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Author Topic: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?  (Read 940 times)

TheGap

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Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« on: April 16, 2017, 09:07:46 PM »

As mentioned in my very first post to this forum, I recently bought a Zero SR 2017.
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=8.msg55305#msg55305
Although (especially in Sport Mode) I’ve been giggling like a little girl on a swing while riding this bike I notice a few things are … off.

I’ve already uploaded the logfiles to Zero and created a support ticket with them. I also made an appointment with my dealer but additionally would like to get some feedback from people who don’t have any … how should I put it … “commercial conflict of interest”.

First of all, from day one I’ve noticed the same sound as mentioned in this post:
http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=5785
Also, while driving at constant speed, the typical electric motor sound appears to be modulating.


When I unplug my bike from the mains after my batteries are charged to 100% (this doesn’t happen below 100% SOC) the Charging Indicator remains lit. Even after being unplugged for over 8 hours the indicator is still lit.


This happened only one time, but last week my turn signals completely refused to do anything:
While splitting lanes I turned on all four turn signals for safety (more visible to other drivers). Because I kept my eyes on the road I didn’t notice they didn’t turn on (reviewed it later, from footage on my helmet camera) and the whole ride home they never functioned, even when using the normal left/right turn signal switch.
Turn signals worked perfectly again the next day, a glitch perhaps?


Somewhat more annoying (as in: A LOT) is that very often and completely random the Charging Indicator lights up during my rides (This often even resets the Trip1 counter).
I’m already happy that this doesn’t trigger a safety which shuts down the bike while moving. Still there is a safety mechanism that (understandably) prevents the motor engaging when standing completely still and the Charging Indicator is lit up.
This means, of course, when I’m waiting at a traffic lights and for some odd reason the bike thinks that it’s plugged in, it refuses to move.
Resulting in a decent amount of honking going on behind me; such fun!  :(
The first few times I didn’t notice what was going on and the indicator went out while twisting the throttle … after which the motor engaged with quite the firm jolt. I’m sure that was very healthy for my belt.

Probably related to the previous issue is that almost each time I come to a full stop (75~80% of the time) the ‘armed’ indicator goes out for about one~two seconds. During that time, the engine won’t engage. If I didn’t notice and wanted to make a stop and go, I get a ‘High Throttle’ (error code: 1) error which even lengthens the duration I must wait until everything kicks in again.



Then there are some issues relating to the Zero app itself:
- Home View/Statistics mode: While the bike's model and year, SOC and other values are displayed, the "Time to Full Charge" is always 0:00 while charging.
- Home View/Riding Mode: All the available selections for the riding screen remain at their initial values as displayed when the Home View first switched from Statistics mode to Riding Mode. They never change when riding. Torque, kWatts and battery amps remain at zero (see also the video), temperature remains at the values when started and the same goes for time/distance to empty. Time only updates sporadically.
- When I remove the bike from the kickstand and set the killswitch to ON, the app switches correctly to Riding Mode. But switching back to Statistics mode I need to close the app, turn off my bike and !maybe! I’m back to statistics mode when I start them again. This usually takes several tries … if I get it at all. In case you were wondering: yes, killswitch is set to OFF and kickstand is down.
- I've set the units to metric in the Drive Setup screen; this displays the temperature correctly in Celcius but for torque the units are still displayed in Ft-Lbs instead of Nm
- I can’t easily set the ICE bike comparison values because the app only accepts a point as decimal symbol an refuses to accept my local setting of comma as decimal symbol


Are these upstart issues for a new model, all due to my ineptitude or did I buy a lemon?
I absolutely love the bike and wouldn’t want to trade it back to an ICE bike for the world, but some of these issues do dampen the enthusiasm a bit.  :'(
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ctrlburn

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2017, 10:11:29 PM »

Back when Zero did customer direct support - even with a few of the items you report - the suggestion was to check all the connectors, even specific pin seatings in the connectors. Even if the problem has not been reported before or solved this way.

Zero themselves wouldn't open a ticket for me directly anymore, instead pushing that down to the dealers.

Because dealers are best equipped through those things. So owners are back to feeling kind of helpless looking at all the cables when things don;t go right.

I would press the dealer for a full discovery and explanation of how each reported behavior links back to any problems found to be assured of a full repair.
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TheGap

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2017, 11:33:29 PM »

Zero themselves wouldn't open a ticket for me directly anymore, instead pushing that down to the dealers.

Because dealers are best equipped through those things. So owners are back to feeling kind of helpless looking at all the cables when things don;t go right.
That's actually what happened. I first contacted the dealer, they told me they opened a ticket with Zero and asked me to upload the logfiles. The automated reply from Zero said they opend a case(probably linked to the ticket from the dealer??), mentioned they also forwarded the logfiles to the dealer and asked me a few additional questions.
Later I uploaded a second logfile accompanied by a link to an edited video from my helmet camera and a list of timestamps of what I experienced.

