ElectricMotorcycleForum.com

  • October 17, 2017, 09:05:35 PM
  • Welcome, Guest
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Electric Motorcycle Forum is live!

Pages: [1] 2

Author Topic: The Over 120 Mile Club  (Read 882 times)

42Cliffside

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 56
    • View Profile
The Over 120 Mile Club
« on: May 24, 2017, 04:51:14 AM »

My first ride was 90 miles, got back with 20% left, this made me more confident taking longer rides on low speed limit roads.
I've done a few 120 mile days gettin back with about 10% (the 1%/mile of Mixed high speed/low speed guestimate makes it easy to tell if you are close enough to home, thanks google maps)

Now I noticed a power reduction that happened somewhere below 10% because I did about 130 miles, at first I thought something was wrong...

I'm really enjoying this bike for my first 1600 miles (For only a bit over $20 in electricity, Cool!!)
Logged

Electric Terry

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 641
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2017, 07:06:50 AM »

Nice job!  Check out the superchargers that people are using.  They can let you do about 500 miles a day without too much effort, using what we call #dubjay charging (using 2 charging plugs at the same time)
Logged
100,000+ all electric miles on Zero Motorcycles - 75,000+ on a 2012 Zero S and 35,000+ miles on a 2015 Zero SR
http://www.facebook.com/electricterry
http://instagram.com/electricterry
https://twitter.com/electricterry

gyrocyclist

  • Zero. Because motorcycles should be seen and not heard.
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 122
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2017, 08:33:27 AM »

My first ride was 90 miles, got back with 20% left, this made me more confident taking longer rides on low speed limit roads.
I've done a few 120 mile days gettin back with about 10% (the 1%/mile of Mixed high speed/low speed guestimate makes it easy to tell if you are close enough to home, thanks google maps)

Now I noticed a power reduction that happened somewhere below 10% because I did about 130 miles, at first I thought something was wrong...

I'm really enjoying this bike for my first 1600 miles (For only a bit over $20 in electricity, Cool!!)
My lowest SOC was 6%. Around 107 miles. First half was twisty (great milage), 2nd half was freeway (so ate up charge much faster). My point: I've never noticed a power reduction at low SOC (2016 SR)
Logged

gyrocyclist

  • Zero. Because motorcycles should be seen and not heard.
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 122
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2017, 08:42:28 AM »

Nice job!  Check out the superchargers that people are using.  They can let you do about 500 miles a day without too much effort, using what we call #dubjay charging (using 2 charging plugs at the same time)
Terry, my math shows 500m  would be a *very* long day. For me,  2016SR, 100 miles per charge @ 55mph is nine hours riding time. 1C charging adds another four hours. So 13 hours? Not sure I'd call that "without too much effort."

I'd love for you to expand on your comment! (Disclaimer: possibly I've made mistakes in my math)
Logged

benswing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1121
  • 2016 Zero SR Cross Country Biker, www.Benswing.com
    • View Profile
    • Follow my electric motorcycle adventures on Facebook
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2017, 09:17:47 AM »

For reference it took me 18 hours to travel 525 miles from Denver to Park City using a supercharger and 2 Elcons.  I charged using 2 J1772 plugs or RV campsites the entire way.  I plan to use Superchargers V2 this summer but doubt they will reduce my time to 500 miles by much.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Logged
First to 48 states all electric!
 - Long Range Electric Biker - https://www.facebook.com/BenRidesElectric/
 - Video/photo/articles about 4 corners tour: http://www.benswing.com
 - Crossed the USA in 2013 on a 2012 Zero S with the Ride the Future Tour, see the movie at https://vimeo.com/169002549

Skidz

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 169
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #5 on: May 24, 2017, 02:04:35 PM »

Terry takes every opportunity he sees to promote the SCv2 ;)
Logged

Electric Terry

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 641
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #6 on: May 24, 2017, 02:49:16 PM »

Terry takes every opportunity he sees to promote the SCv2 ;)

Absolutely!! They make having a Zero and wanting to go anywhere so simple and easy now!! The way I had to charge before was considered archaic with size and weight compared to the new superchargers. 

Also similar to Ben my day of over 500 miles was also about 17 hours, but that is a regular day for me anyway.
Logged
100,000+ all electric miles on Zero Motorcycles - 75,000+ on a 2012 Zero S and 35,000+ miles on a 2015 Zero SR
http://www.facebook.com/electricterry
http://instagram.com/electricterry
https://twitter.com/electricterry

BrianTRice

  • Unofficial Zero Manual Editor
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2276
  • Nerdy Adventurer
    • View Profile
    • Personal site
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #7 on: May 24, 2017, 05:50:33 PM »

The fact is, 1C charging on a stock Zero means that 400 miles per day (7 hours of riding and 4-5 hours of charging) is realistic right now, and not 500.

We can't redefine people's definition of fun in order to declare a 17 hour day fun. Fatigue is a nonnegotiable factor in maintaining a relentless pace like doing nothing but charging and riding all day and then after dark.

