ElectricMotorcycleForum.com
Makes And Models => Zero Motorcycles Forum | 2013+ => Topic started by: JaimeC on August 24, 2021, 07:20:31 AM
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Naturally the Zero website hasn't been updated with any information on it yet.
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Anyone found any bugs in it? ^-^
It's getting that time I take my bike to the shop and do I want the firmware or not?
-Crissa
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Haven't really had it on long enough to tell. As usual, the update wipes the trip meter and resets it to zero so I can't tell if any range estimates changed. I charged it up overnight and will be taking it to work today so I should have a better idea this evening.
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Someone on Facebook reported that his dealer told him the update is to primarily add support for the FXE as well as fix a few minor bugs. Makes sense.
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I just installed the latest firmware to my 2018 Zero S. The process went very smoothly. It took about 20 minutes and didn't have the annoying message at the end that said the download failed, when it didn't. Plus, I really like the new Zero app that has been much improved since my last update. It now shows the progress of each update in the package. Photo of the app during the download is attached.
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Purtroppo, la nuova app zero, non mi trova la moto col bluetooth >:(.con l a mia sono fermo al 32 e 26
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Well, I have 2014, I have to take my bike in for the firmware.
-Crissa
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Which Zero bikes are considered Gen 1 and Gen 2?
Is there also a 3rd gen?
-Don- Auburn, CA
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Which Zero bikes are considered Gen 1 and Gen 2?
Is there also a 3rd gen?
Generation 1: Bikes built before 2013
Generation 2: Bikes built after 2013 (except for Generation 3)
Generation 3: The SR/F and the SR/S
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Generation 1: Bikes built before 2013
Generation 2: Bikes built after 2013 (except for Generation 3)
Generation 3: The SR/F and the SR/S
Thanks for that info. So all mine are gen two. For now. I could soon buy a new SR/S, but after a new Energica Rebelle and a new 150K$ RV.
I will soon have a few hundred thousand bucks in cash to blow and who knows what I will buy then. I am too old to be saving money, it's more fun to see how fast I can blow it all!
I have my smallest cheapest house (of three) in Escrow right now and I should have the cash from that sale any day now. First week of September will be the very latest, I was told, but more likely even sooner.
BTW, what was the big change on Zeros before and after 2013? The oldest Zeros I have seen with my own eyes is 2016.
-Don- Auburn, CA
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Zero calls Gen 2 the Cypher II platform and Gen 3 the Cypher III platform, so the generation language is definitely unofficial, but the same.
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Generation 1: Bikes built before 2013
Generation 2: Bikes built after 2013 (except for Generation 3)
Generation 3: The SR/F and the SR/S
Thanks for that info. So all mine are gen two. For now. I could soon buy a new SR/S, but after a new Energica Rebelle and a new 150K$ RV.
I will soon have a few hundred thousand bucks in cash to blow and who knows what I will buy then. I am too old to be saving money, it's more fun to see how fast I can blow it all!
I have my smallest cheapest house (of three) in Escrow right now and I should have the cash from that sale any day now. First week of September will be the very latest, I was told, but more likely even sooner.
BTW, what was the big change on Zeros before and after 2013? The oldest Zeros I have seen with my own eyes is 2016.
-Don- Auburn, CA
The 2010 and 2011 bikes were the first production models that Zero produced, I believe. They used a completely different battery and a standard type of off-the-shelf PM motor with brushes, as I recall. I bought a 2012 model that used a different ventilated off-the-shelf brushless motor and EIG batteries. That model only lasted one year and eventually was recalled due to battery fires - an early adopter of fires, apparently. But I did like the looks of the bike and it ran pretty well. Then in 2013, Zero switched to their own unique motor design and started using Farasis battery cells. After a bit of a rocky start with some of the components of the 2013 bikes, the 2014 models were produced with enough improvements to make then work pretty good.
If it was me, I would call the 2010-2011 the first generation, the 2012 models the second generation, the 2013-on the third generation and the SR/F and SR/S the fourth generation.
Attached is two photos of my 2012 Zero recharging at Alice's Restaurant.
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My app keeps complaining about not being able to download the new firmware and the file is corrupt (iOS). Is this just my bad luck or is it a common issue?
