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Author Topic: Any news?  (Read 1157 times)

Richard230

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2018, 11:29:58 PM »

Here is the latest.  Note the adjectives "premium" and "no compromises".  Considering it is H-D, that sure sounds expensive to me, which may get them some good press (the Livewire story made the CBS national news last night), but probably not all that many sales.

http://www.motorcycle.com/features/yes-the-harley-davidson-electric-motorcycle-is-on-the-way.html
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

Alan Stewart

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #16 on: February 02, 2018, 03:57:28 AM »

Yeah, I was thinking more like Energica prices rather than Zero prices, but I hope they do better than Energica in the battery capacity department. Though QC does help make up for less battery.
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Alan
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nevetsyad

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #17 on: February 02, 2018, 07:52:12 PM »

I believe Harley has been on record saying their electric offering will be in the 20-25K range. I'm hoping it will have a huge 20+ kWh battery, and CCS charging. A true touring e-bike finally!
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2015 Zero SR (4+ months in the shop), 2016 Zero S (Random freeway shutdown, heading to shop soon)

Richard230

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #18 on: February 02, 2018, 09:32:01 PM »

I believe Harley has been on record saying their electric offering will be in the 20-25K range. I'm hoping it will have a huge 20+ kWh battery, and CCS charging. A true touring e-bike finally!

I am not putting any money on that happening.  While you may be right about the price, my bet is that their EV will look nice, make a unique noise, be relatively quick, have a short range, get the press fawning and the "Faithful" screaming.  ;)
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

MrDude_1

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2018, 09:44:49 PM »

I believe Harley has been on record saying their electric offering will be in the 20-25K range. I'm hoping it will have a huge 20+ kWh battery, and CCS charging. A true touring e-bike finally!

if its laid out like the livewire, the space constrant alone would limit it to 10kwh or less... 10 being generous.
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Doug S

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #20 on: February 02, 2018, 10:09:02 PM »

Nope. They have their heads rammed so firmly up their own asses that they have no idea the trouble they're in.

You could certainly argue that position, there's a lot of reason to believe it's true.

But their shareholders don't. They see their stock losing value and they're not going to listen to management's crapola any longer. They just want the stock to go back up and they don't care what it takes. Why do you think HD has been introducing so many new models lately?
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There's no better alarm clock than sunlight on asphalt.

MrDude_1

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2018, 11:00:25 PM »

Nope. They have their heads rammed so firmly up their own asses that they have no idea the trouble they're in.

You could certainly argue that position, there's a lot of reason to believe it's true.

But their shareholders don't. They see their stock losing value and they're not going to listen to management's crapola any longer. They just want the stock to go back up and they don't care what it takes. Why do you think HD has been introducing so many new models lately?

Their new models highlights the problem.

They have spend tons on R&D to create that new engine design. Tons on engineering all new bikes...  but at the end of the day, they look identical to all their old bikes, and other than people that are already Harley fans, they are the same thing.
So nothings changed.  Their bikes still weigh a ton and handle like crap compared to the alternatives. They still cost too much, but most importantly, they still have an image problem. Very few people care to be associated with Harley anymore.  However if you attempt to make a product that doesnt match this image, the diehards work at the dealership... they wont change. and they wont sell it.
I WANT to be wrong. I want this to come out, be badass and affordable. I want to be able to go down to the local dealership thats only 5mins away and testride one... and buy it right there.
But Harley dealerships are untrustworthy with "non-harley" bikes. their dealerships suck. their people suck. their core business sucks. their bikes suck. overall they have no redeeming value to me and they hold back the entire american bike market. The USA needs to have a major bike brand that is not "cruisers" and that wont happen until Harley dies.
So unless the LiveWire is an amazing bike at an affordable price, I hope they choke on it.
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Richard230

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2018, 05:04:34 AM »

Nope. They have their heads rammed so firmly up their own asses that they have no idea the trouble they're in.

You could certainly argue that position, there's a lot of reason to believe it's true.

