgrade on the SR/F has a huge headroom ... suspect that I'm actually only really charging it to 85% of its capacity in reality.

Cas

I tend to do the same thing, charging to 100% a day or two before going for a ride. Most of the time my 2018 model year Zero S with Power Tank battery pack is stored around 80% between rides. So far I am seeing no change in performance or range during the past 7 years.  My daughters 2014 Zero was left plugged in at 100% for the first 4 years, as recommended by Zero at the time.  Now she does pretty much what I do and her bike also hasn't shown any obvious change in the battery pack and goes as far as it did (per the SOC calculation) when new over her usual 40-mile ride to my home, where I plug in her bike before her ride back home.  I might add that my Zero rarely sees temperatures higher than 70 degrees or lower than 50 degrees and is stored in my garage when the temperature is almost always in the mid-60's (F).

One other comment: I have owned three Zeros since 2012 and I always read the owner's manual from one end to the other before riding the bikes. I can't recall ever seeing a recommendation regarding not charging to 100% and to keep the battery between 20% and 60% SOC most of the time. I am sure that the battery technology and recommendations explained in the videos above are accurate, but does following those recommendations really make a practical difference to an electric motorcycle owner? Especially, when many of us will buy a new bike when the next big advancement arrives? (Says someone who has bought 3 electric and 24 ICE motorcycles over the past 65 years.)

[Fran K]

Is a lithium ion a helium atom with an extra proton?

Maybe the battery doesn't change in volume as it charges and discharges but one side of the pouch or roll in the cylinder gets larger and the other gets smaller.

If charging it to 100% is good for range computation would riding say a few miles and going to 100% again be better still.  Seemed kind of not deal with balancing more just cell stuff.

[Specter]

Helium is a noble element, I don't think you will find many allotropes of it. Not to mention the reaction to transmute He to Li would be very difficult, and highly unlikely to happen.

Aaron

[Fran K]

I guess that was kind of not a good question.  3 protons and 4 neutrons 92.4% and the rest 3 neutorn.  I suppose I was more thinking of the orbitals.

The electron configuration of helium is 1s2, which means its atom has only two electrons that enter the 1s orbital. Helium is a noble gas with a full outer shell. It is one of the two elements (along with hydrogen) that have electrons exclusively in the 1s orbital in their neutral state.

[Curt]

Most of what was discussed in the video is well known to us already.
- Leaving it around 60%
- Charging to 100% periodically (no mention of rebalancing)
- Not going to 0%
I was hoping to learn something new, and wish he had covered
- The Significance of the Passage of Time (TM), as a factor whether or not it's driven a lot
- The rate of depletion; e.g., driving a Zero FX on the freeway
- The curves of max range over time
- Any data on min, avg, max lifetimes that retiring vehicles have actually seen in practice.