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My app keeps complaining about not being able to download the new firmware and the file is corrupt (iOS). Is this just my bad luck or is it a common issue?
I have never had that problem with my 2018 Zero S or any of the older versions of the app that were on my phone. Perhaps you need to dump your existing version of the app and reinstall it again? ??? My phone is a low budget (around $120) Android version, if that makes any difference.
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My app keeps complaining about not being able to download the new firmware and the file is corrupt (iOS). Is this just my bad luck or is it a common issue?
I was seeing those messages about a week before I was actually able to download and install it. I just figured Zero hadn't finished updating their servers with the new software yet.
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I just installed the latest firmware to my 2018 Zero S. The process went very smoothly. It took about 20 minutes and didn't have the annoying message at the end that said the download failed, when it didn't.
I forgot to mention that. This is the FIRST time I can remember the upgrade going without a hitch and it actually reporting afterward that the upgrade was successful!
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Okay, now that I've been using it for a few days I have made some observations. The estimated range appears to be more "consistent" in that after charging the bike the estimated range seems to hover more closely to about 110 miles. Previously it would vary from 90 to 130 miles and I never quite figured out a pattern.
I also noticed a very minor change in my "Custom" settings. I had everything previously set to 100%. When I checked, it reported my "coasting" regen was 95%. I moved the slider to 100% and now my "Custom" off-throttle behavior matches what feel in "Eco" mode. On my 2016 model, my custom mode always felt like it decelerated more than Eco mode. With the 2018 it always felt like less. Now at least they feel the same.
I would say it seems to pair faster with bluetooth but the last time I reported that it suddenly seemed to get worse so I'll withhold judgement on that issue. Only other thing is what I observed earlier: this is the FIRST update that actually reported was successful. Ever since I got the bike I'd always gotten some weird error message at the conclusion of the update only to find out the update was actually successful. It was rather nerve-wracking!
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Thanks JaimeC, way to blaze the trail. Glad it hear it's seems to be an actual improvement.
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Now that you mention it, JaimeC, I also noticed that my cell phone captured the Bluetooth signal from my bike immediately without the usual drama of needing to turn the ignition key on and off a couple of time before it was found. All in all a much more pleasant experience than installing previous updates. :)
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I recently added a 2018 FXS to my collection. This is the Newest Zero I have owned so no previous experience with over the air updates.
When I first ran through the App, There wasn't really much going on with Firmware other than it said it was corrupt and to restart. I hadn't
started anything in the first place. Then, the other day, it said that there was a new version and asked if I wanted to update. I agreed to
update and on the checklist, everything was checked except for bike plugged in to charger. It was, and it was charging. The app saw the
rise in charge rate both on the charge page and the Firmware page, but still said no dice. So, I disconnected the QuiQ and charged from
onboard, same issue. Tried 120 Volt and 240 Volt charging, nothing worked. There was ONE time that all the check marks lined up and it
said downloading but after a few minutes, it stopped and now once again always shows charger as being disconnected. Has anyone else
had this issue? If so, how was it resolved. If not, any suggestions?
I have uninstalled and reinstalled app. I have added and deleted the bike from Bluetooth. I have tried on two different Android Phones
Both running OS 10.
Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Thank You
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Huh, throttle regen on my bike is higher on Sport than Eco on my bike...
-Crissa
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Huh, throttle regen on my bike is higher on Sport than Eco on my bike...
-Crissa
That doesn't sound like the way it should be, but in 2014 things were probably different.
-Don- Reno, NV
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I recently added a 2018 FXS to my collection. This is the Newest Zero I have owned so no previous experience with over the air updates.
When I first ran through the App, There wasn't really much going on with Firmware other than it said it was corrupt and to restart. I hadn't
started anything in the first place. Then, the other day, it said that there was a new version and asked if I wanted to update. I agreed to
update and on the checklist, everything was checked except for bike plugged in to charger. It was, and it was charging. The app saw the
rise in charge rate both on the charge page and the Firmware page, but still said no dice. So, I disconnected the QuiQ and charged from
onboard, same issue. Tried 120 Volt and 240 Volt charging, nothing worked. There was ONE time that all the check marks lined up and it
said downloading but after a few minutes, it stopped and now once again always shows charger as being disconnected. Has anyone else
had this issue? If so, how was it resolved. If not, any suggestions?