But their shareholders don't. They see their stock losing value and they're not going to listen to management's crapola any longer. They just want the stock to go back up and they don't care what it takes. Why do you think HD has been introducing so many new models lately?

I bet their shareholders aren't too happy today.  ;)
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

ESokoloff

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2018, 09:59:39 AM »

I believe Harley has been on record saying their electric offering will be in the 20-25K range. I'm hoping it will have a huge 20+ kWh battery, and CCS charging. A true touring e-bike finally!

if its laid out like the livewire, the space constrant alone would limit it to 10kwh or less... 10 being generous.

You can't think like that (present day battery energy density) as it's extremely propable that this & any EV of the future (1-2+ years out) will have next generation battery that will yeild  a 2-3 time increase of power storage density.
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Eric
2016 Zero DSR

Richard230

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2018, 09:02:36 PM »

I believe Harley has been on record saying their electric offering will be in the 20-25K range. I'm hoping it will have a huge 20+ kWh battery, and CCS charging. A true touring e-bike finally!

if its laid out like the livewire, the space constrant alone would limit it to 10kwh or less... 10 being generous.

You can't think like that (present day battery energy density) as it's extremely propable that this & any EV of the future (1-2+ years out) will have next generation battery that will yeild  a 2-3 time increase of power storage density.

I have been hearing about those new batteries for the past 10 years and I am still waiting for them to arrive.  ::) My guess is that you will see them first arrive in mobile consumer devices long before they show up in vehicles.
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.

ESokoloff

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #25 on: February 04, 2018, 09:13:51 AM »

I believe Harley has been on record saying their electric offering will be in the 20-25K range. I'm hoping it will have a huge 20+ kWh battery, and CCS charging. A true touring e-bike finally!

if its laid out like the livewire, the space constrant alone would limit it to 10kwh or less... 10 being generous.

You can't think like that (present day battery energy density) as it's extremely propable that this & any EV of the future (1-2+ years out) will have next generation battery that will yeild  a 2-3 time increase of power storage density.

I have been hearing about those new batteries for the past 10 years and I am still waiting for them to arrive.  ::) My guess is that you will see them first arrive in mobile consumer devices long before they show up in vehicles.

Go buy a drone......

https://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/read/a-new-lithium-metal-battery-takes-flight-in-drones


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Eric
2016 Zero DSR

MrDude_1

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #26 on: February 04, 2018, 09:38:56 AM »

I believe Harley has been on record saying their electric offering will be in the 20-25K range. I'm hoping it will have a huge 20+ kWh battery, and CCS charging. A true touring e-bike finally!

if its laid out like the livewire, the space constrant alone would limit it to 10kwh or less... 10 being generous.

You can't think like that (present day battery energy density) as it's extremely propable that this & any EV of the future (1-2+ years out) will have next generation battery that will yeild  a 2-3 time increase of power storage density.

Actually I can.
You see, YEARS before they will arrive in your mass produced warranted and insured vehicle, the component level product line needs to be up and running. I will know about that, simply because component level electronics is what I do...
When any production line of "solid state" lithium batteries start, I will be in on it asap. Both as an interested industry professional, and for personal investment. I am not knocking the potential, but I know its not here yet.

The closest we have right now is SolidEnergy Systems and I have some issues with them scaling up what they have to large production. Once they solve these issues... sure. But right now they're practically hand making batteries for niche markets, just like some other labs are. (although they are doing an excellent job selling themselves after this last VC round)
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Richard230

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Re: Any news?
« Reply #27 on: Today at 08:20:01 PM »

After trademarking the Revolution's name, H-D has now patented the new bike's noise:     ;D
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Richard's motorcycle collection:  2018 16.6 kWh Zero S, 2016 BMW R1200RS, 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500 Classic, 2009 BMW F650GS, 2005 Triumph T-100 Bonneville, 2002 Yamaha FZ1 (FZS1000N) and a 1978 Honda Kick 'N Go Senior.
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