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Author Topic: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on  (Read 251 times)

NEW2elec

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Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« on: March 06, 2017, 08:43:37 PM »

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/lithium-ion-pioneer-introduces-battery-174641552.html

Take from it what you will but sounds good and comes from the guy who should know how to get this done.  We'll see.

(I beat you to the post Richard :) )
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Richard230

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2017, 09:41:15 PM »

It is great that all sorts of new battery designs have been developed over the past 10 years, or so.  But the real problem is who will take the chance and invest many millions, if not billions, of dollars to put one of these "super" batteries into production by building a huge manufacturing plant, marketing the product and convincing vehicle, or other product manufacturers, to purchase them and give them a try in their vehicles, etc.?  That is pretty risky for all parties concerned and Eon Musk seems to be the only really deep pockets around that is willing to take that kind of risk. Unfortunately, his pockets are filled up with his own batteries and there seems to be no more room for other designs in those pockets.   ;)

As I see it, battery designs are at a point now where there is a lot of enertia (sorry Brammo) and it is going to be really hard to bring any new battery technology into the consumer mass market.   ???
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2014 14.2 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

mrwilsn

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2017, 05:03:59 AM »

It is great that all sorts of new battery designs have been developed over the past 10 years, or so.  But the real problem is who will take the chance and invest many millions, if not billions, of dollars to put one of these "super" batteries into production by building a huge manufacturing plant, marketing the product and convincing vehicle, or other product manufacturers, to purchase them and give them a try in their vehicles, etc.?  That is pretty risky for all parties concerned and Eon Musk seems to be the only really deep pockets around that is willing to take that kind of risk. Unfortunately, his pockets are filled up with his own batteries and there seems to be no more room for other designs in those pockets.   ;)

As I see it, battery designs are at a point now where there is a lot of enertia (sorry Brammo) and it is going to be really hard to bring any new battery technology into the consumer mass market.   ???
Don't count out Richard Dyson. He is building a solid state battery factory in Michigan. It will still be several years before anything will be available commercially.

Also, Samsung, LG Chem, Panasonic and others are all heavily investing as we speak.

One thing to keep in mind any time you read an article like this....

If you are reading an article about some big battery advancement and the end doesn't tell you where to buy today then they are fishing for investors and a real product is a ways away.

Once investment starts everything goes dark until the day you read the article announcing where you can buy.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

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NEW2elec

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2017, 12:02:23 PM »

It also never talks about cycle life or voltage drop or durability you know those little things.
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ctrlburn

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2017, 05:50:51 PM »

Don't count out Richard Dyson. He is building a solid state battery factory in Michigan. It will still be several years before anything will be available commercially.

News just came across my feed.... 

more in the article...

https://qz.com/948041/dyson-sakti3-tesla-battery-patents/

Dyson, the UK appliance maker owned by billionaire James Dyson, has relinquished the core intellectual property of Sakti3, a hyper-secretive solid-state battery startup that it acquired for $90 million just 18 months ago as the first step in a plan to become a battery juggernaut.

The move—canceling its $200,000-a-year license for Sakti3’s patent portfolio from the University of Michigan, from which the startup was spun out—is stunning: When Dyson announced the deal in October 2015, much of the business press described it as potentially transformational, catapulting Dyson into the vanguard of the global race for long-lasting electronics and affordable electric cars. As though challenging industry trend-setter Tesla, Dyson would build a $1 billion battery factory, with Sakti3’s invention going initially into Dyson vacuum cleaners within two years. Leading up to the deal, founder Dyson said an initial $15 million investment in Sakti3 might one day be worth more than the entirety of his company at the time. (The value of privately held Dyson is not known, but Dyson himself is worth $4.2 billion, according to Forbes.)

Instead, that investment may be worth little more than the value of the equipment in Sakti3’s Ann Arbor, Michigan, laboratory.

...

Just after the acquisition, Quartz published an in-depth article detailing profound doubts in the lithium-ion research community about Sakti3. The article described Sastry’s intense secrecy, her failure to publicly or privately document her claims of enormous breakthroughs in her company’s solid-state battery work, and the belief by former senior Sakti3 executives that the company had achieved few tangible advances. The reason was simple—solid-state battery technology, while extremely promising, has enormous barriers, especially cost, and Sakti3, like everyone else who has tried, had failed to overcome them.
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Richard230

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2017, 08:21:30 PM »

With stories like this coming along every year or two it is amazing that any new battery technology can hit the consumer market since lithium batteries were introduced.  Oh, I almost forgot.  ;) I am still waiting for that new break-through battery tech to be mass produced and marketed for consumer products.  ::)

Stories like this are not doing anything for the EV and battery-powered industry as a whole.   :(
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2014 14.2 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

tigerbike

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2017, 07:01:13 PM »

If all that battery-investigations will not be on market soon, it might come to end as bridge-technology in electric vehicles.
Look at http://www.nanoflowcell.com  If that is working in produce-able scales, battery-driven EVs will be out of the race.
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Richard230

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2017, 07:56:06 PM »

If all that battery-investigations will not be on market soon, it might come to end as bridge-technology in electric vehicles.
Look at http://www.nanoflowcell.com  If that is working in produce-able scales, battery-driven EVs will be out of the race.


48 volts?  Zero should love those batteries.   ;)
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2014 14.2 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

tigerbike

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Re: Another "future" battery but from the inventor of Li-on
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2017, 08:46:47 PM »

If all that battery-investigations will not be on market soon, it might come to end as bridge-technology in electric vehicles.
Look at http://www.nanoflowcell.com  If that is working in produce-able scales, battery-driven EVs will be out of the race.


48 volts?  Zero should love those batteries.   ;)


They do not even use a battery or a super-capacitor, only flow-cells. They are able to control electronically the flow-cells, to get more or less energy out, just on demand.
Newest trial-run, with engineers of a not named asian car-producing company: 1000km in less than 9 hours on swiss highways ( speedlimit 120 kmh ~ 75 mph )
Gone to the end of "fuel": 1400km with 2 x 95 liters of "fuel" equals ~870 miles with 2 x 25,1 gallons.
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