I have uninstalled and reinstalled app. I have added and deleted the bike from Bluetooth. I have tried on two different Android Phones
Both running OS 10.
Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Thank You
It's been a while since I updated my bike but I'm pretty sure it's not supposed to be plugged in. There's no logical reason why it should be required and would probably make the process more complicated (perhaps impossible) as the bike is trying to control the charging process while also modifying the firmware, part of which includes that control process.
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KrazyEd, you've got it backwards. The bike should NOT be charging during the update process. The bike should have at least 40% battery left (if I recall correctly) but should NOT be plugged in. The checklist should explain that. Read it again carefully.
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KrazyEd, you've got it backwards. The bike should NOT be charging during the update process. The bike should have at least 40% battery left (if I recall correctly) but should NOT be plugged in. The checklist should explain that. Read it again carefully.
That was the mistake that I made the first time I tried to update with the new version of the app and the charger connected. At first I failed to see the check mark saying that the bike should not be charging. But then I scrolled down and noticed the warning was not checked. When I pulled the charger plug, the warning checked, the download started and went smoothly from then on.
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That doesn't sound like the way it should be, buy in 2014 things were probably different.
Since Evo is the Gen2 rain mode, shouldn't it have less throttle regen?
-Crissa
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As far as the " Not plugged in part " You are probably correct.
Perhaps I was looking at the app wrong. After a ride last night
I thought I would try again. THIS Time, I was going to try the
update, THEN plug in to charger. When I hit update, it started.
Finished update and said update complete. Will take out for another
ride tonight after the sun goes down to see how it works.
Sorry to have posted before exhausting all avenues.
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My app keeps complaining about not being able to download the new firmware and the file is corrupt (iOS). Is this just my bad luck or is it a common issue?
I was seeing those messages about a week before I was actually able to download and install it. I just figured Zero hadn't finished updating their servers with the new software yet.
Uninstalled the app and still seeing it. Guess I'll need the dealer to upgrade it if I'm going to get it at all.
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I just returned from a couple of rides with the new firmware installed, in relatively warm weather, 65 degrees F in the morning and 95-75-85 in the afternoon. I rode to my daughter's home and back using my usual route and speeds, a distance of 37.5 miles each way. I was surprised that I used less battery power in each direction than ever before. At least according to the SOC display. I normally arrive at my daughter's home with 70% showing, today it was 74%. I recharged there to 100%. On the ride back home I usually see 70% SOC and today I arrived back home showing 76% SOC. No doubt the warm weather made an improvement, but the range guestimeter was saying that I had a range of 194 miles in the morning at the start of my ride and when I returned home it said I could still travel 120 miles on the remaining 76% after my 37.5 mile ride. Also, in the morning 100% didn't change to 99% for 1/4 mile longer than it usually does. I wonder if this is due to the firmware update or just due to the warmer ambient temperature?
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It was pretty warm! ^-^ And not so high pressure weather, either.
-Crissa
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Since Evo is the Gen2 rain mode, shouldn't it have less throttle regen?
-Crissa
Perhaps true in a rain mode. I have never used the rain mode in my Energica--not even when it rained on me a few different times. But with it, I can put max regen even in the rain mode. It's a separate selection with Energica. I don't know about bikes I don't own, but as a general rule, more regen is wanted at slower speeds and none or very little at higher speeds.
-Don- Reno, NV
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My app keeps complaining about not being able to download the new firmware and the file is corrupt (iOS). Is this just my bad luck or is it a common issue?
I was seeing those messages about a week before I was actually able to download and install it. I just figured Zero hadn't finished updating their servers with the new software yet.
Uninstalled the app and still seeing it. Guess I'll need the dealer to upgrade it if I'm going to get it at all.
I get the same file corrupt message when I try to update the firmware too - it's been like that for the last 3-4 weeks at least. There's probably a different file for each model year, and one or more of them may not have been uploaded to the server properly. I have a 2017 SR, if anyone has been able to successfully update the firmware on one of these to the new version, let me know...