And yes I'll argue that drag reduction gets you to 500 miles in those 12 hours per day but that's still too much to ask of most riders until there's a commodity plan in place.
Logged
Zero: 2016 DSR, 2013 DS
Also: 2012 Suzuki DL-650 V-Strom Adv

Erasmo

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 874
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #8 on: May 24, 2017, 06:48:53 PM »

To be honest 800 km a day is also quite taxing on an ICE motorcycle, charging breaks are actually perfect to also recharge the rider.
Logged

benswing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1121
  • 2016 Zero SR Cross Country Biker, www.Benswing.com
    • View Profile
    • Follow my electric motorcycle adventures on Facebook
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #9 on: May 24, 2017, 07:56:02 PM »

I did 130 miles on one charge (2014 Zero SR) while riding down Skyline Drive in 2015.  The road has a speed limit of 35mph and while riding uphill reduces range, riding back down increases range.  Here is the video (one of the best from my trip):



With my 2016 Zero SR I have no doubt I could do 130 miles on that same road even with higher speeds.  However, the National Park Service installed 2 charging stations in the park so it isn't even necessary any more!  Yippee!

For a written analysis of riding in mountains and why it takes less charge instead of more, here is a blog post from last year's journey.

https://www.benswing.com/single-post/2016/08/23/2016-ElMoto-4Corners---Blacksburg-VA-to-Fairfax-VA
« Last Edit: May 24, 2017, 08:01:14 PM by benswing »
Logged
First to 48 states all electric!
 - Long Range Electric Biker - https://www.facebook.com/BenRidesElectric/
 - Video/photo/articles about 4 corners tour: http://www.benswing.com
 - Crossed the USA in 2013 on a 2012 Zero S with the Ride the Future Tour, see the movie at https://vimeo.com/169002549

BrianTRice

  • Unofficial Zero Manual Editor
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2276
  • Nerdy Adventurer
    • View Profile
    • Personal site
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #10 on: May 24, 2017, 08:21:07 PM »

First, I'm a fan of the 550 mile day on my V-Strom 650. I schedule hourly breaks for a quick stretch and a photo or texting. I can make such a day cover 650 miles and once did 850 miles in a day but would not repeat that. Three consecutive days of all day riding demands a day off for me and most riders I've met.

To be honest 800 km a day is also quite taxing on an ICE motorcycle, charging breaks are actually perfect to also recharge the rider.

When we get to 2-4C charging, they will, but at 1C and stock aerodynamics, they're too much. Charging breaks are too restrictive in terms of requiring exactly a certain amount of time at an externally demanded interval, as opposed to an interval and timing picked to handle one's fatigue given the time of day and weather.

Want to have lunch? Great! You have exactly this amount of time to leave the charging station for it, eat, and return, while checking your ChargePoint app for a fault or interruption. If your options don't match those requirements, you're wasting time or bored.

Want to check out that scenic vista? Too bad, because there's no charger there so you only get to spend a minute on photos before continuing.

Got a 120 miles stretch coming up? Now you have to charge for longer to make that stretch work. Even if you get bored, you're still required to wait.

If you waste any time, you don't get 500 miles. You get 400. That's why I say 400 is what to aim for if you actually want to have a good time.
Logged
Zero: 2016 DSR, 2013 DS
Also: 2012 Suzuki DL-650 V-Strom Adv

42Cliffside

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 56
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2017, 01:55:58 AM »


My lowest SOC was 6%. Around 107 miles. First half was twisty (great milage), 2nd half was freeway (so ate up charge much faster). My point: I've never noticed a power reduction at low SOC (2016 SR)

well, I'm on the 2017, and what it felt like was the belt slipping, or something slipping on full power off the line, checked all the bolts, did a front brake burnout, and nothing was moving, and it feels normal now after being charged, so I am just assuming there was some amperage reduction at low states of charge ( I saw the tesla guys get different 0-60 times at different states of charge, assume its similar, and I may have been lower SOC than I recall)
Logged

mrwilsn

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 665
  • 2014 Zero S / 2017 Zero SR
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2017, 05:45:43 AM »

My best is 160 miles on a charge on my 2017 Zero SR ZF13.  Here is it's story.

Friday 19 May 2017 09:36 PM: I finish a ride going 130 miles on one charge.  The ride ends with the bike's battery at 92V.



Saturday 20 May 2017 07:29 AM: The onboard charger is charging my bike at full power all the way up to 116.98V before the BMS stops charging and opens the contactor.  No CV mode for this charger.  Right before the contactor opens the charger is pulling 1.456kW from the wall and peak power to the battery is 1.508kW at 13 amps.  9 hours 53 minutes to go from below 0% (0% is about 95-96V) to over 100% (100% is 116.2V)



Saturday 20 May 2017 07:29 AM: After unplugging the onboard charger and turning the bike ON the bike's battery voltage has settled at 116.7V.



Saturday 20 May 2017 07:30 AM: With the bike on a rear stand, the kick stand up and the kill switch in the RUN position I check to see if the controller will operate at 116.7V.  I give a small twist of the throttle and get an indicated speed of 24 mph on the display based on the motor RPM with the wheel spinning in the air.  The battery voltage sags slightly to 116.64V from the small load of the spinning wheel.  Current is so small and brief that it doesn't even register in the app.