Today I also found the Zero Log Parser in this forum which will be put to good use  :)
I'm going to cross check this with the second logfile, video and list of timestamps I previously created.

I would press the dealer for a full discovery and explanation of how each reported behavior links back to any problems found to be assured of a full repair.
Good idea, will do.
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Shadow

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2017, 12:07:19 AM »

The turn signals have a defective function that is intermittent, but they do not "talk" to the rest of the bike. I occasionally see no signals when flipping the hazards switch, cancelling the turn signals, and activating a turn signal or some derivation thereof. Someone else has confirmed this and the cause or steps to reproduce the problem are not known to me. I tend to only see it when the hazards are switched on.
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TheGap

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2017, 02:16:37 AM »

The turn signals have a defective function that is intermittent, but they do not "talk" to the rest of the bike. I occasionally see no signals when flipping the hazards switch, cancelling the turn signals, and activating a turn signal or some derivation thereof. Someone else has confirmed this and the cause or steps to reproduce the problem are not known to me. I tend to only see it when the hazards are switched on.
That seems to match perfectly with my experence.
Because nothing happened when I flipped the hazards switch, I completely forgot it was on. So the entire ride home the hazards switch was on all the time. Reading your post this explains why the turn signals didn't work either.
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Richard230

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2017, 03:09:10 AM »

Your bike certainly seems to have a number of issues that I haven't heard of before.  ??? I sure hope that your dealer can sort them out without keeping your bike for any unreasonable length of time.  You would think that by 2017 all of the assembly and component problems that Zero has experienced in the past would have been worked out by now.
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

Shadow

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2017, 03:22:43 AM »

The app is essentially broken for many of us. Don't worry about that because there is no way to fix it.

I think your bike has gremlins. Care to share a MBB log?
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TheGap

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2017, 10:40:57 PM »

The app is essentially broken for many of us. Don't worry about that because there is no way to fix it.
I figured as much as soon as I read the thread below. With the exception of log downloads I've experienced every single one of the symptoms mention in that thread.
 Zero App update: http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=6374.0
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TheGap

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2017, 10:47:16 PM »

Care to share a MBB log?
Sure, attached is the same one I've sent to Zero.
Last few days:
- Unplugged the bike on Friday
- Drove it about 1.2km on Sunday morning (experienced the Charging Indicator issue a few times)
- After about 10 min another 1.2km (experienced the Charging Indicator issue again a few times)
- plugged the bike back in
- Downloaded the log file several hours later (well into Sunday afternoon).
« Last Edit: April 17, 2017, 10:49:25 PM by TheGap »
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TheGap

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2017, 01:26:14 PM »

Took my bike back to the shop yesterday.
They said I should have it back by Saturday. I somewhat insisted on that since I would like to have it available for a police organised motorcycle training event next Sunday.

Here’s to hoping my three week old bike doesn’t end up as another horror story like some in this thread: http://electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=6757.0


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dano

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2017, 09:35:28 PM »

This makes me pause and reconsider if I should buy a 2017 Zero or not. I have concerns, I really do.
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Shadow

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2017, 10:02:00 PM »

This makes me pause and reconsider if I should buy a 2017 Zero or not. I have concerns, I really do.
It's quite a lot of cash to put up, but if you want Tesla-like acceleration at one-tenth of the cost... it does that.
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Kocho

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2017, 10:29:51 PM »

Or buy a trusted used '15 for a lot less (ahem, I got mine for sale listed here and on eBay) ;)

This makes me pause and reconsider if I should buy a 2017 Zero or not. I have concerns, I really do.
It's quite a lot of cash to put up, but if you want Tesla-like acceleration at one-tenth of the cost... it does that.
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'15 Zero SR

dano

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2017, 11:40:08 PM »

Or buy a trusted used '15 for a lot less (ahem, I got mine for sale listed here and on eBay) ;)

If this were a ICE I wouldn't hesitate buying a two year old motorcycle. But it's my opinion with something as electronic as a Zero, the latest model would be the best bet. The dealerships can't/don't deal much on these bikes either.


« Last Edit: April 19, 2017, 11:44:05 PM by dano »
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Kocho

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Re: Zero SR 2017. New model startup issues or just my bike?
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2017, 01:39:21 AM »

In this particular case, the differences are very specific. Aside from the warranty, one has to decide for themselves if the new sturdier belt, more heat-resistant motor, and very slightly bigger battery are enough. For some that is enough, for others it will not be enough to offset the cost difference. From the postings here I tend to see similar kinds of issues on the '16 and '17 as we saw on the '15 (and that's not unexpected - they are very similar.

Or buy a trusted used '15 for a lot less (ahem, I got mine for sale listed here and on eBay) ;)

If this were a ICE I wouldn't hesitate buying a two year old motorcycle. But it's my opinion with something as electronic as a Zero, the latest model would be the best bet. The dealerships can't/don't deal much on these bikes either.
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'15 Zero SR
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