Ulster Zero
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I get the same file corrupt message when I try to update the firmware too - it's been like that for the last 3-4 weeks at least. There's probably a different file for each model year, and one or more of them may not have been uploaded to the server properly. I have a 2017 SR, if anyone has been able to successfully update the firmware on one of these to the new version, let me know...
Ulster Zero
I think it's more related to IOS vs Android as I had the same file corrupt error on my iphone but I was able to download it and update my MY18 FXS with my android phone. I tested both phones the same day.
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I get the same file corrupt message when I try to update the firmware too - it's been like that for the last 3-4 weeks at least. There's probably a different file for each model year, and one or more of them may not have been uploaded to the server properly. I have a 2017 SR, if anyone has been able to successfully update the firmware on one of these to the new version, let me know...
Ulster Zero
I think it's more related to IOS vs Android as I had the same file corrupt error on my iphone but I was able to download it and update my MY18 FXS with my android phone. I tested both phones the same day.
Thanks dalamario,
I can confirm it's definitely an iOS issue. I borrowed an old Android phone, and was able to update the firmware no problem. :)
Ulster Zero
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Huh, throttle regen on my bike is higher on Sport than Eco on my bike...
-Crissa
Does this behaviour has been witnessed by other Zero users of Gen2 bikes. As already mentioned, isn't logic nor fun to have high regen in the sport modes. Its a reason for avoiding this firmware update as het V33 version hadn't this effet, or at least not on my FXS 2020 bike.
If others could verify this on their bikes if they have already implemented the update it would be important information to all others as I do suppose I'm not the only one prefering 0.0% regen in sport mode to allow maximum control.
Jan
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I find that regen feels best when it mimics a "real" engine, ie. a bit of engine braking whenever the throttle is fully closed, because that's the kind of bikes I've had for the last 30 years (no 2 strokes since I was a kid). It also helps to have some braking going on at the rear to keep the bike steady when trail braking.
Cas :)
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Cas nailed it. I can think of no reason NOT to have full regen on coasting. For the umpteenth time I find myself mentioning that regen only kicks in when you roll the throttle off to the STOP. If you hold it off of the stop, regen never kicks in and you coast. You can easily verify this for yourself by just looking at the dash. This behavior is even documented in the user manual but I'm getting the impression NOBODY reads the manual anymore.
Keeping that in mind, I find "Sport Mode" to be useless and I never use it. I use my "Custom" mode for most of my riding (everything set to 100%) and use "Eco" on the highway as a "Poor Man's Cruise Control" as I can keep the throttle pinned open and cruise along at 70mph... more than fast enough for where I live (where the legal speed limit is only 55mph; not that anyone pays attention to that).
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I second that! I don't own a Zero but I still like a medium amount of regen. I'm also coming from riding 4 cylinders, so I like the feeling it emulates. Maybe people who don't like that never rode ICE bikes?
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I have tried sport and eco modes and still prefer my custom mode set to coasting with the throttle closed. I might add that I have read my entire manual several times just so I don't forget anything. ;) But for my type of riding, I do a lot of coasting and find that it is easier for me to just shut the throttle completely, instead of trying to hold it at a certain neutral position just above off.
I grew up riding two-stroke motorcycles and am used to not having the engine slow down the vehicle on over-run. In fact, my first car was a DKW Junior, which was powered by an 800cc three-cylinder engine and had a free-wheeling one-way clutch that disconnected from the drive train when you took your foot off of the accelerator. :o The ultimate in "slipper" clutches. ::)
One thing that I have noticed on my 2018 S is that there is very little difference between full-regen when in Sport or Eco mode when braking. But the regen effect is noticeably greater when set to 100% in the Custom mode. ???
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I still prefer using the regen to slow approaching turns or a red light. Converting that kinetic energy into electricity for use later makes more sense than wasting it as heat and black dust. It also saves wear and tear on the brake pads so I don't have to replace them as often. To each his own.
I've only owned/ridden one two-stroke, a Kawasaki KE100 dual-purpose bike. I'm far more familiar with high-compression four-strokes. To me, a Zero on full-regen feels more like coasting than one of those with the throttle off.
