ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: flattetyre on March 28, 2019, 07:12:49 AM
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Got the kit online, no install instructions but straightforward. Finally recv'd today. Very sexy rear sprocket. Magnuson-Moss means I can install myself. Fuck you incompetent dealer. Anyway, very excited because not only does the chain kit add durability, it adds torque:
Chain gearing: 12t front, 65t rear
This results in a 5.4:1 reduction ratio. Stock belt is 20/90 or 4.5:1. The 2018+ FX/FXS have a 18/90 gearing for 5:1 reduction.
So the chain kit is 20% more torque than stock, and 8% more torque than 2018+ (same controller, motor, phase current limits). This should make the bike easier to power wheelie while retaining a reasonable on-road speed. The "must have" reason for the chain is to ride offroad and land jumps on power. Anyone else ditch the belt for metal lately?
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Installing it is pretty straitforward. Just don't manhandle it too much, otherwise it could damage the motor and Zero won't cover it lol. You will have to go to the dealer to get the MBB set correctly, unless you don't care about accurate speedometer readings
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I'm curious how loud you think it is.
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I'm curious how loud you think it is.
I'm curious about the noise too, although I've found that at speed wind noise often overcomes the rest of the noises coming from my electric bikes. Is this the same for the chain? I would probably miss that low speed silence of the belt.
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How did you remove the front pulley? I'm trying to do it without removing me motor. I believe it can be done with the right puller, a little heat and so forth. I have access to these tools and am familiar with removing all manner of shaft stuff. Also upgraded the chain to an EK 3D chain in black/gold, Totally bitchin'! Has some kind of X or O or XW ring, I forget.
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You do not have to remove the motor and I wouldn't recommend doing that anyway. I saw a video where the guy just used an impact wrench to remove the pulley bolt without using any heat and it came right out. It did not appear the bolt had any thread lock on it. If I can find the video I'll post a link. You can access the pulley bolt through the hole in the frame where the swing arm pivot is located.
However, you will probably still need some kind of puller to get the pulley off of the shaft once the bolt is removed. I think it was in the same video where the guy used a crow bar to gently pry the pulley loose, but that method is not recommended.
Found the link. The video is in the Zero Unofficial Common Modifications manual under chain kit.
https://youtu.be/_jfXixlzbf0
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The factory fucked up on that guy's pulley bolt. Mine has threadlocker and broke a 6mm bit already. Need to hit it with the torch to continue.
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Minute 10:00 to 10:25 the splines on the sprocket are a lot less than the belt pulley. I can not think of any of my bikes that have a flat sprocket like that, there is either on one or both sides more metal with splines.
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Got the chain installed. Here are some notes:
--Needed torch to break threadlocker and expand pulley to remove with standard gear puller. Very tight fit on my model between the end of the shaft and the frame on removal. Without a torch I think the hex keyway on the pulley bolt would have rounded before breaking free.
--Noise is great, sounds better than before. Not much louder, just different.
--Increased torque, spins tire more easily on dry pavement and wheelies better. More fun than lazy stock gearing.
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More thoughts on the chain:
--Pretty loud, might need earplugs. Sounds like racecar though. I still like it.
--So much more fun powering over bumps and jumps. Always took it easy there on the stock belt.
--The torque increase makes wheelies easier between maybe 5 and 20 mph. But, the shortened gearing means the torque hit is more more noticeable along with the dropoff. It happens quickly, and the bike tops out in a few seconds. Overall, very worthwhile.
--It's still not that great at wheelies. Everyone who thinks these bikes are wheelie machines needs a reality check.
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Don't the tires make more noise than the chain? It must vary due to tire and pressure choice. A gasoline bike shut off and coasting as on downhill the chain sound is pretty minimal and sometimes useful judging how much the rear tire is slipping due to breaking.
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No, not even close. Even if you had knobbies the chain would be louder.
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I recently put the chain kit on my 2017 FX. It seemed about like others experience: had to warm it a little to break the loctite, used a breaker bar rather than air impact, good wheel puller to get the pulley loosened, and then the rest pretty straightforward. I purchased a torx type screw from the later models to use rather than the allen for the next time I need to remove it.
I wonder about what Auriga said about the speedometer. The rear wheel ABS sensor drives the speedometer and I assumed it was based on wheel rotation so why would the final drive ratio change the speedo reading? Since I installed the chain kit, I haven't ridden the bike on the street, so haven't checked the speedo ...
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I'e always thought that the speedo was based off the motor RPM, it would make sense as it'll be more accurate than an ABS sensor. The software asks for the front and rear sprockets sizes as well as the tyre circumference.
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I'e always thought that the speedo was based off the motor RPM, it would make sense as it'll be more accurate than an ABS sensor. The software asks for the front and rear sprockets sizes as well as the tyre circumference.
Yes. It's definitely the motor, not from ABS. My bike doesn't even have ABS.
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My KTM speedo has a front wheel sensor and my Versys had a sensor on the countershaft sprocket so there are different ways of doing it. So, apparently, just like the Versys, changing the final drive will affect the speedometer.
Is it something in the MBB that asks for sprockets and circumference? What software asks for those inputs? - would like to change it for chain kit and knobby tires.
AFAIK, no one has the password to make any changes with MBB set command if that would be where the parameters are set.
Update: Yep, must be the motor; speedo still works when I disconnect the rear wheel ABS sensor.
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AFAIK, no one has the password to make any changes with MBB set command if that would be where the parameters are set.
https://zeromanual.com/wiki/MBB_Console
If it's not on that page there's more info on the wiki to reprogram the gear ratio. I dunno if you can do it or not. You just need a terminal software and serial adaptor no special software. I never reprogrammed mine, so I've gotten really good at multiplying all the speeds on the dash by .81. As a bonus you'll see that topped out 88 more often. If you want to know passwords on the bike get a bus pirate and take your bike to the dealer and ask them to do something that requires them to login with a password. The traffic is in plaintext.
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I made a serial adapter and have worked with the MBB output on one of my Linux computers. I have not seen anything in there about drive ratios or sprocket sizes. My dealer didn't know anything about the MBB or how to access it and told me he doesn't know of any password. Zero CS told me they don't give out the password and that I couldn't get it from the dealer.
https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=9149.msg79416#msg79416 (https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=9149.msg79416#msg79416)
I could do the buss pirate but any other dealer would be a bunch farther than the 3 hours to where I bought the bike and it could be for nothing.
I'll keep looking for info on reprogramming the gear ratio.
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I've been in the MBB with a TTL cable before, its definitely in there but I didnt have the password to set anything. From the wiki:
spfront - Sprocket Teeth Front : 28
The number of teeth on the front sprocket, input to speedometer calculation.
sprear - Sprocket Teeth Rear : 130
The number of teeth on the rear sprocket, input to speedometer calculation.
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Thanks NoMoreIdeas - just like flattetyyre said.
I didn't get to put my OBD connector/computer on mine yet to look for this but will soon, would like to see it even if I can't change it (maybe someday).
Is this where you found this? Sorry, I just haven't found it yet.
https://zeromanual.com/wiki/MBB_Console (https://zeromanual.com/wiki/MBB_Console)