Saturday 20 May 2017 03:36 PM: Sitting in my garage for the last 8 hours the bike's battery voltage has dropped from 116.7 down to 116.44V.  The slow drain of the battery pack is fastest when charge is the highest so don't use this rate to extrapolate how long it would take to get down to 0% SOC.  Custom mode is set to 100% torque, 106 mph top speed, 0 regen on neutral throttle and 50% regen on brake.  100% regen on brake would be a little better for a long range ride but I don't like how harsh it feels when it cuts on and off with braking.  ECO mode sucks for long range rides!  I'm doing this with my wrist not an algorithm.  I have a full charge and I'm off for the next adventure!



Saturday 20 May 2017 04:37 PM: After 1 hour and 30 miles of riding I'm about 3 miles into the twisties.  SOC is at 83%, battery voltage is 110V and I am averaging 52.9 Wh/mi according to the bike's display.  Long range rides don't have to be boring!  Hills are your friend if you know how to use them.  Coasting is the name of this game.  Any energy you use to put momentum into the system you want to use for every last inch it's worth taking into consideration traffic and terrain.  Coasting and using as little throttle as possible allowing the bike to slow a little going up hills and accelerating going down at the top of a hill and coasting as far as possible before using the throttle again is a recipe for long ranges.



Saturday 20 May 2017 04:41 PM:  Not supposed to go 82 mph when you are on a long range test?  I didn't get the memo.  Trip AV ticks up to 54.4 Wh/mi.  SOC is down to 80% and battery voltage is down to 108V.



Saturday 20 May 2017 08:13 PM:  I have done 100 miles of twisties and 141 miles total.  The bike is at 8% SOC and a storm is chasing me.  Guess which direction it's coming from.  It's already starting to sprinkle and things are looking ominous and I don't have rain gear with me so it's time to head home.  Luckily home isn't far away.



Saturday 20 May 2017 08:16 PM:  At 6% SOC, home turns out to be a little too far and mother nature catches up with me.  Energy efficiency be damned it's time to high tail it home....it's really coming down at this point.



Saturday 20 May 2017 08:23 PM:  I pull into my garage with 2% SOC after riding for 147 miles.  I'm not satisfied.  Mother nature cut me short of my ambition.



Saturday 20 May 2017 09:37 PM:  An hour has gone by and it's stopped raining.  I'm hungry.  The bike hasn't been on the charger, I still have 2% SOC and the bike's battery voltage is 96V.  It's 13 miles round trip to get food.  Time to get crazy.  Having a DVM to tell you the exact battery voltage is what gives you the balls to do this.



Saturday 20 May 2017 09:42 PM: Just one mile after leaving my garage with a perfectly good outlet and the bike drops from 2% down to 0%.  This is a regular occurrence.  I have never seen the bike display SOC indicate 1% either while riding or while charging.  Must be a function of the algorithm being used.  No worries.  The bike's battery voltage is still holding 96V with no load and 95V while going 38 mph.  The bike will keep moving all the way down to 88V as long as cell balance hasn't gotten too high.  A lot of good voltage on the riding screen of the app would do me in this scenario....stupid thing won't connect!



Saturday 20 May 2017 10:29 PM: I pull back into my garage with a total of 160 miles completed on a single charge.  I'm tired and hungry.  So is the bike.  She has just 92V with no load and 91V under a light load.  The remaining 4V go quickly and power has already been significantly reduced but I am still able to go over 20 mph on flat ground.  However, slower the better at this voltage.



Saturday 20 May 2017 10:33 PM: Home with the loot.  The bike's battery voltage has settled at 92.18V.  I averaged 53.2 Wh/mi according to the bike's display.



Saturday 20 May 2017 10:40 PM: The bike has been on the charger for a few minutes.  The charger is pulling 1.165kW from the wall and peak power to the battery is 1.023kW at 11 amps.  Compare that to the 1.456kW from the wall and peak power to the battery of 1.508kW at 13 amps when the battery was nearly fully charged.  The display and app show that it will take 11 hours 27 minutes but based on last night's charge time from below 0% (0% is about 95-96V) to over 100% (100% is 116.2V) only taking 9 hours 53 minutes it should be less than 10 hours.  And repeat  ;D



Gratuitous selfies!













« Last Edit: July 08, 2017, 03:54:19 AM by mrwilsn »
Logged
2014 Zero S

42Cliffside

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 56
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2017, 12:01:44 PM »

Cool vinyl, I've been looking at some electrolumenscent panels that can be cut into interesting shapes for the battery area. Also saw some Black vinyl that is retroreflective, and that just sounds like it would look So cool as trim on a black bike...

Logged

42Cliffside

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 56
    • View Profile
Re: The Over 120 Mile Club
« Reply #14 on: May 27, 2017, 12:09:18 PM »

did the math on 75wh/mile and at 130 miles I was right around reserve capacity - regular use is 10kwh on the 2017 right?
Logged
Pages: [1] 2