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I find 40%-50% regen feels most like a twin cylinder (my favourite configuration). 100% is a bit too much for me as the "dead zone" between true coasting and 100% regen is very very small and hard to mete out precisely with the wrist, so I prefer the more natural feel of 40% or so as even though it's slightly more wasteful - and it really is slight! - it's a better feel to me. And I wouldn't want to rely on the Bosch electronics to deal with rear-wheel lockups in slippery conditions just from shutting the throttle which I suspect is just as abrupt going the other way as the way EVs lose traction on acceleration.
Cas :)
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What I do is to just barely touch my front brake lever so that the tail light comes on but the brakes are not slowing down the bike. Then I let the 100% braking regen slow me down when needed. I won't use my brakes unless I need to slow down faster than that.
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I get the same file corrupt message when I try to update the firmware too - it's been like that for the last 3-4 weeks at least. There's probably a different file for each model year, and one or more of them may not have been uploaded to the server properly. I have a 2017 SR, if anyone has been able to successfully update the firmware on one of these to the new version, let me know...
Ulster Zero
I think it's more related to IOS vs Android as I had the same file corrupt error on my iphone but I was able to download it and update my MY18 FXS with my android phone. I tested both phones the same day.
Thanks dalamario,
I can confirm it's definitely an iOS issue. I borrowed an old Android phone, and was able to update the firmware no problem. :)
Ulster Zero
Just grabbed my old android, it looks like it tries to downlaod firmware but I just get the spinning donut of doom. I swear it's just my luck in this universe. Nothing works for me.
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Cas nailed it. I can think of no reason NOT to have full regen on coasting.
I fully realize we can simply turn everything to the very max and control everything from the throttle, such as speed, regen, acceleration.
The only control we really need is the throttle when every possible option is set for max. All the buttons and configurations do is to force limits on what we can do.
But . . .
I like the feel of the throttle much better with regen limited while on the freeway and I like the Eco mode for the same reason when on city streets.
-Don- Reno, NV
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I do the same as Richard. I have it set the to amount that works best on the hills I ride. I only shift to Sport when entering the freeway, overtaking, or coming down hills behind traffic or curvier hills I want to do trailbraking on.
I ride 90% of the time with 100% braking regen, 5% throttle.
-Crissa
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I most of my town driving as us 10% power and 70% regen, as this is rather compatible with the traffic I hit in town, so it rather personal and related to driving in Brussels.
On the other hand when I drive somewhat more sporty I like to have only regen when applying the breaks in order to have full controle over my speed. I use only 10% regen on the first step (throttle handle) and 30% and the second level (first step front handle breaking). In this I have some small speed reduction in freewheel behind a car (in the slipsteam) but without the need to finetune the throttle handle to avoid breaking to much and losing contact. Personally I like this as it leaves me more attention to just reacting to the other drivers around. Again this is a very personal approach based mainly because i like to be able to freewheel behind others when driving sporty.
I do think we have all our preferences but it would be important to have the standard setting of ECO (less power but max regen) and SPORT (max power but little regen) being well opposite as we can't change them. The personal preference are in the custom settings.
I love driving these bikes, the power is that direct, it as being in a realtime video game
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Gotta LOVE the internet. A topic dedicated to the new firmware availability morphs into a discussion on regen settings. I wonder if "Regen Settings" is the "Best oil for my motorcycle?" discussion for electric bikes? Well, except some electric bikes DO require oil changes (just not Zeros so far).
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Gotta LOVE the internet. A topic dedicated to the new firmware availability morphs into a discussion on regen settings. I wonder if "Regen Settings" is the "Best oil for my motorcycle?" discussion for electric bikes?
Yes, just as happens in real life voice discussions. IMO, some people make way too big of a deal about staying on topic, which only rarely happens after a few posts and all is said about the subject title anyway.
-Don- Reno, NV
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firmware updates can affect regen braking settings, I don't see the problem here.
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Anch'io uso il custom 40% di potenza, 95% di regina, e 135 km/h di velocità massima, tanto da seguire la scia delle auto/ furgoni in a Uto strada. I miei preferì j van finestrati, così ci vedo attraverso ciò che gli succede davanti.
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Anch'io uso il custom 40% di potenza, 95% di regina, e 135 km/h di velocità massima, tanto da seguire la scia delle auto/ furgoni in a Uto strada. I miei preferì j van finestrati, così ci vedo attraverso ciò che gli succede davanti.
Translates to:
"I also use the custom 40% power, 95% queen, and 135 km / h of top speed, enough to follow the trail of the cars / vans in a Uto road. My preferred j van windowed, so I can see through what is happening in front of them."
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Well if anyone wants to talk about regen/mode settings, I wrote a thread about it:
https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=10990.0
-Crissa
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Well if anyone wants to talk about regen/mode settings, I wrote a thread about it:
https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=10990.0
-Crissa
Hi Crissa,
Most intresting thread but for re-aligning with the current thread, has the new firmware resulted in changes in your regen/mode matrix?
And if so, which elements are changed by this new firmware.
Best regards
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Well if anyone wants to talk about regen/mode settings, I wrote a thread about it:
https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=10990.0
-Crissa
Hi Crissa,
Most intresting thread but for re-aligning with the current thread, has the new firmware resulted in changes in your regen/mode matrix?
And if so, which elements are changed by this new firmware.
Best regards
There was no change to my custom settings and no apparent change to my factory-settings for the eco and sport modes that I could tell after installing the new update on my 2018 S with PT.
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Most intresting thread but for re-aligning with the current thread, has the new firmware resulted in changes in your regen/mode matrix?
And if so, which elements are changed by this new firmware.
I have a 2014, which is the year before they made a mainboard that could update itself. They did replace it in 2019 after they bricked it but I don't know if it's a newer revision or not. In any case, it hasn't asked me to update yet.
-Crissa
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Most intresting thread but for re-aligning with the current thread, has the new firmware resulted in changes in your regen/mode matrix?
And if so, which elements are changed by this new firmware.
I have a 2014, which is the year before they made a mainboard that could update itself. They did replace it in 2019 after they bricked it but I don't know if it's a newer revision or not. In any case, it hasn't asked me to update yet.
-Crissa
I had to take my 2016 model in to the dealer to get it flashed. The first model year that let you flash the firmware yourself was 2017. That was also the first year they introduced the wider belt and the locking top box along with the 6kW Charge Tank option. When my 2016 was totaled I replaced it with a 2018 model which had all of those updates. Naturally a year later they replaced the 13kWh battery with the 14.4kWh battery. In 2020 they decided the S would only come with the 7.2kWh battery in North America so no reason to go beyond what I have now till the SR/S is available in red.
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I just updated my firmware to the latest (2020 DSR). No issues with the download/update, was pretty fast actually. 10 or 15 mins. Going for a nice ride today to test it out.
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Nothing new to report other than the bike is running fine!
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ieri ho aggiornato il firmewere , e stamattina ho il cruscotto che sembra un albero di natale e la moto non funzina , errore 6 . 25 .40 .45- 44 -45 -47 -48 -49 . maledetto aggiornamento. voi sapete come si fa a resettare la moto, o va portata dal concessionario ? grazie per le eventuali risposte
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Oh boy... Thankfully that has never happened to me. Sometimes it looked like the update failed but when I checked everything was fine and the update was successful. This last time was actually the FIRST time it DIDN'T throw any errors and actually reported the update was successful. If powering off the bike and then keying it back on doesn't help I'm afraid the dealer is your only option... :(
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Oggi l ho portata dal concessionario a Milano. , domani mi dice il responso, speriamo che si risolva con l aggiornamento completo, al contrario potrebbe essere il bms.
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Buona fortuna. Tienici aggiornati.
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Hanno depurato dagli errori la scheda bms, domani rimontano e provano. Mi sa che quel ca.. Olo di aggiornamento andato a male, ha mandato in tilt il bms, speriamo in brne
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ok moto ritornata in forma, riprogrammato il bms, che causa buco nell'aggiornamento , ha perso la memoria. mai,mai piu un aggiornamento col cellulare , per una spesa di 200€ per la riprogrammazione e lavorazione sulla moto.